digster wrote:
The whole idea behind S/T's marketing push is "we're rocking again, we're not going to make weird art records anymore" - which is just kind of marketing gobbledygook, as Binaural and Riot Act aren't really anywhere near the extreme of being weird art records. And it doesn't really matter, as long as the results are good, and while I may think S/T is a step down from the previous records, it's still a good record in hindsight. But being around during the push of that record, it was just clearly a different approach then they'd taken before.
Anecdotally it fits though. I have two close friends that grew up loving Ten-Vitalogy era Pearl Jam with me but fell off with No Code. In both cases they came back to the band with the S/T album.
For better or worse S/T will always be the "return to form" album in my mind.
tragabigzanda wrote:i kind of can't get behind this concept anymore, because S/T now feels to me like "back when they were still great," and the real drop off started with BS.
1. Dance of the Clairvoyants
2. Severed Hand
3. Pendulum
4. Quick Escape
5. Seven O’Clock
6. Life Wasted
7. Inside Job
8. Speed of Sound
9. Who Ever Said
10. Got Some
PRAMG isn't even entirely about the music (even though I think S/T sucks ass). It's more about the sharp and sudden change in their business and marketing decisions, which happened to coincide with their turn to more accessible music
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tragabigzanda wrote:i kind of can't get behind this concept anymore, because S/T now feels to me like "back when they were still great," and the real drop off started with BS.
yeah, agreed.
Ill rank from BS onwards and in no particular order:
Got Some
The Fixer
Speed Of Sound
Johnny Guitar
Sirens
Yellow Moon
My Father Son
Who Ever Said
Dance
Quick Escape
7 O clock
Take The Long Way
River Cross
Just going to note that they clearly changed their focus after Riot Act, but I don’t see things as decline per se. I think if self-titled as a change in direction and it was a fresh approach, a decline in both Backspacer and Lightning Bolt, and then Gigaton as the triumph of this approach, so a return to the quality they provided pre-Backspacer, and really even before that. Gigaton is to me the album they were reaching for after Riot Act. To be determined how Dark Matter fits into this narrative or possibly creates a new turn.
liebzz wrote:Just going to note that they clearly changed their focus after Riot Act, but I don’t see things as decline per se. I think if self-titled as a change in direction and it was a fresh approach, a decline in both Backspacer and Lightning Bolt, and then Gigaton as the triumph of this approach, so a return to the quality they provided pre-Backspacer, and really even before that. Gigaton is to me the album they were reaching for after Riot Act. To be determined how Dark Matter fits into this narrative or possibly creates a new turn.
yeah, i agree with this. I even think Gigaton is the album they could have done after Vitalogy or Yield too. Also, the only album i dont care much is LB.
Monkey_Driven wrote:Maybe it's better to look at the PRAMG as the Post-Epic/Sony era instead.
I mean, yes. Without the benefit of a record label back then, I think they were reaching for ways to stay both independent and relevant. Pearl Jam, the album, largely accomplished that in the media as their return to form, while Backspacer brought them that “crossover” appeal into adult rock with Just Breathe. I don’t know that there’ll be any true return after those final rattles in the real mainstream since their brand of rock music has come and gone, but one never knows.
Monkey_Driven wrote:Maybe it's better to look at the PRAMG as the Post-Epic/Sony era instead.
I mean, yes. Without the benefit of a record label back then, I think they were reaching for ways to stay both independent and relevant. Pearl Jam, the album, largely accomplished that in the media as their return to form, while Backspacer brought them that “crossover” appeal into adult rock with Just Breathe. I don’t know that there’ll be any true return after those final rattles in the real mainstream since their brand of rock music has come and gone, but one never knows.
this makes a lot of sense. Post Epic/Sony the band now has to take responsibility for things they didn't have to before, and so are now decisions they have to own, as opposed to work that happened behind the scenes due to the label that they did not need to involve themselves in
if we are going to revist the scope and definitition of PRAMG, it should occur there
but in my view, it is settled-law
this thread is for ranking 10 songs according to current PRAMG doctrine
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tragabigzanda wrote:i kind of can't get behind this concept anymore, because S/T now feels to me like "back when they were still great," and the real drop off started with BS.
yeah, agreed.
Ill rank from BS onwards and in no particular order:
Got Some
The Fixer
Speed Of Sound
Johnny Guitar
Sirens
Yellow Moon
My Father Son
Who Ever Said
Dance
Quick Escape
7 O clock
Take The Long Way
River Cross
Gonna See my Friend
Whoever Said
DOTC
Quick Escape
Take the Long Way
Seven o Clock
My Fathers Son
Lightning Bolt
River Cross
Speed of Sound
true, but I imagine Avocado is the first album where suddenly they (at least the pearl jam org which is larger than the band) are responsible for a whole lot more decisions around the business side of making and releasing music than they were before
