2012 NFL Playoffs

[Electromatic]

I've come around a bit on the Falcons, but I still think Seattle should have won that game. What soured me on them a bit were the losses to Carolina and Tampa Bay at the end of the season and the fact that they only narrowly beat some pretty bad teams, plus their lack of pass rush which pops up at inopportune times. Their passing game is obviously very potent and I like their linebackers and secondary a lot. You have to remember that prior to this playoff win they had basically folded like a tent in the postseason three straight times. People don't forget that.

And the Manning thing is so stupid. Football is a team sport. Manning can't play safety. If Matt Bryant misses that FG at the end of Falcons-Seahawks, is that Matt Ryan's fault? Of course not. The fact that amazing players like Marino are basically dismissed because they didn't win a ring just shows you how stupid that argument is. A QB is one out of 22 positions and they can only control what they can control. Joe Flacco and Mark Sanchez have awesome playoff records, so I guess that makes them better than Manning and Marino.

What about Jim Kelly and the K gun? That was an amazing team, they just didn't quite get it done at the end. I still think of them as pretty great.

I think the last 2 years have shown that Joe Flacco plays his sharpest in these moments. He hit his guy in the chest last year in the AFC championship game, it was just dropped. There were plenty of times Manning did all that was possible "the idiot kicker" just blew it for him.

That said, Manning is not as good as he is in the regular season in the playoffs, that's been his entire life even at Tennessee. He's obviously a lot more precise than a guy like Brett Farve, but we can't ignore that they both have a tendency to throw bad interceptions in the playoffs and Farve caught more flak for it becuase mostly we like Peyton Manning. Obviously Peyton plays the position unlike many if any other QB in history, but I think it can be said that his brother has better overall moments. (David Tyree, Mario Manningham)

It's just odd to me that Marino didn't go to more Superbowls. When I think of Marino the only real memory I have is the fake spike against the Jets.

I didn't live through it like I have with Falcons teams but the Dolphins must have had some personnel issues on defense.

In the last decade though, we have been blessed with watching some amazing QB play. Manning vs Farve in Indianapolis years ago was Playstation stuff, and I feel like Manning vs Brady in the playoffs has been sort of a decade long thing too that rarely disappointed.

[4/5]

I didn't live through it like I have with Falcons teams but the Dolphins must have had some personnel issues on defense.

You could say that. No defense, no running game. Marino was propping up average to bad teams and getting them into the playoffs where they'd perennially be exposed.

[epilogue]

I've come around a bit on the Falcons, but I still think Seattle should have won that game. What soured me on them a bit were the losses to Carolina and Tampa Bay at the end of the season and the fact that they only narrowly beat some pretty bad teams, plus their lack of pass rush which pops up at inopportune times. Their passing game is obviously very potent and I like their linebackers and secondary a lot. You have to remember that prior to this playoff win they had basically folded like a tent in the postseason three straight times. People don't forget that.

And the Manning thing is so stupid. Football is a team sport. Manning can't play safety. If Matt Bryant misses that FG at the end of Falcons-Seahawks, is that Matt Ryan's fault? Of course not. The fact that amazing players like Marino are basically dismissed because they didn't win a ring just shows you how stupid that argument is. A QB is one out of 22 positions and they can only control what they can control. Joe Flacco and Mark Sanchez have awesome playoff records, so I guess that makes them better than Manning and Marino.

I agree. Up to a point.

Let's not forget that Manning had 3 turnovers in the game. Even if we put the first INT on the receiver and chalk the fumble up to a fluke or a bad call by the refs, that still doesn't change the terrible pass and poor decision making that caused the final (and most important) turn over.

And we've seen it from Manning before. We don't have to look any further than his second SB appearance.

I think Manning is probably the best offensive mind I've ever seen play football. He's also probably the best regular season QB to play the game. But Manning has a tough time in the post season. I'm not going to call him a choker, necessarily. Because, you're right, it's a team game and not all the mistakes are his. Hell, if Fox doesn't get so uber conservative at the end of the game this is all probably moot.

And I love the passion, the desire to win at all costs that made Manning throw that ball in 2OT. He's a great QB. He's a hall of famer, absolutely. But, at some point, we have to hold him accountable for the mistakes he's made, the record he has, the stats he's accumulated in post season play.

Just like Marino - though a brilliant QB - shouldn't be ranked above Montana. I'm starting to wonder if I've been wrong all these years. And maybe Manning - though brilliant - shouldn't be ranked above Brady.

[EJ]

Its very tough to rank all the great QB's. I mean, Terry Bradshaw won 4 SBs. I certainly would'nt put him anywhere near the top of the list of all time great QBs.

Personally, I always thought Dan Marino was the best and would probably do well in any era. As 4/5 mentioned, he elevated some pretty questionable teams to the playoffs on a regular basis: consistently lacked a running game and decent defenses.

[epilogue]

Its very tough to rank all the great QB's. I mean, Terry Bradshaw won 4 SBs. I certainly would'nt put him anywhere near the top of the list of all time great QBs.

Personally, I always thought Dan Marino was the best and would probably do well in any era. As 4/5 mentioned, he elevated some pretty questionable teams to the playoffs on a regular basis: consistently lacked a running game and decent defenses.

It's a tricky argument, for sure. I guess, it comes down to how highly you value championships. Peyton is going to the hall of fame. And he absolutely should. He's one of the smartest, accurate, dedicated and exciting players to watch. Especially in regular season play.

I never saw Marino play. I can't compare what he did in the post season to what I've seen Manning do. For me, if there is a down side to Peyton Manning, it's that he isn't clutch. He doesn't elevate his play when it mattes the most, in the post season. Was the same true of Marino? Regardless of the players surrounding him, did Marino get better, elevate himself, and do everything in his power to make as few mistakes a possible and put his team in a position to win?

[Biff Pocoroba]

I'm a life long Falcons fan. I know SF has the better roster up & down and if they played Atlanta 10 times they'd probably win seven. I just hope one of those three losses is Sunday. Funny things happen sometimes to visiting teams here.
One thing is certain, the Dome will be rocking like an SEC title game but only with everyone in the building pulling for one team. Atlanta has a reputation of being a passive sports town. It won't be Sunday.

[epilogue]

I'm a life long Falcons fan. I know SF has the better roster up & down and if they played Atlanta 10 times they'd probably win seven. I just hope one of those three losses is Sunday. Funny things happen sometimes to visiting teams here.
One thing is certain, the Dome will be rocking like an SEC title game but only with everyone in the building pulling for one team. Atlanta has a reputation of being a passive sports town. It won't be Sunday.

If you guys can find a way to contain Kaepernick, you have more than a fair change. But if he goes off again like he did against GB, I have no idea who can beat them.

[Green Habit]

It's a tricky argument, for sure. I guess, it comes down to how highly you value championships. Peyton is going to the hall of fame. And he absolutely should. He's one of the smartest, accurate, dedicated and exciting players to watch. Especially in regular season play.

I never saw Marino play. I can't compare what he did in the post season to what I've seen Manning do. For me, if there is a down side to Peyton Manning, it's that he isn't clutch. He doesn't elevate his play when it mattes the most, in the post season. Was the same true of Marino? Regardless of the players surrounding him, did Marino get better, elevate himself, and do everything in his power to make as few mistakes a possible and put his team in a position to win?

The truth is that even the greatest teams can stumble in the playoffs. Ask Patriots fans about the 2007 team. The Broncos were a great team this year that just couldn't collectively seal the deal when it counted. We could find plenty more examples.

[epilogue]

It's a tricky argument, for sure. I guess, it comes down to how highly you value championships. Peyton is going to the hall of fame. And he absolutely should. He's one of the smartest, accurate, dedicated and exciting players to watch. Especially in regular season play.

I never saw Marino play. I can't compare what he did in the post season to what I've seen Manning do. For me, if there is a down side to Peyton Manning, it's that he isn't clutch. He doesn't elevate his play when it mattes the most, in the post season. Was the same true of Marino? Regardless of the players surrounding him, did Marino get better, elevate himself, and do everything in his power to make as few mistakes a possible and put his team in a position to win?

The truth is that even the greatest teams can stumble in the playoffs. Ask Patriots fans about the 2007 team. The Broncos were a great team this year that just couldn't collectively seal the deal when it counted. We could find plenty more examples.

Of course. Montana leading the Chiefs to the AFC Title game in 94. It happens.

And this isn't a knock on Denver, but Manning seems to fall short more often than his legend should allow. He doesn't elevate his game in the post season. He's amazing in the regular season, no question. He does more to win games than to lose them in those 17 weeks. So, what happens to him in the playoffs? Why does he struggle so consistently?

[Green Habit]

And this isn't a knock on Denver, but Manning seems to fall short more often than his legend should allow. He doesn't elevate his game in the post season. He's amazing in the regular season, no question. He does more to win games than to lose them in those 17 weeks. So, what happens to him in the playoffs? Why does he struggle so consistently?

In the early days, I'd say that it's because the Colts' defense usually sucked, and that Bill Belichick really figured him out at that time. And I don't think he played horrible this year. The pick six was totally unlucky, and even his OT INT didn't guarantee the game for the Ravens. The only game I don't have an explanation for is the 2008 loss against the Chargers. I refused to watch that game because I was so angry that it wasn't the Broncos playing them instead.

[4/5]

And we've seen it from Manning before. We don't have to look any further than his second SB appearance.

I would beg you to watch that game again and see if you still stand by this.

You can call the following excuses if you want, but each of the following are all true:

On the first drive of the game on 3rd down Pierre Garcon drops a TD pass; Colts settle for a FG.

In the 2nd quarter up 10-3 Manning hits Garcon in stride wide open on 3rd down: drop. The pass was about 20-25 yards if he caught it and fell down. Based on where the DBs were it looked like Garcon very well could have taken it 70 yards to the house. Instead: punt.

Colts run three times at the end of the first half and let the Saints steal 3 points at the end of the half.

Saints open the 2nd half with an onside kick, likely due in no small part to the fact that they saw the first half and couldn't let Manning go up 17-6.

Colts miss a 50 yard FG.

Reggie Wayne slipped on his cut on the pick-six.

Reggie Wayne dropped a td in the last two minutes when the Colts were trying an unlikely comeback, down 14 with about one minute left.

[4/5]

And this isn't a knock on Denver, but Manning seems to fall short more often than his legend should allow. He doesn't elevate his game in the post season. He's amazing in the regular season, no question. He does more to win games than to lose them in those 17 weeks. So, what happens to him in the playoffs? Why does he struggle so consistently?

In the early days, I'd say that it's because the Colts' defense usually sucked, and that Bill Belichick really figured him out at that time. And I don't think he played horrible this year. The pick six was totally unlucky, and even his OT INT didn't guarantee the game for the Ravens. The only game I don't have an explanation for is the 2008 loss against the Chargers. I refused to watch that game because I was so angry that it wasn't the Broncos playing them instead.

The pick in OT was brutal. I LOVE Manning and think that 99.9% of the noise against him is completely insane and will defend him forever, but that play was indefensible.

[Green Habit]

Colts run three times at the end of the first half and let the Saints steal 3 points at the end of the half.

I remember cheering for that field goal so badly because it won me the 2nd quarter pool on the big board of squares.

[Green Habit]

And this isn't a knock on Denver, but Manning seems to fall short more often than his legend should allow. He doesn't elevate his game in the post season. He's amazing in the regular season, no question. He does more to win games than to lose them in those 17 weeks. So, what happens to him in the playoffs? Why does he struggle so consistently?

In the early days, I'd say that it's because the Colts' defense usually sucked, and that Bill Belichick really figured him out at that time. And I don't think he played horrible this year. The pick six was totally unlucky, and even his OT INT didn't guarantee the game for the Ravens. The only game I don't have an explanation for is the 2008 loss against the Chargers. I refused to watch that game because I was so angry that it wasn't the Broncos playing them instead.

The pick in OT was brutal. I LOVE Manning and think that 99.9% of the noise against him is completely insane and will defend him forever, but that play was indefensible.

He would have loved to have that throw back, but I've seen him complete the whole right-to-left verboten QB throw before this year.

Regardless of how brutal that INT was, it was microscopic compared to Rahim Moore's epic fuckup.

[epilogue]

Regardless of how brutal that INT was, it was microscopic compared to Rahim Moore's epic fuckup.

Absolutely true.

[epilogue]

And we've seen it from Manning before. We don't have to look any further than his second SB appearance.

I would beg you to watch that game again and see if you still stand by this.

You can call the following excuses if you want, but each of the following are all true:

On the first drive of the game on 3rd down Pierre Garcon drops a TD pass; Colts settle for a FG.

In the 2nd quarter up 10-3 Manning hits Garcon in stride wide open on 3rd down: drop. The pass was about 20-25 yards if he caught it and fell down. Based on where the DBs were it looked like Garcon very well could have taken it 70 yards to the house. Instead: punt.

Colts run three times at the end of the first half and let the Saints steal 3 points at the end of the half.

Saints open the 2nd half with an onside kick, likely due in no small part to the fact that they saw the first half and couldn't let Manning go up 17-6.

Colts miss a 50 yard FG.

Reggie Wayne slipped on his cut on the pick-six.

Reggie Wayne dropped a td in the last two minutes when the Colts were trying an unlikely comeback, down 14 with about one minute left.

As has been said, it's a team game. Manning isn't winning nor is he losing these things all by himself. I'm simply talking about that final pick to end the SB. Again, I admire Peyton's tenacity, his desire to win. But that was a poor decision. He shouldn't have made that throw.

Does that negate all the times in his career that he's made the perfect read, the absolutely right decision? Of course not. Just unfortunate mistakes.

Looking at Brady's and Manning's postseason stats, I see that, on paper, they're damn near the same QB. So maybe I'm falling victim to some of the unnecessary criticism that I've argued against for years.

And Brady has certainly had the superior coach and (I'd argue) the superior team, most of his career.

Believe me, Peyton Manning was my favorite player since Joe Montana. I've defended him time and time again. I won't lie when I say his going to the Broncos pissed me off. I was super bummed to see my favorite player sign with an arch rival. Maybe I'm letting that cloud my mind.

Just watching him this year, seeing the losing post season record, seeing the poor decision making. I finally started to wonder if maybe the nay-sayers didn't have some valid points.

[BurtReynolds]

Matt Cassel keeps me from fully believing Brady is the best.

[epilogue]

Matt Cassel keeps me from fully believing Brady is the best.

You just had to do it, didn't you...

[EJ]

Matt Cassel is no Elvis Grbac, that's for sure.

[epilogue]

And Elvis Grbac is just a poor man's Todd Blackledge.