Cops Are The Worst

[knee tunes]

The second video shows the actual event GRAPHIC CONTENT WARNING.

The cops shouldn't have shot a person running away.

When they eventually find him, they just tack on resisting arrest and assaulting an officer , neither of which are punishable by death with a jury of one.

Worse is doing the shooting with all those people in the drive through. Don't bullets richocet?

Cops need more "what if this, then do that" training or something. And not shooting someone running away would be in chapter 1/first day.

[Mickey]

In case it wasn't clear on the last page, my foolproof plan to ensure that no unarmed civilian will ever be able to take a weapon away from a cop is to not give cops deadly weapons in the first place. Having a gun makes every interaction a life or death situation

This is a GREAT plan. Nobody will just beat the hell out of cops ever. And we don't really need cops anyway do we? It's not like anything bad ever happens in life like getting assaulted in the streets.

Would trade some cops getting curb-stomped every so often for fewer dead civilians with absolutely zero hesitation. I thought they were supposed to be the thin blue line, takers of great personal risk.

[Mickey]

Why would the cops not have a duty to not murder someone holding a non-lethal weapon. This is obviously different from him having a gun.

Tasers can be lethal:

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/polic ... since-2000

As that link makes clear, a lot of those deaths have to do with underlying heart conditions and older model tasers. Gonna take a wild, radical position here and say that if you can't survive the threat of being tased without executing your attacker you probably shouldn't be a street cop.

He was passed out after drunk driving, they calmly tried to arrest him, he fought them, he stole one of the tasers, they tasered him (it didnt work), he pointed a taser at them, they shot him. The Twittersphere "sleeping in a car shouldnt be a death sentence" is completely misleading over what happened. That news networks would lead with that claim shows a dangerous bias in favor of instigating more riots to drive viewership.

I certainly agree that the Twitter reaction of "make sleeping in your car legal" is dumb, obfuscating drivel. But you're simplifying here--he may have "pointed a taser at them," but as that video shows, he did so as he ran away. Is he going to lethally tase them from across the parking lot? As bada noted, they have his fucking car, they can go arrest him tomorrow. I certainly wouldn't have behaved as he did (though I'm also not drunk and a member of the radicalized underclass consistently targeted by cops, so what the fuck do I know), but attempting to justify this as if the cop's life was in danger is disgusting.

[elliseamos]

Seriously though. There is currently no chance for meaningful gun control in this country. There are more guns than people. Way more. So since it's too hard to get guns out of the hands of people that will drive drunk and attack cops when confronted, just take weapons away from cops? We can expect utopia in that situation? We live in the real world. We need solutions that work within our reality.

"More guns than people" is sort of weak if they are disproportionately owned by the same people. What I mean is, you having two guns and me having none does not equal both of us having guns.

[verb_to_trust]

So we're safe because trag in MT has seven elk hunting rifles and I have never owned a weapon?

[Mickey]

So we're safe because trag in MT has seven elk hunting rifles and I have never owned a weapon?

What about that musket.

[verb_to_trust]

So we're safe because trag in MT has seven elk hunting rifles and I have never owned a weapon?

What about that musket.

Josh called my bluff

[Bi_3]

Would trade some cops getting curb-stomped every so often for fewer dead civilians with absolutely zero hesitation.

disgusting.

It's interesting though... I see the video as clearly showing the types of violence that police have to deal with everyday even when they approach the situation acting completely professionally and I would go further to say that the pretzel logic reactions to this here and other places... pretending that a intoxicated person who is willing to fight cops and has a stolen weapon from them is not an eminent danger to uninvolved civilians (not just the involved ones you gleefully excuse murder to protect) is disturbingly shortsighted. I would go even further to say these reactions and the lionization of the violent suspects who use physical violence to resist during an arrest will encourage an increasing number of people to fight cops escalating the tragic cycle we find ourselves in now.

And on a side note, in 2015 there were around 53,000,000 police/public contacts and around 1,000 deaths at the hands of police which, according to math, means that 99.998% of police encounters were non-fatal. While I agree it's an admirable and moral goal to make that 100%, can we stop pretending that cops killing people is some existential threat?

[verb_to_trust]

We definitely needed to get rid of cops killing us before containing Covid19. Don't be such a dumbass.

[digster]

I'm curious as to what constitutes a "police/public contact;" is that stops, calls to addresses, all physical interactions? I feel like there's a lot of instances that could be defined as police/public contact where it wouldn't seem to make sense to include them in an assessment of how fatal interactions with the police can be.

[Mickey]

Would trade some cops getting curb-stomped every so often for fewer dead civilians with absolutely zero hesitation.

disgusting.

It's interesting though... I see the video as clearly showing the types of violence that police have to deal with everyday even when they approach the situation acting completely professionally and I would go further to say that the pretzel logic reactions to this here and other places... pretending that a intoxicated person who is willing to fight cops and has a stolen weapon from them is not an eminent danger to uninvolved civilians (not just the involved ones you gleefully excuse murder to protect) is disturbingly shortsighted. I would go even further to say these reactions and the lionization of the violent suspects who use physical violence to resist during an arrest will encourage an increasing number of people to fight cops escalating the tragic cycle we find ourselves in now.

This is like a master class on collapsing important differences to provide cover for the police, who just as a first principle should be held up a higher standard than your average civilian. Did I, at any point in this thread, imply that he's not potentially a threat? No, of course not. But he's not a lethal threat to the police, and it's either naive, stupid, or something much worse to assume that someone resisting arrest is also going to be violent towards other civilians who are not trying to arrest him. A drunk man fleeing across a parking lot with a stolen tazer most likely poses a greater risk to himself than anyone else. But there's a whole range of responses to his behavior that fall between "let him go" and "execute him." I certainly think you forfeit your claim to "acting professionally" when you fire on a fleeing civilian. And if you interpret "he shouldn't have been killed" as "lionizing," or think that the major takeaway from outrage about his murder is going to be *more* people resisting arrest, I honestly don't know what to tell you--that's the kind of logic you can only access once you've built an terra-cotta army of straw-men.

[washing machine]

Wouldn't it be a terra-cotta army of terra-cotta men?

[Mickey]

No, man.

[Mickey]

[tragabigzanda]

FUCK ICE

[knee tunes]

Cops are suck alot of times

I've known really good cops that in my small town investigated and made full cases against (jailed) child sex predators but were totally cool and friendly in every other way.

The cop that shot a guy running away in a Wendy's parking lot tho.

The cop was pissed that the guy was getting away is what I surmise. He/they seemed decent in all other aspects (from the videos) except for shooting the guy.

Cops and robbers is not a game. But kids play it.
And cops play it and people die and survivors live it

[elliseamos]

Maybe change can come from all this, even if justice is 7 years and counting for Wayne Jones:

https://theintercept.com/2020/06/12/qua ... yne-jones/

It was roughly 11:30 p.m. on March 13, 2013, when Officer Paul Lehman spotted Jones walking along Queen Street in downtown Martinsburg. He wasn’t on the sidewalk, as city ordinance would require, so Lehman followed Jones, a 50-year-old black man who was homeless and had been diagnosed with schizophrenia. After about a minute, Lehman honked, pulled over, and asked Jones for identification. Jones didn’t have any. Lehman asked if he had any weapons; Jones wasn’t sure what that meant. “Anything,” Lehman responded. “Guns, knives, clubs.” Jones did have a small fixed-blade knife tucked inside his right shirt sleeve, but he didn’t say that specifically, only that he had “something on him.”

From there, the situation quickly escalated. Lehman demanded that Jones get up against the car. Jones wanted to know why — “What do you want?” he asked — but Lehman didn’t explain. Instead, Lehman called for backup and, as Jones moved away, drew his Taser and fired. A second cop, Daniel North, rolled up on scene and also fired a Taser at Jones. Jones fled, running into the alcove in front of a bookstore down the street.

Before long, three more cops — William Staubs, Eric Neely, and Erik Herb — would arrive. Jones was struck in the neck, kicked, and put into a chokehold — the 4th Circuit opinion notes that “choking and gurgling sounds” can be heard in dashcam video recordings of the incident — before one of the officers realized that Jones had the small knife. The cops pulled away, forming a semicircle around him with their weapons drawn. Jones was limp and lying on his right side. Even though he was not moving, the cops demanded that Jones drop his knife. When he didn’t respond, all five fired their guns — a total of 22 rounds in two seconds. A majority of the shots hit Jones in the back and buttocks. He died at the scene.

[96583UP]

So what is the run-down of proposals? serious question. want to consider tangible goals / next steps and not just be consumed by complaining.

Someone break the options down:

1) Police Immunity: is this real, is this the problem. they don't second guess killing because they can't be prosecuted (when). Eliminate this

2) Community Policing: Softer-touch, de-militarized 'policing'. get to know the community. more there to help than there to hurt. Implement this

3) Eliminate police unions: but i thought leftists loved unions. but they also contain MSG, which is bad.

4) Eliminate Policing: That way everyone can watch their elderly parents get gang-raped every day by trolling packs of thugs like it's the soviet liberation of poland. This seems extreme but the sacrifice might be worth it.

5) ???????

maybe we can take a breather from getting triggered on the twitter re-feed of the last 10 years' worth of police abuse cases and consider the solutions (or do both)

i don't see a lot of discussion of possible solutions in the agenda-setting media. just a lot of descriptions of events and how people are 'feeling'

#4 doesn't seem practical to me but curious if successful examples exist. A lot of things make sense on a classroom chalkboard that don't work out in the real world due to entropy. But if we have to accept a certain amount of Indian-style rape gangs as part of the trade-off; or convince ourselves that Camden, NJ is a desirable place to live - then perhaps that conversation should be a short one.

[knee tunes]

5)

[elliseamos]

So what is the run-down of proposals? serious question. want to consider tangible goals / next steps and not just be consumed by complaining.

Someone break the options down:

1) Police Immunity: is this real, is this the problem. they don't second guess killing because they can't be prosecuted (when). Eliminate this

2) Community Policing: Softer-touch, de-militarized 'policing'. get to know the community. more there to help than there to hurt. Implement this

3) Eliminate police unions: but i thought leftists loved unions. but they also contain MSG, which is bad.

4) Eliminate Policing: That way everyone can watch their elderly parents get gang-raped every day by trolling packs of thugs like it's the soviet liberation of poland. This seems extreme but the sacrifice might be worth it.

5) ???????

maybe we can take a breather from getting triggered on the twitter re-feed of the last 10 years' worth of police abuse cases and consider the solutions (or do both)

i don't see a lot of discussion of possible solutions in the agenda-setting media. just a lot of descriptions of events and how people are 'feeling'

#4 doesn't seem practical to me but curious if successful examples exist. A lot of things make sense on a classroom chalkboard that don't work out in the real world due to entropy. But if we have to accept a certain amount of Indian-style rape gangs as part of the trade-off; or convince ourselves that Camden, NJ is a desirable place to live - then perhaps that conversation should be a short one.

The article was about your #1, fella.