General Pearl Jam Bitching

[harmless]

I don't even think they're a real band anymore.

I heard that boom guy writes all the music and hired some dudes that vaguely look like the old pearl jam to go on tour with, after the real Eddie Vedder sold the rights to the name pearl jam for some really good Hawaiian weed.

No one told matt Cameron however, who thinks he's in the real pearl jam.

If this happened, this would happen. I do seriously wonder, though, whether they're actually in the studio together very often. Or whether they go to the studio to record their individual parts at different times, and then Brendan O'Brien makes 'magic' on everything they've recorded, in a dark room all by himself.

Honestly i don't think they ever were that kind of band and it shows.

Really? You think it's always shown? In what ways?

If judging by the music i think it shows in the diversity of styles or some may even call it inconsistency. You can also tell by the way they talk about their songwriting process. The closest to working together as a band must have been Vs. Didn't Jeff used to say something similar in interviews when s/t was released as in s/t was written as a band and it being the 1st time since s/t.
Anyway 10 was half done musically before eddie joined in so it starts right from the begining. Vs. was probably the closest to a band working in studio together, Vitalogy and No Code were the albums eddie wanted to make and 1/2 the band hated and after that it was a songwriting mess of random collections of songs. From Yield on it's pretty clear that the bulk of the songwritng is done prior to the band getting together in studio because the songs don't really give much cohesion to those albums. Riot Act may be an exception here but even than a lot is due to production.
It's also mirrored in this forums perception of their music especially with new songs when people guess who wrote the music. Another example of this is Binaural. It's been mentioned often here that while most think Binaural could have had a better tracklist with all the outtakes that have surfaced yet there will never be an agreement to what the best tracklist would be. I think the this diversity in appeal to their songs within the fanbase is a consequence of that. I mean if they ever worked together that much i think the diversity of opinions within the fanbase would be at least less pronounced.

These are all real possibilities. I suppose if there was evidence that this was a historical approach then there's no reason to think anything of it either way. We may get a good album, we may not, and it was always thus. It's not like I've been totally happy with every album from the outset, not even the first 7.

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

Yup. The late songs definitely need that spark that says they were necessary years later.

Interestingly how ITW worked in favour of that for ed. That album is a better listen start to finish than most of their albums.

Not sure about most of their albums, but certainly their later ones. I guess it's just pot luck whether this one will be consistent or not. I just find it kind of frustrating that I loved all 7 until S/T and now I get worried with every new one.

What's frustrating to me is that i know they're perfectly capable of doing better than this. It's like they're keeping it safe on purpose.

Yeah. I used to think they were being effortless on purpose (by which I mean not making any extra effort) and I still think that's true. But man, for a band that isn't working hard they sure put a lot into their live performance, even if that's just entertainment value. I don't really get it. However rusty they are live, they still seem passionate on stage. Is it fakery? I don't know.

[Mine]

I don't even think they're a real band anymore.

I heard that boom guy writes all the music and hired some dudes that vaguely look like the old pearl jam to go on tour with, after the real Eddie Vedder sold the rights to the name pearl jam for some really good Hawaiian weed.

No one told matt Cameron however, who thinks he's in the real pearl jam.

If this happened, this would happen. I do seriously wonder, though, whether they're actually in the studio together very often. Or whether they go to the studio to record their individual parts at different times, and then Brendan O'Brien makes 'magic' on everything they've recorded, in a dark room all by himself.

Honestly i don't think they ever were that kind of band and it shows.

Really? You think it's always shown? In what ways?

If judging by the music i think it shows in the diversity of styles or some may even call it inconsistency. You can also tell by the way they talk about their songwriting process. The closest to working together as a band must have been Vs. Didn't Jeff used to say something similar in interviews when s/t was released as in s/t was written as a band and it being the 1st time since s/t.
Anyway 10 was half done musically before eddie joined in so it starts right from the begining. Vs. was probably the closest to a band working in studio together, Vitalogy and No Code were the albums eddie wanted to make and 1/2 the band hated and after that it was a songwriting mess of random collections of songs. From Yield on it's pretty clear that the bulk of the songwritng is done prior to the band getting together in studio because the songs don't really give much cohesion to those albums. Riot Act may be an exception here but even than a lot is due to production.
It's also mirrored in this forums perception of their music especially with new songs when people guess who wrote the music. Another example of this is Binaural. It's been mentioned often here that while most think Binaural could have had a better tracklist with all the outtakes that have surfaced yet there will never be an agreement to what the best tracklist would be. I think the this diversity in appeal to their songs within the fanbase is a consequence of that. I mean if they ever worked together that much i think the diversity of opinions within the fanbase would be at least less pronounced.

These are all real possibilities. I suppose if there was evidence that this was a historical approach then there's no reason to think anything of it either way. We may get a good album, we may not, and it was always thus. It's not like I've been totally happy with every album from the outset, not even the first 7.

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

Yup. The late songs definitely need that spark that says they were necessary years later.

Interestingly how ITW worked in favour of that for ed. That album is a better listen start to finish than most of their albums.

Not sure about most of their albums, but certainly their later ones. I guess it's just pot luck whether this one will be consistent or not. I just find it kind of frustrating that I loved all 7 until S/T and now I get worried with every new one.

What's frustrating to me is that i know they're perfectly capable of doing better than this. It's like they're keeping it safe on purpose.

Yeah. I used to think they were being effortless on purpose (by which I mean not making any extra effort) and I still think that's true. But man, for a band that isn't working hard they sure put a lot into their live performance, even if that's just entertainment value. I don't really get it. However rusty they are live, they still seem passionate on stage. Is it fakery? I don't know.

No band is that idiotic to fake that by changing setlists on a nightly basis and those setlists aren't short to begin with.

[harmless]

I don't even think they're a real band anymore.

I heard that boom guy writes all the music and hired some dudes that vaguely look like the old pearl jam to go on tour with, after the real Eddie Vedder sold the rights to the name pearl jam for some really good Hawaiian weed.

No one told matt Cameron however, who thinks he's in the real pearl jam.

If this happened, this would happen. I do seriously wonder, though, whether they're actually in the studio together very often. Or whether they go to the studio to record their individual parts at different times, and then Brendan O'Brien makes 'magic' on everything they've recorded, in a dark room all by himself.

Honestly i don't think they ever were that kind of band and it shows.

Really? You think it's always shown? In what ways?

If judging by the music i think it shows in the diversity of styles or some may even call it inconsistency. You can also tell by the way they talk about their songwriting process. The closest to working together as a band must have been Vs. Didn't Jeff used to say something similar in interviews when s/t was released as in s/t was written as a band and it being the 1st time since s/t.
Anyway 10 was half done musically before eddie joined in so it starts right from the begining. Vs. was probably the closest to a band working in studio together, Vitalogy and No Code were the albums eddie wanted to make and 1/2 the band hated and after that it was a songwriting mess of random collections of songs. From Yield on it's pretty clear that the bulk of the songwritng is done prior to the band getting together in studio because the songs don't really give much cohesion to those albums. Riot Act may be an exception here but even than a lot is due to production.
It's also mirrored in this forums perception of their music especially with new songs when people guess who wrote the music. Another example of this is Binaural. It's been mentioned often here that while most think Binaural could have had a better tracklist with all the outtakes that have surfaced yet there will never be an agreement to what the best tracklist would be. I think the this diversity in appeal to their songs within the fanbase is a consequence of that. I mean if they ever worked together that much i think the diversity of opinions within the fanbase would be at least less pronounced.

These are all real possibilities. I suppose if there was evidence that this was a historical approach then there's no reason to think anything of it either way. We may get a good album, we may not, and it was always thus. It's not like I've been totally happy with every album from the outset, not even the first 7.

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

Yup. The late songs definitely need that spark that says they were necessary years later.

Interestingly how ITW worked in favour of that for ed. That album is a better listen start to finish than most of their albums.

Not sure about most of their albums, but certainly their later ones. I guess it's just pot luck whether this one will be consistent or not. I just find it kind of frustrating that I loved all 7 until S/T and now I get worried with every new one.

What's frustrating to me is that i know they're perfectly capable of doing better than this. It's like they're keeping it safe on purpose.

Yeah. I used to think they were being effortless on purpose (by which I mean not making any extra effort) and I still think that's true. But man, for a band that isn't working hard they sure put a lot into their live performance, even if that's just entertainment value. I don't really get it. However rusty they are live, they still seem passionate on stage. Is it fakery? I don't know.

No band is that idiotic to fake that by changing setlists on a nightly basis and those setlists aren't short to begin with.

This is true.

[harmless]

I'm listening to Lost Dogs CD1 and remembering how much I used to adore this band. They just need one album to bring me back on board. Just one, that's all I ask.

[Lament]

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

That's a really good insight. I can definitely get on board with this.

[stip]

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

That's a really good insight. I can definitely get on board with this.

I need one more album to buy into this, and it's not because of my feelings towards backspacer and S/t. Both backspacer and S/T are, to me, albums clearly inspired by design. One an immediate punch in the face loud response to a subdued riot act, and one a lighter, unburdened record to put an end to the story being told on the 3 prior (Binaural, Riot Act, and S/T are probably three of the more demanding listens in the catalog, in their way. And I think those intentions were clear. What follows from a pallete cleanser like Backspacer will say something about the direction they want to move in now.

[harmless]

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

That's a really good insight. I can definitely get on board with this.

I need one more album to buy into this, and it's not because of my feelings towards backspacer and S/t. Both backspacer and S/T are, to me, albums clearly inspired by design. One an immediate punch in the face loud response to a subdued riot act, and one a lighter, unburdened record to put an end to the story being told on the 3 prior (Binaural, Riot Act, and S/T are probably three of the more demanding listens in the catalog, in their way. And I think those intentions were clear. What follows from a pallete cleanser like Backspacer will say something about the direction they want to move in now.

I'd like to buy this. I hope you're right.

[LetMeSleep]

Basically, I could do with being more excited for Lightning Bolt but I don't think I could be any more curious about it and that's still frustrating.

I feel this too. But unlike you Harmless I am not that thrilled with the 3 tracks we've heard so far. And certainly not a 3.5*. Maybe out of ten.

[Mine]

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

That's a really good insight. I can definitely get on board with this.

I need one more album to buy into this, and it's not because of my feelings towards backspacer and S/t. Both backspacer and S/T are, to me, albums clearly inspired by design. One an immediate punch in the face loud response to a subdued riot act, and one a lighter, unburdened record to put an end to the story being told on the 3 prior (Binaural, Riot Act, and S/T are probably three of the more demanding listens in the catalog, in their way. And I think those intentions were clear. What follows from a pallete cleanser like Backspacer will say something about the direction they want to move in now.

I suspect you put more thinking in the last 2 albums than the band did - all of them combined. I don't think there was any intent to write those albums in any specific way. I think it'a all a matter of production. A good chunk of s/t is no punch at least it wasn't before compression and limiting and Backspacer isn't that light. My impression is that most of the sound of the last 2 records actually happened late in the process, Backspacer especially.

[harmless]

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

That's a really good insight. I can definitely get on board with this.

I need one more album to buy into this, and it's not because of my feelings towards backspacer and S/t. Both backspacer and S/T are, to me, albums clearly inspired by design. One an immediate punch in the face loud response to a subdued riot act, and one a lighter, unburdened record to put an end to the story being told on the 3 prior (Binaural, Riot Act, and S/T are probably three of the more demanding listens in the catalog, in their way. And I think those intentions were clear. What follows from a pallete cleanser like Backspacer will say something about the direction they want to move in now.

I suspect you put more thinking in the last 2 albums than the band did - all of them combined. I don't think there was any intent to write those albums in any specific way. I think it'a all a matter of production. A good chunk of s/t is no punch at least it wasn't before compression and limiting and Backspacer isn't that light. My impression is that most of the sound of the last 2 records actually happened late in the process, Backspacer especially.

Sheesh, it's a scary thought / real possibility that the 'New Wave' shtick was something that was imposed on the songs afterwards, in production. Especially if it was influenced by 'conversations with O'Brien'.

[harmless]

Basically, I could do with being more excited for Lightning Bolt but I don't think I could be any more curious about it and that's still frustrating.

I feel this too. But unlike you Harmless I am not that thrilled with the 3 tracks we've heard so far. And certainly not a 3.5*. Maybe out of ten.

I have diminished expectations. But the 3.5 is not set against the old catalogue. The 3.5 is solely based on the potential of enjoyment at this point. I know we don't have the PJ we used to.

[harmless]

Oh, and... my 3.5 is based on the songs being better than Backspacer, and the fact that the tone of the stuff we've had so far seems a little more Pearl Jam. Basically, this album will be rated higher than Backspacer just for having nothing as bad as Supersonic on it.

[Mine]

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

That's a really good insight. I can definitely get on board with this.

I need one more album to buy into this, and it's not because of my feelings towards backspacer and S/t. Both backspacer and S/T are, to me, albums clearly inspired by design. One an immediate punch in the face loud response to a subdued riot act, and one a lighter, unburdened record to put an end to the story being told on the 3 prior (Binaural, Riot Act, and S/T are probably three of the more demanding listens in the catalog, in their way. And I think those intentions were clear. What follows from a pallete cleanser like Backspacer will say something about the direction they want to move in now.

I suspect you put more thinking in the last 2 albums than the band did - all of them combined. I don't think there was any intent to write those albums in any specific way. I think it'a all a matter of production. A good chunk of s/t is no punch at least it wasn't before compression and limiting and Backspacer isn't that light. My impression is that most of the sound of the last 2 records actually happened late in the process, Backspacer especially.

Sheesh, it's a scary thought / real possibility that the 'New Wave' shtick was something that was imposed on the songs afterwards, in production. Especially if it was influenced by 'conversations with O'Brien'.

The thing is except Fixer, Supersonic and Just Breath the rest of BS don't sound to me as songs written with the intent to be particularly lighter than anything they did before. I also don't think that Inside Job, Gone, Marker in the sand, Come Back, Parachutes are songs that are meant to be particularly punchy or immediate for that matter. Now that i think about it most of them could be interchanged between the 2 albums with fitting production.

[LetMeSleep]

I'm excited for LB as I hope that the 3 most immediate tracks have been heard and that the remaining 9 tracks will have a depth not seen/heard for nearly a decade.

But it appears to me that the band aren't willing/prepared to go to the places I want them to. I can't see a SoH, NAIS or You Are sitting next to LB or MYM.

[harmless]

I'm excited for LB as I hope that the 3 most immediate tracks have been heard and that the remaining 9 tracks will have a depth not seen/heard for nearly a decade.

But it appears to me that the band aren't willing/prepared to go to the places I want them to. I can't see a SoH, NAIS or You Are sitting next to LB or MYM.

The instrumental music on the tour vid, and the murky soundchecked song, could be any of those. But will they be? In terms of what kind of songs could sit next to one another, any are likely considering we have MYM on the same album as FD.

[harmless]

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

That's a really good insight. I can definitely get on board with this.

I need one more album to buy into this, and it's not because of my feelings towards backspacer and S/t. Both backspacer and S/T are, to me, albums clearly inspired by design. One an immediate punch in the face loud response to a subdued riot act, and one a lighter, unburdened record to put an end to the story being told on the 3 prior (Binaural, Riot Act, and S/T are probably three of the more demanding listens in the catalog, in their way. And I think those intentions were clear. What follows from a pallete cleanser like Backspacer will say something about the direction they want to move in now.

I suspect you put more thinking in the last 2 albums than the band did - all of them combined. I don't think there was any intent to write those albums in any specific way. I think it'a all a matter of production. A good chunk of s/t is no punch at least it wasn't before compression and limiting and Backspacer isn't that light. My impression is that most of the sound of the last 2 records actually happened late in the process, Backspacer especially.

Sheesh, it's a scary thought / real possibility that the 'New Wave' shtick was something that was imposed on the songs afterwards, in production. Especially if it was influenced by 'conversations with O'Brien'.

The thing is except Fixer, Supersonic and Just Breath the rest of BS don't sound to me as songs written with the intent to be particularly lighter than anything they did before. I also don't think that Inside Job, Gone, Marker in the sand, Come Back, Parachutes are songs that are meant to be particularly punchy or immediate for that matter. Now that i think about it most of them could be interchanged between the 2 albums with fitting production.

I agree. I almost think that if every song from Backspacer had been as 'light' as The Fixer, we'd find the 'pop experiment' argument more convincing. There's nothing New Wave about ATW or UK.

[Heathen]

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

That's a really good insight. I can definitely get on board with this.

I need one more album to buy into this, and it's not because of my feelings towards backspacer and S/t. Both backspacer and S/T are, to me, albums clearly inspired by design. One an immediate punch in the face loud response to a subdued riot act, and one a lighter, unburdened record to put an end to the story being told on the 3 prior (Binaural, Riot Act, and S/T are probably three of the more demanding listens in the catalog, in their way. And I think those intentions were clear. What follows from a pallete cleanser like Backspacer will say something about the direction they want to move in now.

I'd like to buy this. I hope you're right.

I don't buy it. Nor do I buy that stip could buy that thing he said he doesn't buy yet.

[harmless]

They seem to be relying more on their acquired skills then actual inspiration this days. This is why i think this songs sound appealing at 1st but don't age well.

That's a really good insight. I can definitely get on board with this.

I need one more album to buy into this, and it's not because of my feelings towards backspacer and S/t. Both backspacer and S/T are, to me, albums clearly inspired by design. One an immediate punch in the face loud response to a subdued riot act, and one a lighter, unburdened record to put an end to the story being told on the 3 prior (Binaural, Riot Act, and S/T are probably three of the more demanding listens in the catalog, in their way. And I think those intentions were clear. What follows from a pallete cleanser like Backspacer will say something about the direction they want to move in now.

I'd like to buy this. I hope you're right.

I don't buy it. Nor do I buy that stip could buy that thing he said he doesn't buy yet.

[broken iris]

I'm excited for LB as I hope that the 3 most immediate tracks have been heard and that the remaining 9 tracks will have a depth not seen/heard for nearly a decade.

But it appears to me that the band aren't willing/prepared to go to the places I want them to. I can't see a SoH, NAIS or You Are sitting next to LB or MYM.

The instrumental music on the tour vid, and the murky soundchecked song, could be any of those. But will they be? In terms of what kind of songs could sit next to one another, any are likely considering we have MYM on the same album as FD.

Thank you for not resorting to standard RM "I only ever listen to PJ so I can justify still posting here" judgement.

[harmless]

I'm excited for LB as I hope that the 3 most immediate tracks have been heard and that the remaining 9 tracks will have a depth not seen/heard for nearly a decade.

But it appears to me that the band aren't willing/prepared to go to the places I want them to. I can't see a SoH, NAIS or You Are sitting next to LB or MYM.

The instrumental music on the tour vid, and the murky soundchecked song, could be any of those. But will they be? In terms of what kind of songs could sit next to one another, any are likely considering we have MYM on the same album as FD.

Thank you for not resorting to standard RM "I only ever listen to PJ so I can justify still posting here" judgement.

I wouldn't listen to PJ to justify posting here, I'd just post here.