theplatypus wrote:I just watched this. I really liked it. McAvoy and the main girl do great work. But I found the resolution to be really fucking limp and actually incongruous with the themes it was developing up to that point. Huge missed opportunity in that final confrontation.
Oh, also the very last bit was dumb. You know, the bit that was surely debated over whether it should be an after-credits scene or not. I wish that wasn't there.
What did you feel was incongruous, precisely? I'm still not exactly sure what the movie is saying by the end.
The movie explores the theme of abuse, right, the cycle and perpetuation and consequences thereof. We know that both of our main characters went through it, and that it informs their current state (McAvoy's personality disorder and the girl's acting out at school). It also establishes that the girl kind of freezes up and becomes passive when faced with another instance of abuse-- we see that in her actions towards McAvoy at the beginning and it recalls that instance with her uncle when she was young, with the shotgun. But the movie also does a very clever thing where, because of her knowledge and understanding of abuse, she kind of knows how to act around him and in some ways manipulate him-- the movie really drives this home by outright giving McAvoy 24 different personalities, some of which are very nice and accommodating, making him a pretty blatant metaphor for all abusers, right? Some of them can be very nice and very disarming, and this is what keep many of their victims from speaking out or leaving them or whatever. Once again, this recalls the incident with the uncle. So there's different faces to abusers. The girl understands, and uses it to navigate the situation, while the other two girls perish because of their inclination to fight back. They haven't gone through what the main girl's gone through, so they have no idea how to deal with it. The girl also gains knowledge of the fact that the different personalities can be physiologically different from each other (through that video of the diabetic personality talking about needing insulin shots). When McAvoy is the Beast, he is physically indestructible, and the girl understands this after shooting him twice. What I thought would be interesting is if, when cornered, the girl used her skills-- the skills the movie has shown us several times-- to manipulate him once more into shifting into another one of the more accommodating personalities. Let's say Hedwig, the kid. He'd be perfect for this, actually. When he's Hedwig, he's no longer indestructible, and he's also really nice. And also he's a fucking kid! Right? 9 years old? So now the girl is faced with the nicest of all of this abuser's personalities right in front of her, and she's got the shotgun, and she can either let herself freeze up like what happened with her uncle, or she can break through the cycle of manipulation and shoot him anyway. Even if he's being really nice right now. Even if he's acting like a little kid. She has identified him as the abuser and taken action, something she couldn't bring herself to do with her uncle. I thought that would've been perfect. Instead, we get a cop-out: she has scars on her belly, and the abuser just leaves her alone. Ehhh. Kind of weak, I thought. Sorry if this is rambling, I've stopped and started it several times because there are people coming in and out of my room. I should review it, but I'm gonna post it anyway. Here I go
Anders wrote:I do not have a «neoliberal assessment of geopolitics», so please stop writing that I do.
well said, man. It's been a few weeks, so you reminded me of a few things and I think you're spot on with the abuse angle and how it could have been resolved better.
theplatypus wrote:I just watched this. I really liked it. McAvoy and the main girl do great work. But I found the resolution to be really fucking limp and actually incongruous with the themes it was developing up to that point. Huge missed opportunity in that final confrontation.
Oh, also the very last bit was dumb. You know, the bit that was surely debated over whether it should be an after-credits scene or not. I wish that wasn't there.
What did you feel was incongruous, precisely? I'm still not exactly sure what the movie is saying by the end.
The movie explores the theme of abuse, right, the cycle and perpetuation and consequences thereof. We know that both of our main characters went through it, and that it informs their current state (McAvoy's personality disorder and the girl's acting out at school). It also establishes that the girl kind of freezes up and becomes passive when faced with another instance of abuse-- we see that in her actions towards McAvoy at the beginning and it recalls that instance with her uncle when she was young, with the shotgun. But the movie also does a very clever thing where, because of her knowledge and understanding of abuse, she kind of knows how to act around him and in some ways manipulate him-- the movie really drives this home by outright giving McAvoy 24 different personalities, some of which are very nice and accommodating, making him a pretty blatant metaphor for all abusers, right? Some of them can be very nice and very disarming, and this is what keep many of their victims from speaking out or leaving them or whatever. Once again, this recalls the incident with the uncle. So there's different faces to abusers. The girl understands, and uses it to navigate the situation, while the other two girls perish because of their inclination to fight back. They haven't gone through what the main girl's gone through, so they have no idea how to deal with it. The girl also gains knowledge of the fact that the different personalities can be physiologically different from each other (through that video of the diabetic personality talking about needing insulin shots). When McAvoy is the Beast, he is physically indestructible, and the girl understands this after shooting him twice. What I thought would be interesting is if, when cornered, the girl used her skills-- the skills the movie has shown us several times-- to manipulate him once more into shifting into another one of the more accommodating personalities. Let's say Hedwig, the kid. He'd be perfect for this, actually. When he's Hedwig, he's no longer indestructible, and he's also really nice. And also he's a fucking kid! Right? 9 years old? So now the girl is faced with the nicest of all of this abuser's personalities right in front of her, and she's got the shotgun, and she can either let herself freeze up like what happened with her uncle, or she can break through the cycle of manipulation and shoot him anyway. Even if he's being really nice right now. Even if he's acting like a little kid. She has identified him as the abuser and taken action, something she couldn't bring herself to do with her uncle. I thought that would've been perfect. Instead, we get a cop-out: she has scars on her belly, and the abuser just leaves her alone. Ehhh. Kind of weak, I thought. Sorry if this is rambling, I've stopped and started it several times because there are people coming in and out of my room. I should review it, but I'm gonna post it anyway. Here I go
Hmm. Well, I actually never viewed McAvoy as a metaphor for an abuser. I saw him as a personification of the protagonist's trauma itself. Her actual abuser is still alive and present in the narrative. I think the film explores her journey toward overcoming her trauma (McAvoy). This is why, at the end, she is literally trapped in a cage about to be destroyed by her trauma, and it's only when she reveals her wounds that the trauma begins to subside and she is able to escape. This strikes me as a metaphor for how trauma and therapy work; only by acknowledging your trauma and coming out with your experience does someone truly begin to become free. I think the movie is kind of sloppy and incoherent in the way it explores a lot of this, though, which hurts it. I think, say, Oculus and As Above/So Below are much more focused and sophisticated genre riffs on a similar theme.
I thought it was incredibly sad that the thing that saves her is pretty much her burden in her life. And he recognizes her as being of them..another broke soul. Thats why she is different for him. Also that final shot of her in the police car waiting for he abusive tutor..god, that was powerful.
OK, you guys can stop now. I appreciate all the effort and coordination that you all put into this prank. Good job, you all tricked argo into paying good money to go see an at-best-OK movie he should've trusted his own instincts on and waited for the DVD. haha, very funny, you got me.
Steve Albini wrote:Whenever there's active promotion on the part of somebody else, whenever I see somebody all dolled up for a fancy photograph and someone's handing out flyers or whenever there's active promotion for something like that, as an imposition on my day, I hate all those people and I want them to fail. I have a visceral reaction to advertising and promotion. There's just something about salesmanship that grates on me on a very base level and I react very negatively towards it. I want those people to suffer and I want their enterprises to fail.
Last edited by tragabigzanda on Sun January 11, 2026 10:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
Steve Albini wrote:Whenever there's active promotion on the part of somebody else, whenever I see somebody all dolled up for a fancy photograph and someone's handing out flyers or whenever there's active promotion for something like that, as an imposition on my day, I hate all those people and I want them to fail. I have a visceral reaction to advertising and promotion. There's just something about salesmanship that grates on me on a very base level and I react very negatively towards it. I want those people to suffer and I want their enterprises to fail.
Last edited by tragabigzanda on Sun January 11, 2026 9:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
Watched this last night - terrible. How do you take this concept and make such a boring film? McAvoy was ok, (his American accent was awful) but he didn't seem threatening or disturbing at all.
Kevin Smith just blurted out on a podcast that Bruce Willis had a cameo, so I knew he was in the diner at the end. I didn't see the Unbreakable connection at all which was the only kinda cool thing in this - but unfortunately it was ruined.
theplatypus wrote:I just watched this. I really liked it. McAvoy and the main girl do great work. But I found the resolution to be really fucking limp and actually incongruous with the themes it was developing up to that point. Huge missed opportunity in that final confrontation.
Oh, also the very last bit was dumb. You know, the bit that was surely debated over whether it should be an after-credits scene or not. I wish that wasn't there.
What did you feel was incongruous, precisely? I'm still not exactly sure what the movie is saying by the end.
The movie explores the theme of abuse, right, the cycle and perpetuation and consequences thereof. We know that both of our main characters went through it, and that it informs their current state (McAvoy's personality disorder and the girl's acting out at school). It also establishes that the girl kind of freezes up and becomes passive when faced with another instance of abuse-- we see that in her actions towards McAvoy at the beginning and it recalls that instance with her uncle when she was young, with the shotgun. But the movie also does a very clever thing where, because of her knowledge and understanding of abuse, she kind of knows how to act around him and in some ways manipulate him-- the movie really drives this home by outright giving McAvoy 24 different personalities, some of which are very nice and accommodating, making him a pretty blatant metaphor for all abusers, right? Some of them can be very nice and very disarming, and this is what keep many of their victims from speaking out or leaving them or whatever. Once again, this recalls the incident with the uncle. So there's different faces to abusers. The girl understands, and uses it to navigate the situation, while the other two girls perish because of their inclination to fight back. They haven't gone through what the main girl's gone through, so they have no idea how to deal with it. The girl also gains knowledge of the fact that the different personalities can be physiologically different from each other (through that video of the diabetic personality talking about needing insulin shots). When McAvoy is the Beast, he is physically indestructible, and the girl understands this after shooting him twice. What I thought would be interesting is if, when cornered, the girl used her skills-- the skills the movie has shown us several times-- to manipulate him once more into shifting into another one of the more accommodating personalities. Let's say Hedwig, the kid. He'd be perfect for this, actually. When he's Hedwig, he's no longer indestructible, and he's also really nice. And also he's a fucking kid! Right? 9 years old? So now the girl is faced with the nicest of all of this abuser's personalities right in front of her, and she's got the shotgun, and she can either let herself freeze up like what happened with her uncle, or she can break through the cycle of manipulation and shoot him anyway. Even if he's being really nice right now. Even if he's acting like a little kid. She has identified him as the abuser and taken action, something she couldn't bring herself to do with her uncle. I thought that would've been perfect. Instead, we get a cop-out: she has scars on her belly, and the abuser just leaves her alone. Ehhh. Kind of weak, I thought. Sorry if this is rambling, I've stopped and started it several times because there are people coming in and out of my room. I should review it, but I'm gonna post it anyway. Here I go
Hmm. Well, I actually never viewed McAvoy as a metaphor for an abuser. I saw him as a personification of the protagonist's trauma itself. Her actual abuser is still alive and present in the narrative. I think the film explores her journey toward overcoming her trauma (McAvoy). This is why, at the end, she is literally trapped in a cage about to be destroyed by her trauma, and it's only when she reveals her wounds that the trauma begins to subside and she is able to escape. This strikes me as a metaphor for how trauma and therapy work; only by acknowledging your trauma and coming out with your experience does someone truly begin to become free. I think the movie is kind of sloppy and incoherent in the way it explores a lot of this, though, which hurts it. I think, say, Oculus and As Above/So Below are much more focused and sophisticated genre riffs on a similar theme.
I think Jorge made some really great points about continuity in the narrative, but I think LV hits the nail on the head with the trauma metaphor. I kinda wish the two could combine
well said, man. It's been a few weeks, so you reminded me of a few things and I think you're spot on with the abuse angle and how it could have been resolved better.
