Transgender Rights

[E.H. Ruddock]

And I'd circle back to the lobotomies thing, why is irreversible surgery suddenly an OK treatment for children suffering mental issues?

I'm not a psychiatrist, but I took enough psychology courses to know that screening prior to lobotomies was not as thorough as surgical consults today.

It appears as though the medical community considers a mastectomy reversible through reconstruction and teenagers to have decisional capacity, and you do not.

being trans is not a "mental issue" Bi_3

I think this is an important point that needs to be discussed more. Although in my limited experience the people I’ve encountered that think anything other than “straight” Is a mental illness are also people who believe “God didn’t make people that way”.

[BurtReynolds]

Too many treat any criticism of ANY particular idea, belief or action as an attack on all of one's ideas, the entirety of which they believe to be the only thing protecting them from chaos and danger. This is the very definition of ideological - or even religious - thinking. Some are more interested in protecting the entire ideology at all costs, confusing - or purposefully conflating - ideology with people. I don't know how you convince the ideologically possessed that one can criticize certain specific ideas (or actions based on those ideas) without it being an attack on their entire being and worldview.

[Ms Harmless]

now, as for teaching kids that "both sides" of every single subject on the planet are right and good and neutral, that's bullshit; there is nothing wrong with taking a definite stand on things, there is everything wrong with taking the wrong, hateful stand

I do not know the best way to teach kids or what the appropriate age for subjects are. I was just stating that it’s reasonable for parents to argue And disagree because it is so complicated and nuanced

1. you're absolutely right, you don't

2. it isn't

1. You don’t either

2. Yes it is

excellent, highly intelligent responses to a trans woman with lived experience and 10+ years of hands-on experience of the subject

[Ms Harmless]

No he doesn't act like that. You just immediately assume the worst possible intentions of anyone who disagrees with you.

His posts assume the worst possible intentions of anyone who provides gender affirming care. I didn't make him post that.

you live an entirely fact free existence.

BurtReynolds please always remember that leftism isn't an ideology, it's an aesthetic

for the leftist the world is a series of opportunities to strike a cheap pose of moral superiority, not a reality to be understood as a series of causes and effects and observable events

the leftist must be mocked, not engaged with in good faith

Thank you. I needed to hear that. I’m out

[tree_]

now, as for teaching kids that "both sides" of every single subject on the planet are right and good and neutral, that's bullshit; there is nothing wrong with taking a definite stand on things, there is everything wrong with taking the wrong, hateful stand

I do not know the best way to teach kids or what the appropriate age for subjects are. I was just stating that it’s reasonable for parents to argue And disagree because it is so complicated and nuanced

1. you're absolutely right, you don't

2. it isn't

1. You don’t either

2. Yes it is

excellent, highly intelligent responses to a trans woman with lived experience and 10+ years of hands-on experience of the subject

You just told me recently that peoples’ realities are different. If this is so, perhaps an individual student’s subjective experience might be relevant to what is their best, most effective curriculum. In other words what works for one person probably doesn’t work for everybody else to the same degree.

[---]

there is no such thing as an "inappropriate" age to teach kids that they can explore their gender

and then, one day, for no reason at all...

[---]

Too many treat any criticism of ANY particular idea, belief or action as an attack on all of one's ideas, the entirety of which they believe to be the only thing protecting them from chaos and danger. This is the very definition of ideological - or even religious - thinking. Some are more interested in protecting the entire ideology at all costs, confusing - or purposefully conflating - ideology with people. I don't know how you convince the ideologically possessed that one can criticize certain specific ideas (or actions based on those ideas) without it being an attack on their entire being and worldview.

just mock them

[Ms Harmless]

now, as for teaching kids that "both sides" of every single subject on the planet are right and good and neutral, that's bullshit; there is nothing wrong with taking a definite stand on things, there is everything wrong with taking the wrong, hateful stand

I do not know the best way to teach kids or what the appropriate age for subjects are. I was just stating that it’s reasonable for parents to argue And disagree because it is so complicated and nuanced

1. you're absolutely right, you don't

2. it isn't

1. You don’t either

2. Yes it is

excellent, highly intelligent responses to a trans woman with lived experience and 10+ years of hands-on experience of the subject

You just told me recently that peoples’ realities are different. If this is so, perhaps an individual student’s subjective experience might be relevant to what is their best, most effective curriculum. In other words what works for one person probably doesn’t work for everybody else to the same degree.

how does this relate to telling children they are allowed to explore their gender and it's healthy to do so? sure, there are many different ways to teach an overarching principle! that's a question of learning style, experience, etc.; but I'm not going to agree that telling any child "sorry, I don't mean you, you're NOT allowed to explore your gender because your mommy will sue the school if I let you" is right

[Ms Harmless]

there is no such thing as an "inappropriate" age to teach kids that they can explore their gender

and then, one day, for no reason at all...

... what? what happens "---"?

[---]

how does this relate to telling children they are allowed to explore their gender and it's healthy to do so?

reconciliation isn't possible

[Ms Harmless]

how does this relate to telling children they are allowed to explore their gender and it's healthy to do so?

reconciliation isn't possible

we won't be asking you to reconcile with anyone, don't worry

[tree_]

now, as for teaching kids that "both sides" of every single subject on the planet are right and good and neutral, that's bullshit; there is nothing wrong with taking a definite stand on things, there is everything wrong with taking the wrong, hateful stand

I do not know the best way to teach kids or what the appropriate age for subjects are. I was just stating that it’s reasonable for parents to argue And disagree because it is so complicated and nuanced

1. you're absolutely right, you don't

2. it isn't

1. You don’t either

2. Yes it is

excellent, highly intelligent responses to a trans woman with lived experience and 10+ years of hands-on experience of the subject

You just told me recently that peoples’ realities are different. If this is so, perhaps an individual student’s subjective experience might be relevant to what is their best, most effective curriculum. In other words what works for one person probably doesn’t work for everybody else to the same degree.

how does this relate to telling children they are allowed to explore their gender and it's healthy to do so? sure, there are many different ways to teach an overarching principle! that's a question of learning style, experience, etc.; but I'm not going to agree that telling any child "sorry, I don't mean you, you're NOT allowed to explore your gender because your mommy will sue the school if I let you" is right

Perhaps there is more than one way to educate and raise a child. Maybe we should be open to all possibilities. Maybe your way isn’t the best way. Maybe it is. I don’t know. And neither do you, because each child is different.

[Ms Harmless]

now, as for teaching kids that "both sides" of every single subject on the planet are right and good and neutral, that's bullshit; there is nothing wrong with taking a definite stand on things, there is everything wrong with taking the wrong, hateful stand

I do not know the best way to teach kids or what the appropriate age for subjects are. I was just stating that it’s reasonable for parents to argue And disagree because it is so complicated and nuanced

1. you're absolutely right, you don't

2. it isn't

1. You don’t either

2. Yes it is

excellent, highly intelligent responses to a trans woman with lived experience and 10+ years of hands-on experience of the subject

You just told me recently that peoples’ realities are different. If this is so, perhaps an individual student’s subjective experience might be relevant to what is their best, most effective curriculum. In other words what works for one person probably doesn’t work for everybody else to the same degree.

how does this relate to telling children they are allowed to explore their gender and it's healthy to do so? sure, there are many different ways to teach an overarching principle! that's a question of learning style, experience, etc.; but I'm not going to agree that telling any child "sorry, I don't mean you, you're NOT allowed to explore your gender because your mommy will sue the school if I let you" is right

Perhaps there is more than one way to educate and raise a child. Maybe we should be open to all possibilities. Maybe your way isn’t the best way. Maybe it is. I don’t know. And neither do you, because each child is different.

stop writing vague, non-committal bullshit that means nothing and helps nobody; stop assuming nobody knows shit about any of this just because you don't

[Ms Harmless]

"maybe transphobia is actually GOOD for children" -- tree

[Bammer]

Can’t we/us/they/y’all/them just get along!?!?

[tree_]

now, as for teaching kids that "both sides" of every single subject on the planet are right and good and neutral, that's bullshit; there is nothing wrong with taking a definite stand on things, there is everything wrong with taking the wrong, hateful stand

I do not know the best way to teach kids or what the appropriate age for subjects are. I was just stating that it’s reasonable for parents to argue And disagree because it is so complicated and nuanced

1. you're absolutely right, you don't

2. it isn't

1. You don’t either

2. Yes it is

excellent, highly intelligent responses to a trans woman with lived experience and 10+ years of hands-on experience of the subject

You just told me recently that peoples’ realities are different. If this is so, perhaps an individual student’s subjective experience might be relevant to what is their best, most effective curriculum. In other words what works for one person probably doesn’t work for everybody else to the same degree.

how does this relate to telling children they are allowed to explore their gender and it's healthy to do so? sure, there are many different ways to teach an overarching principle! that's a question of learning style, experience, etc.; but I'm not going to agree that telling any child "sorry, I don't mean you, you're NOT allowed to explore your gender because your mommy will sue the school if I let you" is right

Perhaps there is more than one way to educate and raise a child. Maybe we should be open to all possibilities. Maybe your way isn’t the best way. Maybe it is. I don’t know. And neither do you, because each child is different.

stop writing vague, non-committal bullshit that means nothing and helps nobody; stop assuming nobody knows shit about any of this just because you don't

Imagine potential opposing world views that don’t completely align with eachother that are somehow equally legitimate, it’s easy if you try.

[BurtReynolds]

It amazes me that one can think they are both marginalized and in a position to dictate terms. Either you control the positions of power and don't need to negotiate, or you don't. Holding both beliefs seems like a will to self-destruction.

[tree_]

It amazes me that one can think they are both marginalized and in a position to dictate terms. Either you control the positions of power and don't need to negotiate, or you don't. Holding both beliefs seems like a will to self-destruction.

Yes I feel like the cognitive dissonance would make my brain explode

[Ms Harmless]

now, as for teaching kids that "both sides" of every single subject on the planet are right and good and neutral, that's bullshit; there is nothing wrong with taking a definite stand on things, there is everything wrong with taking the wrong, hateful stand

I do not know the best way to teach kids or what the appropriate age for subjects are. I was just stating that it’s reasonable for parents to argue And disagree because it is so complicated and nuanced

1. you're absolutely right, you don't

2. it isn't

1. You don’t either

2. Yes it is

excellent, highly intelligent responses to a trans woman with lived experience and 10+ years of hands-on experience of the subject

You just told me recently that peoples’ realities are different. If this is so, perhaps an individual student’s subjective experience might be relevant to what is their best, most effective curriculum. In other words what works for one person probably doesn’t work for everybody else to the same degree.

how does this relate to telling children they are allowed to explore their gender and it's healthy to do so? sure, there are many different ways to teach an overarching principle! that's a question of learning style, experience, etc.; but I'm not going to agree that telling any child "sorry, I don't mean you, you're NOT allowed to explore your gender because your mommy will sue the school if I let you" is right

Perhaps there is more than one way to educate and raise a child. Maybe we should be open to all possibilities. Maybe your way isn’t the best way. Maybe it is. I don’t know. And neither do you, because each child is different.

stop writing vague, non-committal bullshit that means nothing and helps nobody; stop assuming nobody knows shit about any of this just because you don't

Imagine potential opposing world views that don’t completely align with eachother that are somehow equally legitimate, it’s easy if you try.

transphobia and trans-acceptance?

equally legitimate? I just want to make sure that's definitely what you're saying

[tree_]

now, as for teaching kids that "both sides" of every single subject on the planet are right and good and neutral, that's bullshit; there is nothing wrong with taking a definite stand on things, there is everything wrong with taking the wrong, hateful stand

I do not know the best way to teach kids or what the appropriate age for subjects are. I was just stating that it’s reasonable for parents to argue And disagree because it is so complicated and nuanced

1. you're absolutely right, you don't

2. it isn't

1. You don’t either

2. Yes it is

excellent, highly intelligent responses to a trans woman with lived experience and 10+ years of hands-on experience of the subject

You just told me recently that peoples’ realities are different. If this is so, perhaps an individual student’s subjective experience might be relevant to what is their best, most effective curriculum. In other words what works for one person probably doesn’t work for everybody else to the same degree.

how does this relate to telling children they are allowed to explore their gender and it's healthy to do so? sure, there are many different ways to teach an overarching principle! that's a question of learning style, experience, etc.; but I'm not going to agree that telling any child "sorry, I don't mean you, you're NOT allowed to explore your gender because your mommy will sue the school if I let you" is right

Perhaps there is more than one way to educate and raise a child. Maybe we should be open to all possibilities. Maybe your way isn’t the best way. Maybe it is. I don’t know. And neither do you, because each child is different.

stop writing vague, non-committal bullshit that means nothing and helps nobody; stop assuming nobody knows shit about any of this just because you don't

Imagine potential opposing world views that don’t completely align with eachother that are somehow equally legitimate, it’s easy if you try.

transphobia and trans-acceptance?

equally legitimate? I just want to make sure that's definitely what you're saying

No I’m being more vague than that because the spectrum is so vast.