Song of the Moment: Sirens

[harmless]

I'm starting to wonder whether IlluminEddie needs to check album sales charts before he knows what he feels about an album...

[harmless]

Sorry for the personal tone, but I have expressed my negative opinion towards the band's choices several times in our topics and I don't want to repeat myself.
My boyfriend who lives in London called me late last night after seeing Soundgarden in Brixton. He told me among others that ''Matt Cameron was great in his natural position with this great band and he had to see it by his own eyes to confirm that PJ is the most boring and overrated band of the 90s. We laughed. I hadn't heard Sirens yet, and I wasn't very optimistic because I happen not to like much of PJ the last seven years. After watching the video, and having Soundgarden in my mind, I thought how would Kim Thayil react to Sirens . After watching it again, I put some Black Flag on to ease the pain.

Problem is 'King Animal' doesn't rise up to Audioslave, not to mention classic SG

No it does not.

Your boyfriend had to see Soundgarden in 2013 to find out that Pearl Jam were the most boring, overrated band in the 90s? Yeah, that's kind of funny but not for the reasons you think it is.

[sward]

Sorry for the personal tone, but I have expressed my negative opinion towards the band's choices several times in our topics and I don't want to repeat myself.
My boyfriend who lives in London called me late last night after seeing Soundgarden in Brixton. He told me among others that ''Matt Cameron was great in his natural position with this great band and he had to see it by his own eyes to confirm that PJ is the most boring and overrated band of the 90s. We laughed. I hadn't heard Sirens yet, and I wasn't very optimistic because I happen not to like much of PJ the last seven years. After watching the video, and having Soundgarden in my mind, I thought how would Kim Thayil react to Sirens . After watching it again, I put some Black Flag on to ease the pain.

I mean this as respectfully as possible..but who cares what Kim Thayil thinks about Sirens? Two different bands who have NEVER played the same style. Ever. It only matters what Matt thinks of the material and I suspect he isn't disliking it or he wouldn't be working the two bands.

[BurtReynolds]

It does seem like this song is not very popular with the nonfan significant other demographic.

[stupidmop]

Sorry for the personal tone, but I have expressed my negative opinion towards the band's choices several times in our topics and I don't want to repeat myself.
My boyfriend who lives in London called me late last night after seeing Soundgarden in Brixton. He told me among others that ''Matt Cameron was great in his natural position with this great band and he had to see it by his own eyes to confirm that PJ is the most boring and overrated band of the 90s. We laughed. I hadn't heard Sirens yet, and I wasn't very optimistic because I happen not to like much of PJ the last seven years. After watching the video, and having Soundgarden in my mind, I thought how would Kim Thayil react to Sirens . After watching it again, I put some Black Flag on to ease the pain.

Problem is 'King Animal' doesn't rise up to Audioslave, not to mention classic SG

I like to remember Chris Cornells timberland.....thing. To put pearl jams slide in integrity in perspective . Not long now though I'd imagine, stone will be rapping about his hoes and bitches in no time.

[Cleverman]

Based on a lot of the reactions from Sirens (including the unexpected vitriol over at the Pit), it is clear to me that not many of you are subjected to countless hours of mindless top 40 pop radio crap every day. My co-workers love that shit and that's all we listen to at work. If Sirens came on right now it would totally blow the pants off of everything that's been played so far today (and that includes KOL's Use Somebody, which is completely inferior to Sirens at this point, it's not even close).

Why is PJ's versions of pop radio much better than pop radio? Because PJ are still craftsmen, even in their worst moments. Sirens still has substance and weight to it, regardless of whether or not it comes off as bubblegum. Hell, I would argue that Sirens has more substance to it than a song like Betterman. And even though this is brand new territory for them, at the end of the day, or at least after about 10 listens, this sounds like Pearl Jam to me.

Just checking in to say that I really like this post.

[Lounge Lizard]

It does seem like this song is not very popular with the nonfan significant other demographic.

Boys will be boys

[mastaflatch]

i imagine that some people think this song is as bad as i think Evacuation is and i'm pretty glad i stuck with the band despite not liking this song. it hasn't improved (not significantly) over the years for me and thankfully, nobody, as far as i remember, told me something along the lines "grow up" or "wait until you have to evacuate a building, then you'll really be able to connect with it". people mostly said i had no fucking taste in music

[broken iris]

It does seem like this song is not very popular with the nonfan significant other demographic.

I'm conducting said experiment tonight. Will report back.

[IlluminEddie]

Because it was released? I figured that wasn't essential to the point, I guess.

Does data earlier than 2006 exist? Why was that your chosen starting point? I would assume a preceding album's sales could increase fairly well with a new release. Would be interesting to look at a longer data set.

[IlluminEddie]

Besides his fuzzy math growth rate assumption, he's also made the false assumption that everyone who bought Backspacer is a PJ fan. Its just nonsense.

What's your definition of a fan? Do you have to like shit albums to be a fan?

[Lounge Lizard]

i imagine that some people think this song is as bad as i think Evacuation is and i'm pretty glad i stuck with the band despite not liking this song. it hasn't improved (not significantly) over the years for me and thankfully, nobody, as far as i remember, told me something along the lines "grow up" or "wait until you have to evacuate a building, then you'll really be able to connect with it". people mostly said i had no fucking taste in music

This.
I also really enjoy the 'write some music that's this good first and then come shit on our band' argument.
So you didn't like a blowjob? Give a better one - then complain!

[twoheadedboy]

I can't wait to dump to this song.

It hasn't improved at all. I think there'll be people looking back at this moment and saying "Yup...that was the final nail in the coffin for me"

Yep. I txt'ed my friend last night. My Tenclub membership expires this month, 2011 was supposed to be the last year because I wanted to take a family member to the next Chicago show, didn't happen so I grudgingly renewed again, went to Wrigley and had a great time (despite things out of the band's control), said I would keep it going if I LOVED Lightning Bolt the album...every song other than MYM has been dreadful which compares to Backspacer where I only dug (at best) about half the album and thought it was awful in general.

I still may attend a Pearl Jam show, when it's convenient for me, but after nearly 13 years, I'm done paying money to Tenclub. I'd rather pay a scalper $164 for each ticket than pay $40 x4 (number of years between Chicago shows) in fan club dues and $168 for a pair of tickets when I may want 1 or 3 or 4....I'll probably get a better seat, too (though my Wrigley seats were pretty awesome all things considering). So then I'm left with a lottery I may not win (I'm actually in favor of this policy change, I'm just saying), stickers, and a vinyl 45 I can't play of songs I don't want that I can get digitally anyway, and an unresponsive and sarcastic/abusive staff.

This, and the fact that I'm finally seeing Neutral Milk Hotel live next month, suggests to me that this is kind of the end of an era (of sorts) for me...

I sincerely believe that those who aren't enjoying the song need to put it aside and that someday this song is going to mean something to them. All depends on your place in life and what it means to you today. I'm 40. I have great kids. A great wife. A great job. But I have watched life change drastically to more than a few people around me. This line is hitting me with a tonne of bricks. "It's a fragile thing, this life we lead." So this song is my here and now.

I have been a huge PJ fan since the beginning, so I take the good with the bad and accept that I'm not going to love everything. So I'm not in that same station of fandom, where I feel the need to reconsider my affinity for the band. That said. Come back to this song. Someday its going to make sense.

I'm 31 years old. Bottom line is, no matter how much "meaning" I might/could derive from the lyrics, the music is such insipid adult contemporary shit that I can't stand it. Maybe it's unfair of me to pigeonhole Pearl Jam this way, as not everything I listen to is "rawk" (I really like Eddie's solo albums, for instance! Not that everything I listen to is related to Pearl Jam) but I don't care - this is not the type of music I want to hear when I fire up a Pearl Jam CD or attend their concerts. They've essentially entered the same zone for me that Weezer did when they released the Green album. I went and saw them live when they did their "memories" tour playing Blue/Pinkerton front-to-back each night and an "other greatest hits" portion after...the Green and later songs were completely lost on me (other than "Pork and Beans", a sarcastic return-to-form done to appease the record company) but they made other people happy. That's great, I don't begrudge them that (the band or the fans), but on the same note it's time for me to move on.

[IlluminEddie]

Is Riot Act selling 1000 copies total between 2009 and 2012 supposed to indicate something positive about that album? That seems pretty dreadful.

Aside from Ten and the hits package (and, to a lesser extent, Vs), all of Pearl Jam's catalog sales are low compared to initial sales. Big fanbase, minimal outside engagement.

You didn't answer the question. Instead, you said most go down... I get that. But, I'm saying 1000 copies sold in 3 years, is about 333 a year. That's something an indie band could do.

To me, this data really hammers home which album is the worst in the collection.

Album sales compared to impact and achievement are often really weird. Times They Are a-Changin' has sold a little over 800,000 copies to date...like, ever, not counting used copies...while Slow Train has sold over a million. David Bowie's Low has sold just 425,000. Kiss's Alive sold 600,000 copies in 1975 alone, and had passed the million mark by the end of 1976...and in all the years since has moved just 258,000 copies (including reissues!).

The Who Sings My Generation has sold 275,000 copies in the United States (head explodes), and Neil Young's Tonights the Night has sold 450,000...just 75,000 more than Hawks and Doves.

See, this is where everyone here seem to go when album sales are discussed. My point back to all of these points is this.... compare those bands against ONLY themselves. The totals aren't important other than to judge that bands stuff against that bands stuff. Look at album sales as a metric (and don't worry about the total). Of course, it's tough when one album is released after another. But, when discussing a catalog of one bands music, album sales can be very, very relevant in indicating popularity even of a said band's fan-base.

[harmless]

Sorry for the personal tone, but I have expressed my negative opinion towards the band's choices several times in our topics and I don't want to repeat myself.
My boyfriend who lives in London called me late last night after seeing Soundgarden in Brixton. He told me among others that ''Matt Cameron was great in his natural position with this great band and he had to see it by his own eyes to confirm that PJ is the most boring and overrated band of the 90s. We laughed. I hadn't heard Sirens yet, and I wasn't very optimistic because I happen not to like much of PJ the last seven years. After watching the video, and having Soundgarden in my mind, I thought how would Kim Thayil react to Sirens . After watching it again, I put some Black Flag on to ease the pain.

I mean this as respectfully as possible..but who cares what Kim Thayil thinks about Sirens? Two different bands who have NEVER played the same style. Ever. It only matters what Matt thinks of the material and I suspect he isn't disliking it or he wouldn't be working the two bands.

Not to mention the fact that Kim Thayil probably likes "Worse Dreams".

[Chris_H_2]

Is it safe to say that Pearl Jam has entered "Dad-rock" territory?

[doug rr]

Is it safe to say that Pearl Jam has entered "Dad-rock" territory?

[digster]

See, this is where everyone here seem to go when album sales are discussed. My point back to all of these points is this.... compare those bands against ONLY themselves. The totals aren't important other than to judge that bands stuff against that bands stuff. Look at album sales as a metric (and don't worry about the total). Of course, it's tough when one album is released after another. But, when discussing a catalog of one bands music, album sales can be very, very relevant in indicating popularity even of a said band's fan-base.

That's exactly what McParadigm did in the text you quoted; he compares Dylan to Dylan and Young to Young. He shows that one of Dylan's most derided albums has sold more than one of his most universally acclaimed.

Album sales compared to impact and achievement are often really weird. Times They Are a-Changin' has sold a little over 800,000 copies to date...like, ever, not counting used copies...while Slow Train has sold over a million. David Bowie's Low has sold just 425,000. Kiss's Alive sold 600,000 copies in 1975 alone, and had passed the million mark by the end of 1976...and in all the years since has moved just 258,000 copies (including reissues!).

The Who Sings My Generation has sold 275,000 copies in the United States (head explodes), and Neil Young's Tonights the Night has sold 450,000...just 75,000 more than Hawks and Doves.

[harmless]

Is it safe to say that Pearl Jam has entered "Dad-rock" territory?

Of course it is, people say it after every album. I said it after I heard Yield for the first time.

[Thejambi]

Is it safe to say that Pearl Jam has entered "Dad-rock" territory?

Of course it is, people say it after every album. I said it after I heard Yield for the first time.

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Pop-Rock