5-10: Help Help vs. Education

Post by **stip** » Thu March 27, 2025 9:29 pm

Help Help vs. Education

Post by **stip** » Thu March 27, 2025 9:33 pm

Two similar 'can't trust what you think you know' style songs. Prefer education, even though the music is a bit better on Help Help. It didn't quite lean into the 'everything is cracked and falling apart' feeling as much as it could have. It had a higher ceiling than education (which also got a bit of a boost from my 'holy shit so many songs I didn't know' discovery of Lost Dogs), but education executes a bit better

Leatherhead · Post by **Leatherhead** » Thu March 27, 2025 11:26 pm

I like Education, but Help Help is much better.

Birds in Hell · Post by **Birds in Hell** » Thu March 27, 2025 11:29 pm

I like both of these but Education really scratches an itch.

Post by **epilogue** » Thu March 27, 2025 11:34 pm

These are both top tier PJ. Man!

Help Help, though, happens to be my favorite song on my favorite PJ record. So, it gets my vote.

Matters · Post by **Matters** » Fri March 28, 2025 1:00 am

Help Help is one of their best. The whole band is on fire.

wease · Post by **wease** » Fri March 28, 2025 2:14 am

Dig them both. Tough choice.

Monkey_Driven · Post by **Monkey_Driven** » Fri March 28, 2025 4:40 am

Help Help

Anders · Post by **Anders** » Fri March 28, 2025 6:47 am

Education

Post by **stip** » Fri March 28, 2025 10:33 am

epilogue wrote:These are both top tier PJ. Man!

Help Help, though, happens to be my favorite song on my favorite PJ record. So, it gets my vote.

really? tell me more

Post by **epilogue** » Fri March 28, 2025 1:47 pm

stip wrote:
epilogue wrote:These are both top tier PJ. Man!

Help Help, though, happens to be my favorite song on my favorite PJ record. So, it gets my vote.
really? tell me more

Sure! What would you like to know more about?

Post by **stip** » Fri March 28, 2025 2:27 pm

Just what you get out of help help. I'm not sure I've ever heard someone declare it a favorite (other than you)

Post by **stip** » Fri March 28, 2025 2:28 pm

granted, riot act is one of the only pearl jam albums that doesn't have a centerpiece song. Maybe I Am Mine or LBC were intended to play that role, but neither was fully successful.

wease · Post by **wease** » Fri March 28, 2025 2:37 pm

stip wrote:granted, riot act is one of the only pearl jam albums that doesn't have a centerpiece song. Maybe I Am Mine or LBC were intended to play that role, but neither was fully successful.

You Are could be a contender as well.

Post by **epilogue** » Fri March 28, 2025 3:08 pm

stip wrote:Just what you get out of help help. I'm not sure I've ever heard someone declare it a favorite (other than you)

Oh man, yeah, I just love everything about it. The mood/tone especially. The opening percussion is so intoxicating, so inviting. It's like someone is opening a secret door in the wall that you didn't know was there and gesturing you to follow them through it. "This shit's too good to be true, my dear" feels like the exact right sentiment.

The vocal layering/echo/reverb (whatever it is) on the "tell me lies" pre-chorus gives me chills. Winds me up. So much expectation, anticipation there...

Once the chorus explodes open! Man! Get out of here! Those drums just attack and that fuzzy guitar! I just want to bathe in that. It's so catchy, too. Just two words but they are so layered, they say so much. Help me...

Ed's vocals are some of my favorite on the album. They are so powerful --- not in that usual, anthemic, EDDY FUCKING VEDDER way. It's a different kind of power than that. It's a spell. A warning. Like he's saying, "this could go a couple different ways, man, you decide, motherfucker. But you better be sure."

The bridge is one of my all time favorite things PJ has ever done. It's so tense and kind of frightening. Reminds me of Tom Waits a lot. Feels like a song Tom could have written. His version would have been more stripped down, but just as percussive and frightening yet heroic. I bet David Lynch would have really dug this song.

The fucking guitars all through this thing! I don't know how it doesn't make you want to sweat and shake and punch the air until you're exhausted.

And the keys at the end that linger on... feels like church but in a subversive, sly way. It's like church as a pejorative. An insult. But it's also the exact release you need. It's like how good it sometimes feels to level the perfect insult on some shithead who deserves it. It's satisfying, that's what it is, those keys are satisfying.

I don't know, man. The song just speaks to me. Again, it's probably a mood/vibe thing more than anything else. But all the components work together to achieve something I find addictive. I want to listen to it again and again. It makes me want to take action but it also has me looking over my shoulder. IS there somone --- something --- behind me?

But I adore this whole album and I know a lot of RMers don't. To me, it's just peak. Evocative, potent, thought provoking, moving, heartbreaking... Riot Act isn't the obvious extroverted battle cry that many expected when we only had the title... but it is absolutely a battle cry nonetheless. And because it's so much more emotionally mature and nuanced than a screaming RAWK! record, every beat is earned (even the awkward or uncertain moments) and it has real staying power. Riot Act is a hard won victory. As such, it has aged so well for me. It just keeps getting better, keeps evolving, keeps accumulating meaning.

Help Help is one small microcosm of all of that. It's everything the entire album is in one tight punch. Also, at the end of the day... it just sounds SOOOOOO good.

Monkey_Driven · Post by **Monkey_Driven** » Fri March 28, 2025 3:26 pm

epilogue wrote:
stip wrote:Just what you get out of help help. I'm not sure I've ever heard someone declare it a favorite (other than you)
Oh man, yeah, I just love everything about it. The mood/tone especially. The opening percussion is so intoxicating, so inviting. It's like someone is opening a secret door in the wall that you didn't know was there and gesturing you to follow them through it. "This shit's too good to be true, my dear" feels like the exact right sentiment.

The vocal layering/echo/reverb (whatever it is) on the "tell me lies" pre-chorus gives me chills. Winds me up. So much expectation, anticipation there...

Once the chorus explodes open! Man! Get out of here! Those drums just attack and that fuzzy guitar! I just want to bathe in that. It's so catchy, too. Just two words but they are so layered, they say so much. Help me...

Ed's vocals are some of my favorite on the album. They are so powerful --- not in that usual, anthemic, EDDY FUCKING VEDDER way. It's a different kind of power than that. It's a spell. A warning. Like he's saying, "this could go a couple different ways, man, you decide, motherfucker. But you better be sure."

The bridge is one of my all time favorite things PJ has ever done. It's so tense and kind of frightening. Reminds me of Tom Waits a lot. Feels like a song Tom could have written. His version would have been more stripped down, but just as percussive and frightening yet heroic. I bet David Lynch would have really dug this song.

The fucking guitars all through this thing! I don't know how it doesn't make you want to sweat and shake and punch the air until you're exhausted.

And the keys at the end that linger on... feels like church but in a subversive, sly way. It's like church as a pejorative. An insult. But it's also the exact release you need. It's like how good it sometimes feels to level the perfect insult on some shithead who deserves it. It's satisfying, that's what it is, those keys are satisfying.

I don't know, man. The song just speaks to me. Again, it's probably a mood/vibe thing more than anything else. But all the components work together to achieve something I find addictive. I want to listen to it again and again. It makes me want to take action but it also has me looking over my shoulder. IS there somone --- something --- behind me?

But I adore this whole album and I know a lot of RMers don't. To me, it's just peak. Evocative, potent, thought provoking, moving, heartbreaking... Riot Act isn't the obvious extroverted battle cry that many expected when we only had the title... but it is absolutely a battle cry nonetheless. And because it's so much more emotionally mature and nuanced than a screaming RAWK! record, every beat is earned (even the awkward or uncertain moments) and it has real staying power. Riot Act is a hard won victory. As such, it has aged so well for me. It just keeps getting better, keeps evolving, keeps accumulating meaning.

Help Help is one small microcosm of all of that. It's everything the entire album is in one tight punch. Also, at the end of the day... it just sounds SOOOOOO good.

Kevin Davis · Post by **Kevin Davis** » Fri March 28, 2025 4:04 pm

Great post Joe — fellow RA lover here, but you knew that already.

Post by **stip** » Fri March 28, 2025 4:37 pm

To your point, while ST (a direct response to Riot Act) has more songs that crack my top tier, I appreciate (especially over time) Riot Act more as an artistic statement

Post by **epilogue** » Fri March 28, 2025 4:45 pm

stip wrote:To your point, while ST (a direct response to Riot Act) has more songs that crack my top tier, I appreciate (especially over time) Riot Act more as an artistic statement

Yes, well said. And I agree (with the overall sentiment; not with which album has more top tier songs per se). As much as ST is trying to recon with (and maybe even retcon?) RA, it feels much more hollow to me all these years on. RA feels more authentic and present. RA isn't trying to be some arbitrary idea of Pearl Jam the way that I feel ST does.

Post by **epilogue** » Fri March 28, 2025 4:45 pm

Kevin Davis wrote:Great post Joe — fellow RA lover here, but you knew that already.

Red Mosquito