Lightning Bolt: the official album thread

[harmless]

Also, I wish he was Boom. I wish Boom could play keys on records and I wish Boom could learn to produce records so that they could fire BO'B and bring Boom on board.

^This thread has officially jumped the shark.

That's a statement without context or qualification. I guess you don't want to engage my actual arguments?

[Jorge]

People think Pearl Jam are in an abusive relationship with Brendan O'Brien, and he's manipulating, coercing, stifling them and preventing them from leaving. Really, he's more of a sugar daddy than anything else.

He is a producer, arranger, co-writer and co-instrumentalist of PJ's work at the moment.

You just described a producer.

[Django Butterworth]

Be glad to.

Please tell me what they are, besides "I don't like S/T or Backspacer and this guy made some comments in a interview.".

I'd also like to know which of the songs on their albums he co-wrote. And how he is different from any other producer.

[harmless]

People think Pearl Jam are in an abusive relationship with Brendan O'Brien, and he's manipulating, coercing, stifling them and preventing them from leaving. Really, he's more of a sugar daddy than anything else.

He is a producer, arranger, co-writer and co-instrumentalist of PJ's work at the moment.

You just described a producer.

Really? I mean *really*, or are you just saying that because there are some producers who are like this?

[Jorge]

And how he is different from any other producer.

For one, he seems to be doing a lot more interviews. More than the band, even.

[Norah]

The B'OB argument gets a bit tired for me...if he is the reason why they 'suck' now he is also the sole reason why they were great from Vs to Yield.....

Nice logic there.

[Jorge]

He is a producer, arranger, co-writer and co-instrumentalist of PJ's work at the moment.

You just described a producer.

Really? I mean *really*, or are you just saying that because there are some producers who are like this?

REALLY

I reckon a great majority of major-label producers are like this, and a big chunk of the indie ones too.

[harmless]

Be glad to.

Please tell me what they are, besides "I don't like S/T or Backspacer and this guy made some comments in a interview.".

I'd also like to know which of the songs on their albums he co-wrote. And how he is different from any other producer.

I've been reading this stuff for 4 years, and everything I've read from him and about him, his vision for the band and their music, has turned me off him. During Backspacer, he rearranged 'Just Breathe', changing a bridge to a chorus which appeared three times (I think), making the song "commercial" and neutered. He played an awfully-fitting piano part over Unthought Known, spoiling it for me. And he put what amounts to a space opera orchestra over Speed of Sound. The End is a song I thought he arranged and produced quite tastefully, even with the orchestra included, but its merits are rather clouded by the sugar-dusting all over the album in general.

[keeponjammin89]

Lol what are you all complaining about im so confused. Every album there is numerous songs I like BO'B is fine with me. You cant jusy blame everything on him they are the ones with the instruments in hand im sure they do what they want. The whole band would probably find this page ridiculous. BO'Bs just been doing his job as a producer if you dont like it stop listening. Noones making you listen to them. Ill diss shitty music all day I love to, but Pearl Jam is far from shitty music.

[LetMeSleep]

He is a producer, arranger, co-writer and co-instrumentalist of PJ's work at the moment.

You just described a producer.

Really? I mean *really*, or are you just saying that because there are some producers who are like this?

REALLY

I reckon a great majority of major-label producers are like this, and a big chunk of the indie ones too.

Yeah I agree Jorge. But also, BoB doing these listening parties is far more than most producers do. It's baffling. Why is he the main spokesman so far for LB? He must be working solely on points.

[harmless]

And how he is different from any other producer.

For one, he seems to be doing a lot more interviews. More than the band, even.

Main issue -- right now, here, in this thread -- is this.

He sounds like an arrogant pro-tool and I wish he'd stop sounding like George Lucas, genius overseer of the newer Star Wars trilogy. I want to hear that the band give a shit, in all honesty.

[harmless]

He is a producer, arranger, co-writer and co-instrumentalist of PJ's work at the moment.

You just described a producer.

Really? I mean *really*, or are you just saying that because there are some producers who are like this?

REALLY

I reckon a great majority of major-label producers are like this, and a big chunk of the indie ones too.

Yeah I agree Jorge. But also, BoB doing these listening parties is far more than most producers do. It's baffling. Why is he the main spokesman so far for LB? He must be working solely on points.

This is obviously just a logical extension of a normal producer's work. They're probably all like this... /sarcasm.

[stupidmop]

I don't think he is an evil manipulating puppet master forcing PJ to make shitty music, I do however think he's a dick.

People keep talking about him cause he keeps popping up and there's nothing else to talk about.

[harmless]

Lol what are you all complaining about im so confused. Every album there is numerous songs I like BO'B is fine with me. You cant jusy blame everything on him they are the ones with the instruments in hand im sure they do what they want. The whole band would probably find this page ridiculous. BO'Bs just been doing his job as a producer if you dont like it stop listening. Noones making you listen to them. Ill diss shitty music all day I love to, but Pearl Jam is far from shitty music.

They're also far from the best they can be. It's not all BO'B's fault, obviously, but he's not exempt from blame either.

[harmless]

I don't think he is an evil manipulating puppet master forcing PJ to make shitty music, I do however think he's a dick.

People keep talking about him cause he keeps popping up and there's nothing else to talk about.

[McParadigm]

He is a producer, arranger, co-writer and co-instrumentalist of PJ's work at the moment.

You just described a producer.

Really? I mean *really*, or are you just saying that because there are some producers who are like this?

REALLY

I reckon a great majority of major-label producers are like this, and a big chunk of the indie ones too.

Co-writing isn't common outside of the poppiest of pop formats (and country, if that's still it's own genre). It's normal for arrangements to get tweaked or have additional parts added on to them by a producer of songwriters/bands...but not to the point where the producer is one of the primary actors in designing a song (as Brendan indicated he was on Backspacer).

[harmless]

This post over at the Pit made quite a bit of sense for me, if I was to try and be more positive:

"I said it before and will say it again: I think that the role of the producer is way overblown here. He is hired by the band, especially an independent band (where there is no record company involved) and not the other way around. He may be cocky or this or that, but all he can do is advice the band, give suggestions; it is the band that decides. He may push a bit, but the end decision is with Pearl Jam and Co.

That said, the more I read about SBM (and I leave the whole controversy on the side a bit) the more I get the feeling that this decision has more to do with the flow of the album than anything else. It seems that Pendelum is a dark song, Yellow Moon is a dark song, right in the middle is Let The Records Play that is considered to be fun. It may well be that they choose to rework SBM, and give it a different twist, to go from a fast "happy" (for the lack of better wording) to a slow "happy" song before they dive into the abyss again. (And it also give some notice to a song, as BoB indicates, that may not have had the airplay or the notice it deserves.) What I read is that the band version of SBM doesn't have the lonliness that the Uke version has, but more the acceptance (and even irony?) of "Sleeping by Yourself". In this way it reminds me of the two versions of You out there. The b-side that is a more happy note on a relationship and the so-called "negative" version (Lost Dogs), where the "You", and even the pronounciation of "you", in the song itself, is more about shifting blame. These are subtle differences and it shows, and I applaud the band for this, how you can change the meaning of the song not by changing the wording, but by using different emphasis of the same wording.

In short: I make a decision when I hear it.

I remember when Binaural, RA and ST came out that everyone was not happy with the "new" producers and how excited everyone was when BoB was back on board. This has shifted dramatically. BS may have it faults, but to put RA, ST on a pedestal, well, that is the other end of the extreme.

Ps: I read the article again, after reading all the comments - which I recommend everyone to do - and I do think that his comments here are taken out of context and proportion. I think what he is saying, is that when PJ wants a specific sound, they come to him. That is not miraclious (sp?) really. Producers are known for a specific sound. So I take everything with a grain of salt."

[Mine]

Be glad to.

Please tell me what they are, besides "I don't like S/T or Backspacer and this guy made some comments in a interview.".

I'd also like to know which of the songs on their albums he co-wrote. And how he is different from any other producer.

I've been reading this stuff for 4 years, and everything I've read from him and about him, his vision for the band and their music, has turned me off him. During Backspacer, he rearranged 'Just Breathe', changing a bridge to a chorus which appeared three times (I think), making the song "commercial" and neutered. He played an awfully-fitting piano part over Unthought Known, spoiling it for me. And he put what amounts to a space opera orchestra over Speed of Sound. The End is a song I thought he arranged and produced quite tastefully, even with the orchestra included, but its merits are rather clouded by the sugar-dusting all over the album in general.

I think the orchestral arrangement of The End is credited to somebody else though.

[harmless]

Be glad to.

Please tell me what they are, besides "I don't like S/T or Backspacer and this guy made some comments in a interview.".

I'd also like to know which of the songs on their albums he co-wrote. And how he is different from any other producer.

I've been reading this stuff for 4 years, and everything I've read from him and about him, his vision for the band and their music, has turned me off him. During Backspacer, he rearranged 'Just Breathe', changing a bridge to a chorus which appeared three times (I think), making the song "commercial" and neutered. He played an awfully-fitting piano part over Unthought Known, spoiling it for me. And he put what amounts to a space opera orchestra over Speed of Sound. The End is a song I thought he arranged and produced quite tastefully, even with the orchestra included, but its merits are rather clouded by the sugar-dusting all over the album in general.

I think the orchestral arrangement of The End is credited to somebody else though.

Interesting. Maybe that's why I prefer it... who knows.

[Mine]

Be glad to.

Please tell me what they are, besides "I don't like S/T or Backspacer and this guy made some comments in a interview.".

I'd also like to know which of the songs on their albums he co-wrote. And how he is different from any other producer.

I've been reading this stuff for 4 years, and everything I've read from him and about him, his vision for the band and their music, has turned me off him. During Backspacer, he rearranged 'Just Breathe', changing a bridge to a chorus which appeared three times (I think), making the song "commercial" and neutered. He played an awfully-fitting piano part over Unthought Known, spoiling it for me. And he put what amounts to a space opera orchestra over Speed of Sound. The End is a song I thought he arranged and produced quite tastefully, even with the orchestra included, but its merits are rather clouded by the sugar-dusting all over the album in general.

I think the orchestral arrangement of The End is credited to somebody else though.

Interesting. Maybe that's why I prefer it... who knows.

Yup

Eddie Horst – string and horn arrangements