Song of the Moment: Sirens

[stip]

That is an attack on the song

Sirens will be so upset.

[Oversize]

Still hearing this quite a bit on California's Central Coast (107.3). No signs of a down-turn here.

What thread are we using to speculate on the next single?

I was thinking there may be a choice to make...

To avoid having their "grunge cards" pulled, they should probably do what they did with Just Breathe/Got Some, and release SBM on a double-single. The question I would raise is whether to make Getaway or LB the flip side of that single.

I almost lean towards Getaway, so that you can still release Lightning Bolt soon thereafter if it does not have any legs....

[stip]

Still hearing this quite a bit on California's Central Coast (107.3). No signs of a down-turn here.

What thread are we using to speculate on the next single?

I was thinking there may be a choice to make...

To avoid having their "grunge cards" pulled, they should probably do what they did with Just Breathe/Got Some, and release SBM on a double-single. The question I would raise is whether to make Getaway or LB the flip side of that single.

I almost lean towards Getaway, so that you can still release Lightning Bolt soon thereafter if it does not have any legs....

the main album thread.

I wonder why they don't aggressively release more singles.

[stupidmop]

Still hearing this quite a bit on California's Central Coast (107.3). No signs of a down-turn here.

What thread are we using to speculate on the next single?

I was thinking there may be a choice to make...

To avoid having their "grunge cards" pulled, they should probably do what they did with Just Breathe/Got Some, and release SBM on a double-single. The question I would raise is whether to make Getaway or LB the flip side of that single.

I almost lean towards Getaway, so that you can still release Lightning Bolt soon thereafter if it does not have any legs....

the main album thread.

I wonder why they don't aggressively release more singles.

They were going to but then they saw the moneygrab thread and felt bad.

[stip]

[stip]

but seriously--McP, answer that please.

[surfndestroy]

a few weeks ago, some dude on the national radio talked about "how hard it is to be a grunge band in 2013" and played a snippet of Sirens to show how badly some Seattle bands have aged and he went on to make Bon Jovi comparisons. i was a bit angry at first since i know that this song isn't representative of how PJ sounds and that it's not as cheesy as a Bon Jovi ballad but it made me realize that, like it or not, Eddie and Co. went there and used the power ballad medium and released this song as a single. the worst thing about it is that it's not even a hit. talk about making a fool out of yourself. that song would have been perfect, honest and heartfelt had it been stripped off the gloss and clichés of the genre.

I think Sirens has just about everything in common with a Bon Jovi song. Vocals way out in the front, tiny and boring as hell drums, cheese, ever produced. About the only differences you could tell between the two is Bon Jovi's possibly a better singer at this stage of the game and Ed's the better lyricist.

[Strat]

a few weeks ago, some dude on the national radio talked about "how hard it is to be a grunge band in 2013" and played a snippet of Sirens to show how badly some Seattle bands have aged and he went on to make Bon Jovi comparisons. i was a bit angry at first since i know that this song isn't representative of how PJ sounds and that it's not as cheesy as a Bon Jovi ballad but it made me realize that, like it or not, Eddie and Co. went there and used the power ballad medium and released this song as a single. the worst thing about it is that it's not even a hit. talk about making a fool out of yourself. that song would have been perfect, honest and heartfelt had it been stripped off the gloss and clichés of the genre.

I think Sirens has just about everything in common with a Bon Jovi song. Vocals way out in the front, tiny and boring as hell drums, cheese, ever produced. About the only differences you could tell between the two is Bon Jovi's possibly a better singer at this stage of the game and Ed's the better lyricist.

Funny enough, I saw a Bon Jovi performance on Palladium a couple weeks ago. No chance in hell Bon Jovi is a better singer. He sounded brutal. he basically didnt sing at all.

[VinylGuy]

i wonder why they arent releasing a third single right now and why they dont play in SNL.

[corduroy2121]

I swear I hear Sirens on the radio every day here in Pittsburgh, and I'm only in the car 20 minutes a day. It's getting played on both the classic rock and modern/alternative stations

[southp]

I swear I hear Sirens on the radio every day here in Pittsburgh, and I'm only in the car 20 minutes a day. It's getting played on both the classic rock and modern/alternative stations

Whenever I catch it on the radio I have to listen to the whole thing.

[sweeper]

i wonder why they arent releasing a third single right now and why they dont play in SNL.

Bands don't release a 3rd single when the 2nd one hasn't died off or begun to fall off the cliff. Sirens is effectively holding steady (at a good level) with airplay so it very much still has life. They're going to milk it for all it's worth because the minute they introduce the 3rd single (an unknown as far as success), many stations will stop playing Sirens.

Most successful radio singles run for about 4 months before another one is introduced. Sirens is just approaching the 3 month mark right now. I don't think we'll see anything else until mid-January at the earliest. I wouldn't be shocked if it's February either.

[VinylGuy]

i wonder why they arent releasing a third single right now and why they dont play in SNL.

Bands don't release a 3rd single when the 2nd one hasn't died off or begun to fall off the cliff. Sirens is effectively holding steady (at a good level) with airplay so it very much still has life. They're going to milk it for all it's worth because the minute they introduce the 3rd single (an unknown as far as success), many stations will stop playing Sirens.

Most successful radio singles run for about 4 months before another one is introduced. Sirens is just approaching the 3 month mark right now. I don't think we'll see anything else until mid-January at the earliest. I wouldn't be shocked if it's February either.

Seems reasonable. I dont listen to radio at all, so i dont have a clue to what is happening to sirens.

[BladeRunner]

Sirens is getting shitload of airplay here in mainstream rock radio, it's almost on every hour!! They're coming for the Big Day Out in January so wouldn't surprise me if a third single gets released soon. Hard to know which song but I believe Lightning Bolt would be very good follow up IMO.

[red calzolaio]

i wonder why they arent releasing a third single right now and why they dont play in SNL.

Bands don't release a 3rd single when the 2nd one hasn't died off or begun to fall off the cliff. Sirens is effectively holding steady (at a good level) with airplay so it very much still has life. They're going to milk it for all it's worth because the minute they introduce the 3rd single (an unknown as far as success), many stations will stop playing Sirens.

Most successful radio singles run for about 4 months before another one is introduced. Sirens is just approaching the 3 month mark right now. I don't think we'll see anything else until mid-January at the earliest. I wouldn't be shocked if it's February either.

lies.

[McParadigm]

i wonder why they arent releasing a third single right now and why they dont play in SNL.

Bands don't release a 3rd single when the 2nd one hasn't died off or begun to fall off the cliff. Sirens is effectively holding steady (at a good level) with airplay so it very much still has life. They're going to milk it for all it's worth because the minute they introduce the 3rd single (an unknown as far as success), many stations will stop playing Sirens.

Most successful radio singles run for about 4 months before another one is introduced. Sirens is just approaching the 3 month mark right now. I don't think we'll see anything else until mid-January at the earliest. I wouldn't be shocked if it's February either.

This is inaccurate. Industry logic says that a new single takes two to three weeks to begin building momentum, so new singles are usually prepped and ready to go as soon as the current release begins to wane. Just what this "waning" looks like depends on the single in question. A #1 hit in a niche format like rock might see its follow-up released before it leaves the top ten, while a #1 hit on the hot 100 might be significantly further down the chart before that happens. A song that gets a couple of weeks in the 11-20 area of a single format might get its successor released in a matter of weeks, or not at all. And if singles are different enough from one another in tone and style that they aren't likely to interrupt each others' successes, it might come even earlier than that (see: Sirens being released a little over two months after Manners, which was barely past its peak audience moment at that point) Sirens is now in its fifth consecutive week of reduced plays.

Basically, the idea is to prevent any awareness gap if you can. If someone gets excited about the new single, you want them to be able to quickly recall the other two as well...that kind of compounding is why even middling third singles can help maintain sales for long stretches after the fact. Waiting too long, on the other hand, can cost you dearly. You may remember that the S/T record was supported by a huge media push, magazine covers, and the introduction of the band's first post-2000 radio hit (WWS), but that Suicide had been off the charts for over a month before Life Wasted was introduced. This not only denied Life Wasted any momentum support from Suicide, but basically meant that it had no effect on sales of the record, which had fallen off the charts by then and never reappeared. Conversely, The Fixer was an even bigger hit than Suicide, and Just Breathe was again issued just a little over two months into its run, while it was still riding high. Both songs were very much helped by this maneuver, and the album bumped around the lower ends of the charts for MONTHS longer than any Pearl Jam record had post-Vitalogy.

Other factors can influence a release...it often helps to time a new single to your new tour in the US, but only if its a lengthy, multi-region event. I don't think that's likely to be an issue here.

Basically, if you're Imagine Dragons and your single is in the US top twenty, you might wait five months to release the follow-up, because that's how long it can take for a single of that size to start trending downwards. Working that way plays out in your favor, because it helps you avoid oversaturation. If you're Alice in Chains part deux, or Pearl Jam part old, then your last album did much better relative to the industry than was expected partially because you were issuing singles every 3 months, keeping people aware that you were out there.

[sweeper]

i wonder why they arent releasing a third single right now and why they dont play in SNL.

Bands don't release a 3rd single when the 2nd one hasn't died off or begun to fall off the cliff. Sirens is effectively holding steady (at a good level) with airplay so it very much still has life. They're going to milk it for all it's worth because the minute they introduce the 3rd single (an unknown as far as success), many stations will stop playing Sirens.

Most successful radio singles run for about 4 months before another one is introduced. Sirens is just approaching the 3 month mark right now. I don't think we'll see anything else until mid-January at the earliest. I wouldn't be shocked if it's February either.

This is inaccurate. Industry logic says that a new single takes two to three weeks to begin building momentum, so new singles are usually prepped and ready to go as soon as the current release begins to wane. Just what this "waning" looks like depends on the single in question. A #1 hit in a niche format like rock might see its follow-up released before it leaves the top ten, while a #1 hit on the hot 100 might be significantly further down the chart before that happens. A song that gets a couple of weeks in the 11-20 area of a single format might get its successor released in a matter of weeks, or not at all. And if singles are different enough from one another in tone and style that they aren't likely to interrupt each others' successes, it might come even earlier than that (see: Sirens being released a little over two months after Manners, which was barely past its peak audience moment at that point) Sirens is now in its fifth consecutive week of reduced plays.

Basically, the idea is to prevent any awareness gap if you can. If someone gets excited about the new single, you want them to be able to quickly recall the other two as well...that kind of compounding is why even middling third singles can help maintain sales for long stretches after the fact. Waiting too long, on the other hand, can cost you dearly. You may remember that the S/T record was supported by a huge media push, magazine covers, and the introduction of the band's first post-2000 radio hit (WWS), but that Suicide had been off the charts for over a month before Life Wasted was introduced. This not only denied Life Wasted any momentum support from Suicide, but basically meant that it had no effect on sales of the record, which had fallen off the charts by then and never reappeared. Conversely, The Fixer was an even bigger hit than Suicide, and Just Breathe was again issued just a little over two months into its run, while it was still riding high. Both songs were very much helped by this maneuver, and the album bumped around the lower ends of the charts for MONTHS longer than any Pearl Jam record had post-Vitalogy.

Other factors can influence a release...it often helps to time a new single to your new tour in the US, but only if its a lengthy, multi-region event. I don't think that's likely to be an issue here.

Basically, if you're Imagine Dragons and your single is in the US top twenty, you might wait five months to release the follow-up, because that's how long it can take for a single of that size to start trending downwards. Working that way plays out in your favor, because it helps you avoid oversaturation. If you're Alice in Chains part deux, or Pearl Jam part old, then your last album did much better relative to the industry than was expected partially because you were issuing singles every 3 months, keeping people aware that you were out there.

Where do you see Sirens dipping for a 5th consecutive week? When I look at AllAccess.com, it shows its airplay #s up week over week in both the Active Rock and Alternative formats. That's pretty impressive given that it's probably fighting for plays against some Christmas music as well.

I have a different recollection of Mind Your Manners and The Fixer than you. They had both waned significantly and that's why the next singles were released after only 2 months. To me, it's pretty simple: you milk the current single for all it's worth and roll out a new one when necessary. I think PJ's actions with Sirens prove this out pretty well. It's still holding up so there are no signs of a 3rd single just yet. If it had dipped at the 2 month mark like MYM (or The Fixer), we'd have already seen a 3rd single released. The same thing happened with Just Breath. It had a longer shelf life than The Fixer so it took longer for Amongst the Waves to hit radio.

[sweeper]

i wonder why they arent releasing a third single right now and why they dont play in SNL.

Bands don't release a 3rd single when the 2nd one hasn't died off or begun to fall off the cliff. Sirens is effectively holding steady (at a good level) with airplay so it very much still has life. They're going to milk it for all it's worth because the minute they introduce the 3rd single (an unknown as far as success), many stations will stop playing Sirens.

Most successful radio singles run for about 4 months before another one is introduced. Sirens is just approaching the 3 month mark right now. I don't think we'll see anything else until mid-January at the earliest. I wouldn't be shocked if it's February either.

lies.

I'd be curious to hear of any band that has released a follow-up single at the 3 month mark when its current single is still top 5 in Alternative plays and is trending up in the rock charts. That's pretty much the crux of my points above.

[McParadigm]

Where do you see Sirens dipping for a 5th consecutive week? When I look at AllAccess.com, it shows its airplay #s up week over week in both the Active Rock and Alternative formats. That's pretty impressive given that it's probably fighting for plays against some Christmas music as well.

Sirens experienced a small bump in number of plays on some formats (from 1,852 to 1,873 on Active...not exactly remarkable), but more than offset this with large shifts in time frame and audience sizes. As often occurs with singles that are beginning to fade in popularity, rock programers are shuffling more and more of its plays to the overnight hours. It is also beginning to get dropped from some influential large-draw stations...its total audience estimation right now is a little under 12 million, down nearly 3 million from four weeks ago.

I have a different recollection of Mind Your Manners and The Fixer than you. They had both waned significantly and that's why the next singles were released after only 2 months.

The Fixer was at #5 on the Alt chart and #11 on the Mainstream chart the week that Just Breathe was released (its peaks were #3 and #10, respectively). It remained in the Alt chart top ten for 5 more weeks after Just Breathe was released, and hung around on the rock charts for another 3 months after that.

As for Manners, it was #3 on Active Rock with 1,762 plays the week that Sirens was issued (September 18). Literally the week before was its peak performance week on that format, with 1,784, and it remained on that chart into November. It was #20 on Alt radio, though it never went top ten there to begin with, and #5 on Mainstream (it stayed on this chart until November, as well).

[BladeRunner]

Wouldn't surprise me if Pearl Jam went four or even five deep with singles off this record. Remember that not all singles have videos or even get released 'in physical' format, they may just be Radio Promos only like the Versus/ Vitalogy era. Listening to Lightning Bolt there seems to be at least six or seven single-worthy songs on it so it would be a waste to not release a few. The title track, SBM, Swallowed Whole and Getaway all seem fitting IMO.