stip wrote:How can anyone only know Yellow Submarine? This is not 'oh, you only know pearl jam because of ten.' It's the fucking Beatles? How can there be a single music listener on this planet who is not very familiar with at least 20 of their songs.
Of course, but that's always they one (again in my own anecdotal experience) they all use as their go-to example of why the Beatles are terrible.
Also, it's pretty easy to avoid whatever you want to avoid.
Lament wrote:I gave a perfectly valid explanation for why the Beatles rarely cross my mind and aren't a band I care much about one way or the other, and not a single defender has even bothered to approach my explanation.
And for two reasons. 1: You defended yourself well. And 2: there's not much of a counter argument. No one can fight how you feel. You're explanation is valid and well put. But what further discussion does it demand?
It's not like you said you don't like the Beatles because they suck at harmonies. That's something we both could debate and discuss back and forth with specific examples. "They don't move me," while totally valid isn't really something that can be debated or discussed.
As long as it can still be dismissed as stupid, RM will never run out of discussion.
we should make that the board motto and display it at the top of every screen
Dev wrote:you're delusional. you are a sad sad person. fuck off. you're mentally ill beyond repair. i don't need your shit. dissapear.
stip wrote:How can anyone only know Yellow Submarine? This is not 'oh, you only know pearl jam because of ten.' It's the fucking Beatles? How can there be a single music listener on this planet who is not very familiar with at least 20 of their songs.
I think it's probably much easier these days to not be exposed to music you don't necessarily have any interest in than it was 20 years ago...
Lament wrote:I gave a perfectly valid explanation for why the Beatles rarely cross my mind and aren't a band I care much about one way or the other, and not a single defender has even bothered to approach my explanation.
And for two reasons. 1: You defended yourself well. And 2: there's not much of a counter argument. No one can fight how you feel. You're explanation is valid and well put. But what further discussion does it demand?
It's not like you said you don't like the Beatles because they suck at harmonies. That's something we both could debate and discuss back and forth with specific examples. "They don't move me," while totally valid isn't really something that can be debated or discussed.
As long as it can still be dismissed as stupid, RM will never run out of discussion.
I certainly don't think "I've tried but they don't move me" is stupid. Far from.
stip wrote:How can anyone only know Yellow Submarine? This is not 'oh, you only know pearl jam because of ten.' It's the fucking Beatles? How can there be a single music listener on this planet who is not very familiar with at least 20 of their songs.
Of course, but that's always they one (again in my own anecdotal experience) they all use as their go-to example of why the Beatles are terrible.
My go-to example is Obladi Oblada
cutuphalfdead wrote:so glad i don't see signatures
Lament wrote:I gave a perfectly valid explanation for why the Beatles rarely cross my mind and aren't a band I care much about one way or the other, and not a single defender has even bothered to approach my explanation.
And for two reasons. 1: You defended yourself well. And 2: there's not much of a counter argument. No one can fight how you feel. You're explanation is valid and well put. But what further discussion does it demand?
It's not like you said you don't like the Beatles because they suck at harmonies. That's something we both could debate and discuss back and forth with specific examples. "They don't move me," while totally valid isn't really something that can be debated or discussed.
As long as it can still be dismissed as stupid, RM will never run out of discussion.
I certainly don't think "I've tried but they don't move me" is stupid. Far from.
You don't, but others in this thread do. And it's not like we didn't already have these long debates about The Beatles OMG BEST BAND EVER on this very board and it's a pretty common reaction.
cutuphalfdead wrote:so glad i don't see signatures
Let's be honest, there are an awful lot of songs you could use as go-to examples. They may be early-career songs, I don't know, but they're enough to put you off going any further.
RisingTides wrote:There is more kindness on the internet than we would care to admit to ourselves. Sometimes we are so afraid of falling victim to a ruse, we miss out on actual opportunities.
stip wrote:How can anyone only know Yellow Submarine? This is not 'oh, you only know pearl jam because of ten.' It's the fucking Beatles? How can there be a single music listener on this planet who is not very familiar with at least 20 of their songs.
Of course, but that's always they one (again in my own anecdotal experience) they all use as their go-to example of why the Beatles are terrible.
My go-to example is Obladi Oblada
Which I love, but totally understand people disliking. I'd say there are more than a fair amount of avid Beatles lovers that are too keen on that number.
Lament wrote:I gave a perfectly valid explanation for why the Beatles rarely cross my mind and aren't a band I care much about one way or the other, and not a single defender has even bothered to approach my explanation.
And for two reasons. 1: You defended yourself well. And 2: there's not much of a counter argument. No one can fight how you feel. You're explanation is valid and well put. But what further discussion does it demand?
It's not like you said you don't like the Beatles because they suck at harmonies. That's something we both could debate and discuss back and forth with specific examples. "They don't move me," while totally valid isn't really something that can be debated or discussed.
As long as it can still be dismissed as stupid, RM will never run out of discussion.
I certainly don't think "I've tried but they don't move me" is stupid. Far from.
You don't, but others in this thread do. And it's not like we didn't already have these long debates about The Beatles OMG BEST BAND EVER on this very board and it's a pretty common reaction.
I wasn't dismissing your post, just defending myself.
stip wrote:How can anyone only know Yellow Submarine? This is not 'oh, you only know pearl jam because of ten.' It's the fucking Beatles? How can there be a single music listener on this planet who is not very familiar with at least 20 of their songs.
Of course, but that's always they one (again in my own anecdotal experience) they all use as their go-to example of why the Beatles are terrible.
My go-to example is Obladi Oblada
Which I love, but totally understand people disliking. I'd say there are more than a fair amount of avid Beatles lovers that are too keen on that number.
it's a typical McCartney song - he always went a bit over the line on the 'cutesy' scale, imo - I was never thrilled with that one, or Maxwell's Silver Hammer - those types of his songs
Dev wrote:you're delusional. you are a sad sad person. fuck off. you're mentally ill beyond repair. i don't need your shit. dissapear.
harmless wrote:Let's be honest, there are an awful lot of songs you could use as go-to examples. They may be early-career songs, I don't know, but they're enough to put you off going any further.
I'll respectfully disagree.
Those early pop songs are some of best pop songs I've ever heard. Twist and Shout, It's Only Love, Paperback Writer, Eight Days a Week, even I Want To Hold Your Hand, are pure orgasms to these ears. And it surprises me that they'd turn you off so much. Are you a pretty big pop fan?
stip wrote:How can anyone only know Yellow Submarine? This is not 'oh, you only know pearl jam because of ten.' It's the fucking Beatles? How can there be a single music listener on this planet who is not very familiar with at least 20 of their songs.
Of course, but that's always they one (again in my own anecdotal experience) they all use as their go-to example of why the Beatles are terrible.
My go-to example is Obladi Oblada
Which I love, but totally understand people disliking. I'd say there are more than a fair amount of avid Beatles lovers that are too keen on that number.
it's a typical McCartney song - he always went a bit over the line on the 'cutesy' scale, imo - I was never thrilled with that one, or Maxwell's Silver Hammer - those types of his songs
I get that. When I first got into the Beatles, it was because of John. It took me a while to come around on Paul. Especially these types of songs. But I think Maxwell's Silver Hammer is pretty fucking dark. Far from cutesy.
harmless wrote:Let's be honest, there are an awful lot of songs you could use as go-to examples. They may be early-career songs, I don't know, but they're enough to put you off going any further.
I'll respectfully disagree.
Those early pop songs are some of best pop songs I've ever heard. Twist and Shout, It's Only Love, Paperback Writer, Eight Days a Week, even I Want To Hold Your Hand, are pure orgasms to these ears. And it surprises me that they'd turn you off so much. Are you a pretty big pop fan?
Anders wrote:I do not have a «neoliberal assessment of geopolitics», so please stop writing that I do.
harmless wrote:Let's be honest, there are an awful lot of songs you could use as go-to examples. They may be early-career songs, I don't know, but they're enough to put you off going any further.
I'll respectfully disagree.
Those early pop songs are some of best pop songs I've ever heard. Twist and Shout, It's Only Love, Paperback Writer, Eight Days a Week, even I Want To Hold Your Hand, are pure orgasms to these ears. And it surprises me that they'd turn you off so much. Are you a pretty big pop fan?
harmless wrote:Let's be honest, there are an awful lot of songs you could use as go-to examples. They may be early-career songs, I don't know, but they're enough to put you off going any further.
I'll respectfully disagree.
Those early pop songs are some of best pop songs I've ever heard. Twist and Shout, It's Only Love, Paperback Writer, Eight Days a Week, even I Want To Hold Your Hand, are pure orgasms to these ears. And it surprises me that they'd turn you off so much. Are you a pretty big pop fan?
I like pop songs that I like. I love pop songs that I love. I just don't accept the thesis that if you love pop songs, you'll obviously love Beatles pop songs. That's the attitude I've felt coming from Beatles fans all the time, this idea that the Beatles wrote the archetypal pop song and that you must hate pop if you don't like Yellow Submarine, I Wanna Hold Your Hand, Obla-di Obla-da, Twist and Shout etc. They're OK, but just as an example, nothing is going on in Twist and Shout that wasn't going on in better 50's rock-and-roll songs before it. There's nothing really revolutionary about these songs. I accept that the Beatles' real revolutionary work was done later on in their career, but although I like some of that, it's not enough for me to say the Beatles are a legendary band or anything, because there are too many of those trite pop songs in the way. And the strangest thing is that the Beatles fans I've met have included those cute little pop songs amongst their best work, which hasn't inspired any confidence in this newbie.
RisingTides wrote:There is more kindness on the internet than we would care to admit to ourselves. Sometimes we are so afraid of falling victim to a ruse, we miss out on actual opportunities.
I think "Paperback Writer" is a good song. "Helter-Skelter" is more my thing.
RisingTides wrote:There is more kindness on the internet than we would care to admit to ourselves. Sometimes we are so afraid of falling victim to a ruse, we miss out on actual opportunities.
harmless wrote:Let's be honest, there are an awful lot of songs you could use as go-to examples. They may be early-career songs, I don't know, but they're enough to put you off going any further.
I'll respectfully disagree.
Those early pop songs are some of best pop songs I've ever heard. Twist and Shout, It's Only Love, Paperback Writer, Eight Days a Week, even I Want To Hold Your Hand, are pure orgasms to these ears. And it surprises me that they'd turn you off so much. Are you a pretty big pop fan?
I like pop songs that I like. I love pop songs that I love. I just don't accept the thesis that if you love pop songs, you'll obviously love Beatles pop songs. That's the attitude I've felt coming from Beatles fans all the time, this idea that the Beatles wrote the archetypal pop song and that you must hate pop if you don't like Yellow Submarine, I Wanna Hold Your Hand, Obla-di Obla-da, Twist and Shout etc. They're OK, but just as an example, nothing is going on in Twist and Shout that wasn't going on in better 50's rock-and-roll songs before it. There's nothing really revolutionary about these songs. I accept that the Beatles' real revolutionary work was done later on in their career, but although I like some of that, it's not enough for me to say the Beatles are a legendary band or anything, because there are too many of those trite pop songs in the way. And the strangest thing is that the Beatles fans I've met have included those cute little pop songs amongst their best work, which hasn't inspired any confidence in this newbie.
I'm not saying if you love pop you have to love Beatles pop, but it is surprising to find those people. Because, to me, the Beatles did that stuff so damn well. One would think that whatever qualities you're connecting to in pop music in general are present in those Beatles songs. Obviously, for you, that's not the case. Nothing wrong with it, but it is surprising to me.
I'm not as concerned with revolutionary as others seem to be. And the Beatles didn't pretend those early records were revolutionary, either. They were paying homage to their heroes. And doing a damn fine job of it at that.
Twist and Shout has that vocal, that's what it has going for it that so many other 50s rock-and-roll songs before it (and after) don't have.
harmless wrote:I think "Paperback Writer" is a good song. "Helter-Skelter" is more my thing.
You've heard the White Album, right? I think you said that earlier. What do you think of songs like While My Guitar Gently Weeps and Happiness Is A Warm Gun?
For the record, "Twist and Shout" is an older rock-and-roll song that the Beatles covered. I wouldn't offer it as an example of their pop songwriting because, well, they didn't write it.
Anders wrote:I do not have a «neoliberal assessment of geopolitics», so please stop writing that I do.
stip wrote:And whether or not what I inferred from your post was something you intentionally implied, I definitely read that out of it. I wonder if I was the only one.
People can infer what they want, but when you say "note, again the initial assumption you made here, that..." and then put something I specifically didn't say in quotation marks, that's putting words in my mouth, not an "inference."
You're free to start whatever type of thread you want. But I maintain that when the Beatles fans came in here and started in with the "if you don't like the Beatles you're insane" bit, they gave you exactly what you asked for by starting the thread the way you did.
