HBO: Game of Thrones (Song of Ice and Fire)

[Monkey_Driven]

I just finished re-watching season 2. The final scene is the dead army marching through the snow. Sam hides behind a rock, and one of the dead generals looks him right in the eyes.

Why did they march right past Sam without killing him?

Plot armor.

[Mecca]

I just finished re-watching season 2. The final scene is the dead army marching through the snow. Sam hides behind a rock, and one of the dead generals looks him right in the eyes.

Why did they march right past Sam without killing him?

hes so pale that they thought he was already dead

[bada]

Today, The Wrap reports that a scientist at Boston-based company DataRobot has crafted an algorithm which has crunched the numbers and predicted the most likely candidates to die in the upcoming eighth and final season.

Looking at approximately 2,000 detailed profiles of characters taken from A Wiki of Ice and Fire, the results are as follows:

Daenerys Targaryen – 83.77% chance of death
Jaime Lannister – 72.91% chance of death
Tyrion Lannister – 70.76% chance of death
Bran Stark – 66.02% chance of death
Cersei Lannister – 60.39% chance of death
Jon Snow – 58.99% chance of death
Euron Greyjoy – 54.95% chance of death
Sansa Stark – 50.28% chance of death
Arya Stark – 49.04% chance of death
Gendry – 39.87% chance of death

We’ll know just how right the modelling and algorithm is when “Game of Thrones” returns to HBO in early 2019.

[Anders]

Rewatching this, for my third time, and the first time for my girlfriend. Midway through the third season, and I'm fully convinced that this is the best show of all time.

[epilogue]

Rewatching this, for my third time, and the first time for my girlfriend. Midway through the third season, and I'm fully convinced that this is the best show of all time.

That's a big claim. I don't have a problem with it being in the conversation, that's for sure.

[Norah]

Rewatching this, for my third time, and the first time for my girlfriend. Midway through the third season, and I'm fully convinced that this is the best show of all time.

That's a big claim. I don't have a problem with it being in the conversation, that's for sure.

It's an easy claim to make when you're in season 3.

[Monkey_Driven]

Rewatching this, for my third time, and the first time for my girlfriend. Midway through the third season, and I'm fully convinced that this is the best show of all time.

That's a big claim. I don't have a problem with it being in the conversation, that's for sure.

It's an easy claim to make when you're in season 3.

I was just thinking the same thing. The writing has been way to inconsistent to be in my top 5 shows of all time, but the series highs are tough to beat.

[Anders]

Every other candidate I can think of has been flawed as well (Sopranos, The Wire, Breaking Bad, Babylon 5). The genius of GOT lies somewhere between the genius of GRRM, the ability of HBO and the showrunners to get it done in such a beautiful way, and near perfect casting. The biggest negative is GRRM never finishing the books, and the show having to do it all alone. That has meant a few fun but easily criticised episodes in the past two seasons.

[Norah]

As you all know, I think the drop off in quality is much more pronounced than that. After Tywin's death it gets pretty dumb. Which is a shame because AFFC and ADWD are really, really good.

[Monkey_Driven]

Every other candidate I can think of has been flawed as well (Sopranos, The Wire, Breaking Bad, Babylon 5). The genius of GOT lies somewhere between the genius of GRRM, the ability of HBO and the showrunners to get it done in such a beautiful way, and near perfect casting. The biggest negative is GRRM never finishing the books, and the show having to do it all alone. That has meant a few fun but easily criticised episodes in the past two seasons.

None of those shows had a season even remotely as nonsensical as the last season of GoT.

[Anders]

Every other candidate I can think of has been flawed as well (Sopranos, The Wire, Breaking Bad, Babylon 5). The genius of GOT lies somewhere between the genius of GRRM, the ability of HBO and the showrunners to get it done in such a beautiful way, and near perfect casting. The biggest negative is GRRM never finishing the books, and the show having to do it all alone. That has meant a few fun but easily criticised episodes in the past two seasons.

None of those shows had a season even remotely as nonsensical as the last season of GoT.

Season 5 of B5 was pretty bad, and that was my favorite show until GOT. Breaking Bad is fantastic at its best, it gets on my podium. But to me it has too many boring episodes, unlike any of the other shows listed. The Wire and The Sopranos are probably the least flawed of the shows listed. Yet, neither reaches as high as the first three. The lows are enjoyable, but the heights just aren't fulfilling enough.

Hardhome, Battle Of The Bastards, Rains Of Castamere, The Winds Of Winter, Blackwater. None of The Sopranos-episodes are at that level.

I think the last season of GOT was enjoyable, even if it is the season og GOT that varies most in writing quality.

[Norah]

When Bran says "Robert's Rebellion was fought on a lie" I want to throw my TV out the window.

[Monkey_Driven]

Every other candidate I can think of has been flawed as well (Sopranos, The Wire, Breaking Bad, Babylon 5). The genius of GOT lies somewhere between the genius of GRRM, the ability of HBO and the showrunners to get it done in such a beautiful way, and near perfect casting. The biggest negative is GRRM never finishing the books, and the show having to do it all alone. That has meant a few fun but easily criticised episodes in the past two seasons.

None of those shows had a season even remotely as nonsensical as the last season of GoT.

Season 5 of B5 was pretty bad, and that was my favorite show until GOT. Breaking Bad is fantastic at its best, it gets on my podium. But to me it has too many boring episodes, unlike any of the other shows listed. The Wire and The Sopranos are probably the least flawed of the shows listed. Yet, neither reaches as high as the first three. The lows are enjoyable, but the heights just aren't fulfilling enough.

Hardhome, Battle Of The Bastards, Rains Of Castamere, The Winds Of Winter, Blackwater. None of The Sopranos-episodes are at that level.

I think the last season of GOT was enjoyable, even if it is the season og GOT that varies most in writing quality.

I've never seen Babylon 5 because I'm not a nerd.

[Anders]

When Bran says "Robert's Rebellion was fought on a lie" I want to throw my TV out the window.

Not sure what part of it you like least (production, execution, writing, story), but there is some truth to the statement. The Mad King did kill Ned's father and brother, and more. However, there is no doubt that Robert had it all wrong about Lyanna.

[Anders]

Every other candidate I can think of has been flawed as well (Sopranos, The Wire, Breaking Bad, Babylon 5). The genius of GOT lies somewhere between the genius of GRRM, the ability of HBO and the showrunners to get it done in such a beautiful way, and near perfect casting. The biggest negative is GRRM never finishing the books, and the show having to do it all alone. That has meant a few fun but easily criticised episodes in the past two seasons.

None of those shows had a season even remotely as nonsensical as the last season of GoT.

Season 5 of B5 was pretty bad, and that was my favorite show until GOT. Breaking Bad is fantastic at its best, it gets on my podium. But to me it has too many boring episodes, unlike any of the other shows listed. The Wire and The Sopranos are probably the least flawed of the shows listed. Yet, neither reaches as high as the first three. The lows are enjoyable, but the heights just aren't fulfilling enough.

Hardhome, Battle Of The Bastards, Rains Of Castamere, The Winds Of Winter, Blackwater. None of The Sopranos-episodes are at that level.

I think the last season of GOT was enjoyable, even if it is the season og GOT that varies most in writing quality.

I've never seen Babylon 5 because I'm not a nerd.

What? B5 was revolutionary. Without B5, no tv as we know it today. It was the GOT of its time. If not in raw popularity, then in writing and acting,

[Norah]

When Bran says "Robert's Rebellion was fought on a lie" I want to throw my TV out the window.

Not sure what part of it you like least (production, execution, writing, story), but there is some truth to the statement. The Mad King did kill Ned's father and brother, and more. However, there is no doubt that Robert had it all wrong about Lyanna.

The statement that Bran makes supposes that the rebellion was fought because Robert believed Rhaegar kidnapped and raped Lyanna. The statement also implies that the rebellion was therefor unjustified, because it was fought on a lie.

Both of those things are a bunch of BS.

Robert's Rebellion, or more accurately, Jon Arryn's rebellion, was started when the Mad Kind killed Brandon Stark (which was justified because it was over Brandon threatening the crown prince and heir to the iron throne), and then killing Rickard Stark and the 200 men he rode south with (completely unjustified) and then demanded the heads of Ned Stark and Robert Baratheon from their foster Jon Arryn.

The abduction of Lyanna was barely relevant to the starting of the rebellion at all. When the heads of Ned and Robert were demanded by a murderous, tyrannical mad king, that is when Jon Arryn said fuck this, these are my wards and their safety is my responsibility and instead of giving them to you I'm calling my banners and rising in rebellion. And this action was 100% morally justified IMO, and founded in truth.

If you want to claim Lyanna's abduction was the cause the only way that might have a thread of truth to it is because that "abduction" was the reason Brandon Stark called out Rhaegar in the first place. But Brandon wasn't rebelling against the crown, he didn't want to dethrone a dynasty, he just wanted to challenge the guy who stole his sister. The rebellion came later, for a very specific and different cause.

It's just another example of the show simplifying things to the point of stupidity.

[Monkey_Driven]

When Bran says "Robert's Rebellion was fought on a lie" I want to throw my TV out the window.

Not sure what part of it you like least (production, execution, writing, story), but there is some truth to the statement. The Mad King did kill Ned's father and brother, and more. However, there is no doubt that Robert had it all wrong about Lyanna.

The statement that Bran makes supposes that the rebellion was fought because Robert believed Rhaegar kidnapped and raped Lyanna. The statement also implies that the rebellion was therefor unjustified, because it was fought on a lie.

Both of those things are a bunch of BS.

Robert's Rebellion, or more accurately, Jon Arryn's rebellion, was started when the Mad Kind killed Brandon Stark (which was justified because it was over Brandon threatening the crown prince and heir to the iron throne), and then killing Rickard Stark and the 200 men he rode south with (completely unjustified) and then demanded the heads of Ned Stark and Robert Baratheon from their foster Jon Arryn.

The abduction of Lyanna was barely relevant to the starting of the rebellion at all. When the heads of Ned and Robert were demanded by a murderous, tyrannical mad king, that is when Jon Arryn said fuck this, these are my wards and their safety is my responsibility and instead of giving them to you I'm calling my banners and rising in rebellion. And this action was 100% morally justified IMO, and founded in truth.

If you want to claim Lyanna's abduction was the cause the only way that might have a thread of truth to it is because that "abduction" was the reason Brandon Stark called out Rhaegar in the first place. But Brandon wasn't rebelling against the crown, he didn't want to dethrone a dynasty, he just wanted to challenge the guy who stole his sister. The rebellion came later, for a very specific and different cause.

It's just another example of the show simplifying things to the point of stupidity.

Heart

[Anders]

When Bran says "Robert's Rebellion was fought on a lie" I want to throw my TV out the window.

Not sure what part of it you like least (production, execution, writing, story), but there is some truth to the statement. The Mad King did kill Ned's father and brother, and more. However, there is no doubt that Robert had it all wrong about Lyanna.

The statement that Bran makes supposes that the rebellion was fought because Robert believed Rhaegar kidnapped and raped Lyanna. The statement also implies that the rebellion was therefor unjustified, because it was fought on a lie.

Both of those things are a bunch of BS.

Robert's Rebellion, or more accurately, Jon Arryn's rebellion, was started when the Mad King killed Brandon Stark (which was justified because it was over Brandon threatening the crown prince and heir to the iron throne), and then killing Rickard Stark and the 200 men he rode south with (completely unjustified) and then demanded the heads of Ned Stark and Robert Baratheon from their foster Jon Arryn.

The abduction of Lyanna was barely relevant to the starting of the rebellion at all. When the heads of Ned and Robert were demanded by a murderous, tyrannical mad king, that is when Jon Arryn said fuck this, these are my wards and their safety is my responsibility and instead of giving them to you I'm calling my banners and rising in rebellion. And this action was 100% morally justified IMO, and founded in truth.

If you want to claim Lyanna's abduction was the cause the only way that might have a thread of truth to it is because that "abduction" was the reason Brandon Stark called out Rhaegar in the first place. But Brandon wasn't rebelling against the crown, he didn't want to dethrone a dynasty, he just wanted to challenge the guy who stole his sister. The rebellion came later, for a very specific and different cause.

It's just another example of the show simplifying things to the point of stupidity.

It is called Robert's Rebellion, and the starting point of it all was Lyanna being abducted, which she never was. Of course it would never have evolved into a war if the king wasn't mad. With the king being mad, war might have broken out for another reason at some point anyway. Still Brandon's statement, while simple, is not wrong.

Spoiler: show

Rickard negotiated the betrothals of Brandon and Lyanna to Catelyn Tully of Riverrun and Robert Baratheon of Storm's End, respectively. According to Barbrey Dustin the southron marriages were the idea of Rickard's maester at the time, Walys.

Before any of the marriages could take place, however, Lyanna disappeared near Harrenhal in early 282 AC. Brandon held responsible Prince Rhaegar Targaryen, Aerys's eldest son and the heir to the Iron Throne, and went with a small company of young nobles to King's Landing to challenge Rhaegar. Aerys had them all imprisoned on charges of conspiring to kill the crown prince and summoned their fathers to answer for the crimes of their sons. The nobles and their sons were executed by Aerys, with the exception of Ethan Glover.

As was his right, Lord Rickard demanded a trial by combat, expecting to fight a Kingsguard. Aerys granted Rickard's request but to the Mad King, House Targaryen's champion was fire. Protected by Ser Gerold Hightower and Ser Jaime Lannister of the Kingsguard, Aerys had Rickard suspended in the throne room of the Red Keep. Rossart and another pyromancer lit a fire beneath Rickard while he was dressed in his steel armor. Brandon, with a Tyroshi noose around his neck and a sword just out of his reach, was made to watch his father roast. Trying to reach the sword to save his dying father, Brandon strangled himself.

Next, Aerys demanded Lord Jon Arryn to send him the heads of Lord Robert Baratheon of Storm's End, Lyanna's betrothed, and Eddard Stark, now the Lord of Winterfell after the deaths of his father and older brother. Robert and Eddard were in the Eyrie, however, and Jon Arryn refused to oblige. Instead, he raised his banners in revolt. This act is seen as the start of the war, which would last "close to a year".

[jwfocker]

When Bran says "Robert's Rebellion was fought on a lie" I want to throw my TV out the window.

Not sure what part of it you like least (production, execution, writing, story), but there is some truth to the statement. The Mad King did kill Ned's father and brother, and more. However, there is no doubt that Robert had it all wrong about Lyanna.

The statement that Bran makes supposes that the rebellion was fought because Robert believed Rhaegar kidnapped and raped Lyanna. The statement also implies that the rebellion was therefor unjustified, because it was fought on a lie.

Both of those things are a bunch of BS.

Robert's Rebellion, or more accurately, Jon Arryn's rebellion, was started when the Mad King killed Brandon Stark (which was justified because it was over Brandon threatening the crown prince and heir to the iron throne), and then killing Rickard Stark and the 200 men he rode south with (completely unjustified) and then demanded the heads of Ned Stark and Robert Baratheon from their foster Jon Arryn.

The abduction of Lyanna was barely relevant to the starting of the rebellion at all. When the heads of Ned and Robert were demanded by a murderous, tyrannical mad king, that is when Jon Arryn said fuck this, these are my wards and their safety is my responsibility and instead of giving them to you I'm calling my banners and rising in rebellion. And this action was 100% morally justified IMO, and founded in truth.

If you want to claim Lyanna's abduction was the cause the only way that might have a thread of truth to it is because that "abduction" was the reason Brandon Stark called out Rhaegar in the first place. But Brandon wasn't rebelling against the crown, he didn't want to dethrone a dynasty, he just wanted to challenge the guy who stole his sister. The rebellion came later, for a very specific and different cause.

It's just another example of the show simplifying things to the point of stupidity.

It is called Robert's Rebellion, and the starting point of it all was Lyanna being abducted, which she never was. Of course it would never have evolved into a war if the king wasn't mad. With the king being mad, war might have broken out for another reason at some point anyway. Still Brandon's statement, while simple, is not wrong.

Spoiler: show

Rickard negotiated the betrothals of Brandon and Lyanna to Catelyn Tully of Riverrun and Robert Baratheon of Storm's End, respectively. According to Barbrey Dustin the southron marriages were the idea of Rickard's maester at the time, Walys.

Before any of the marriages could take place, however, Lyanna disappeared near Harrenhal in early 282 AC. Brandon held responsible Prince Rhaegar Targaryen, Aerys's eldest son and the heir to the Iron Throne, and went with a small company of young nobles to King's Landing to challenge Rhaegar. Aerys had them all imprisoned on charges of conspiring to kill the crown prince and summoned their fathers to answer for the crimes of their sons. The nobles and their sons were executed by Aerys, with the exception of Ethan Glover.

As was his right, Lord Rickard demanded a trial by combat, expecting to fight a Kingsguard. Aerys granted Rickard's request but to the Mad King, House Targaryen's champion was fire. Protected by Ser Gerold Hightower and Ser Jaime Lannister of the Kingsguard, Aerys had Rickard suspended in the throne room of the Red Keep. Rossart and another pyromancer lit a fire beneath Rickard while he was dressed in his steel armor. Brandon, with a Tyroshi noose around his neck and a sword just out of his reach, was made to watch his father roast. Trying to reach the sword to save his dying father, Brandon strangled himself.

Next, Aerys demanded Lord Jon Arryn to send him the heads of Lord Robert Baratheon of Storm's End, Lyanna's betrothed, and Eddard Stark, now the Lord of Winterfell after the deaths of his father and older brother. Robert and Eddard were in the Eyrie, however, and Jon Arryn refused to oblige. Instead, he raised his banners in revolt. This act is seen as the start of the war, which would last "close to a year".

[jwfocker]

The 'Robert's rebellion was built on a lie' will always cause a good bit of arguments.