Star Wars: Episode VIII: The Last Jedi

[stip]

AND he chose that episode to relaunch his Star Wars series. He either really misstepped or is pitching for that other audience who don’t like Star Wars anymore.

I think his thinking about and discussions about TLJ inspired him to return to the series. There's a lot that he likes about the movie. I just think the more he thought about the elements he liked, the more he wanted to discuss those elements on their own and dive deeper into them as sort of stand-alone topics (like the nature of the Force moving forward, etc). It's not like he just takes a massive shit all over the movie.

We'll see where he takes this, but my hope is that we'll get more depth of conversation and discussion as the series progresses and a dialogue can happen between him and his followers.

that was my read as well. If he approaches this topically he might have an easier time discussing TLJ in that context.

[epilogue]

AND he chose that episode to relaunch his Star Wars series. He either really misstepped or is pitching for that other audience who don’t like Star Wars anymore.

I think his thinking about and discussions about TLJ inspired him to return to the series. There's a lot that he likes about the movie. I just think the more he thought about the elements he liked, the more he wanted to discuss those elements on their own and dive deeper into them as sort of stand-alone topics (like the nature of the Force moving forward, etc). It's not like he just takes a massive shit all over the movie.

We'll see where he takes this, but my hope is that we'll get more depth of conversation and discussion as the series progresses and a dialogue can happen between him and his followers.

that was my read as well. If he approaches this topically he might have an easier time discussing TLJ in that context.

That's my thinking/hope as well. And I look forward to that. If he doesn't deliver, then we'll have a problem and I'll probably have to stop listening. Because I'm just not interested in the service take he's provided. His Star Wars discussions up until this one have been far more rewarding, even Rogue One, which I thought suffered from similar short-comings.

[BootsToAsses]

A friend and I watched this again for the first time in about a month, and damn this is definitely my favourite Star Wars film. It is official. It has the most beautiful shots in all of the franchise, I ADORE the Rey/Ben exchanges, I love the Yoda scene, Luke's death scene, the silent explosion when Holdo sacrifices herself.

I love that it's so brazen in wanting to expand the universe and what is possible within it. The throne room scene might be my favourite Star Wars stuff ever, and the conversation after the fight just hammers home what this film was aiming to do.

"Let the past die... kill it if you have to. It's the only way to become what you are meant to be."

"It’s time to let old things die. Snoke, Skywalker. The Sith, the Jedi. The rebels. Let it all die."

The way Ben gets really angry and delivers, "No, no, you’re still holding on!" is like the film talking to the crazy fanboys/girls who are so resistant to any kind of challenge/change in the franchise.

Yeah, I know everything I just said has been discussed ad nauseum but I really love this movie.

[Monkey_Driven]

A friend and I watched this again for the first time in about a month, and damn this is definitely my favourite Star Wars film. It is official. It has the most beautiful shots in all of the franchise, I ADORE the Rey/Ben exchanges, I love the Yoda scene, Luke's death scene, the silent explosion when Holdo sacrifices herself.

I love that it's so brazen in wanting to expand the universe and what is possible within it. The throne room scene might be my favourite Star Wars stuff ever, and the conversation after the fight just hammers home what this film was aiming to do.

"Let the past die... kill it if you have to. It's the only way to become what you are meant to be."

"It’s time to let old things die. Snoke, Skywalker. The Sith, the Jedi. The rebels. Let it all die."

The way Ben gets really angry and delivers, "No, no, you’re still holding on!" is like the film talking to the crazy fanboys/girls who are so resistant to any kind of challenge/change in the franchise.

Yeah, I know everything I just said has been discussed ad nauseum but I really love this movie.

I feel similarly.

[dimejinky99]

A friend and I watched this again for the first time in about a month, and damn this is definitely my favourite Star Wars film. It is official. It has the most beautiful shots in all of the franchise, I ADORE the Rey/Ben exchanges, I love the Yoda scene, Luke's death scene, the silent explosion when Holdo sacrifices herself.

I love that it's so brazen in wanting to expand the universe and what is possible within it. The throne room scene might be my favourite Star Wars stuff ever, and the conversation after the fight just hammers home what this film was aiming to do.

"Let the past die... kill it if you have to. It's the only way to become what you are meant to be."

"It’s time to let old things die. Snoke, Skywalker. The Sith, the Jedi. The rebels. Let it all die."

The way Ben gets really angry and delivers, "No, no, you’re still holding on!" is like the film talking to the crazy fanboys/girls who are so resistant to any kind of challenge/change in the franchise.

Yeah, I know everything I just said has been discussed ad nauseum but I really love this movie.

Well said. For all the reasons you named I think we’re gonna see people on time say this is the best one of all. Just watch.

[stip]

A friend and I watched this again for the first time in about a month, and damn this is definitely my favourite Star Wars film. It is official. It has the most beautiful shots in all of the franchise, I ADORE the Rey/Ben exchanges, I love the Yoda scene, Luke's death scene, the silent explosion when Holdo sacrifices herself.

I love that it's so brazen in wanting to expand the universe and what is possible within it. The throne room scene might be my favourite Star Wars stuff ever, and the conversation after the fight just hammers home what this film was aiming to do.

"Let the past die... kill it if you have to. It's the only way to become what you are meant to be."

"It’s time to let old things die. Snoke, Skywalker. The Sith, the Jedi. The rebels. Let it all die."

The way Ben gets really angry and delivers, "No, no, you’re still holding on!" is like the film talking to the crazy fanboys/girls who are so resistant to any kind of challenge/change in the franchise.

Yeah, I know everything I just said has been discussed ad nauseum but I really love this movie.

What’s so great about that sequence is how Ben is giving this empassioned plea to start over, and yet his only idea is to reproduce the dreams of his grandfather. He is so lost and so trapped and so helpless

[stip]

This movie is so much smarter than a Star Wars movie has any right to be

[dimejinky99]

I don’t know that he’s lost. He’s sorta spinning. It’s a weird moment. He’s just taken out his mentor (and tormentor?) I don’t think he has any grand ideas other than having the hots for Rey and presuming to offer her a share of rule of the galaxy. I doubt it’s something he’s even fantasised about. They have a lot of work to do to keep him interesting and as compelling in 9. If he’s just all out one dimensional evil leader it’ll be boring. If he’s obsessed with finding Rey to kill her or convert her it could be good.

[BootsToAsses]

That's what's great about how Ben has been written so far. Killing Snoke is a BIG thing for him to do, but then all he can think of is essentially take his place but with Rey at his side as co-ruler. Thus, history is doomed to repeat itself.

I'm thinking/hoping that Luke got through to Rey a little and that she has slightly bigger ambitions in what she wants to happen. Is it merely a hope of achieving balance? Is it a Batman/Joker thing where they eventually realise that they both need each other to survive. Two sides of the same coin. But what does that mean in terms of the big picture? Will everyone still be constantly at war?

I also hope they avoid any romance stuff, because the next film really doesn't need it.

[epilogue]

X 2 on the romance stuff.

[bune]

That's what's great about how Ben has been written so far. Killing Snoke is a BIG thing for him to do, but then all he can think of is essentially take his place but with Rey at his side as co-ruler. Thus, history is doomed to repeat itself.

I'm thinking/hoping that Luke got through to Rey a little and that she has slightly bigger ambitions in what she wants to happen. Is it merely a hope of achieving balance? Is it a Batman/Joker thing where they eventually realise that they both need each other to survive. Two sides of the same coin. But what does that mean in terms of the big picture? Will everyone still be constantly at war?

I also hope they avoid any romance stuff, because the next film really doesn't need it.

Yeah, especially with the scene later with Hux:

General Hux: Finish this? Who do you think you're talking to? You presumed to command my army. Our Supreme Leader is dead! We have no ruler!

Kylo Ren: [Force chokes Hux] The Supreme Leader is dead!

General Hux: [Choking] Long live the Supreme Leader.

So clichéd but it's all he can think to do.

[B]

Nice comparison of TLJ and Infinity War. I don't necessarily agree that TLJ needed to show characters we know doing the things we wanted them to do, but it does explain the difference in reception.

[stip]

that's an interesting video, but I think the motivations of the characters in TLJ, while complicated, are clear and present in the text

[blueviper]

Finally got TLJ from the library and watched it last night. I still feel the same about it. It’s not very good, imo.

Durdencommatyler said this in the SOLO thread, and I think it applies to TLJ:

Also, the Story and Star Wars podcast about this was excellent. I don't 100% agree with his take, but I loved his insights, especially those regarding different eras of film and filmmaking/style in the movie. That was really great insight.

Not about the podcast, but about the OT and ST being from different eras of film and filmmaking style. While I believe the story and writing is weak in TLJ, I also think on the other hand it’s just a different style that throws it off for me as well.

Weird comedic moments, dull subplots, callbacks (winks for the audience?) to let us know they are referring to the previous movies (To be fair, TFA has its fair share of these too), and dialogue that sounds like its from bargain bin B movies make this one of the weaker SW movies.

TFA and TLJ have a few moments that show there is a good SW sequel trilogy storyline in there somewhere, but it’s not executed well.

[dimejinky99]

It’s just pure over your head. No big deal. You don’t have to like everything. Hamill wasn’t a fan either until he saw it. He’s not still going on about it though. I’m kinda done with this film. But for mostly different reasons than yours. This one won’t truly land and be appreciated for what it is until we get episode 9. I been saying that a couple of years and I Stand by it.

[LoathedVermin72]

blueviper not liking it doesn't mean it went "over [his] head." Ugh. Please stop with this tired, condescending rhetoric.

[blueviper]

It’s just pure over your head. No big deal. You don’t have to like everything. Hamill wasn’t a fan either until he saw it. He’s not still going on about it though. I’m kinda done with this film. But for mostly different reasons than yours. This one won’t truly land and be appreciated for what it is until we get episode 9. I been saying that a couple of years and I Stand by it.

LOL. OK. If that’s what you want to think, that’s fine.

[E.H. Ruddock]

It can't be both "it's over your head" and "you don't have to like everything". Which is it? Because I didn't like it either, dime. But don't come at me with "it's over my head" because that would be laughable.

[dimejinky99]

That came out arse about face. Sorry. Not to suggest you missed something. Rather you just weren’t into it. Thats all. I don’t do internet smart arse. Not about Star Wars.

[Sgt. Crackpot]

OM MY GOD DIME. DID YOU JUST SAY RUDDO IS TOO DUMB FOR STAR WARS?!