Vedder is McCartney ; McCartney is Vedder

[hlniv]

Neil Young must be rolling over in his grave right now.

I had to read this three times before it hit me that Neil Young is not, in fact, deceased.

[Mine]

Pop singer albums skewed old even at that point. It's the same reason Garth Brooks went from OMG big as Beatles to "remember him?" Cultural lasting records are a part of a different kind of ongoing story...The Monkees had the top selling album of 1967, but they weren't part of that story.

But think of the music scene just before Ten. The overlap between pop and (hard) rock was very substantial both musically and in the way it was promoted and "consumed" by the public. Many power ballads were labelled hard rock for instance. Rock either more or less hard or more or less mainstream or essentially pop with distorted guitars had a huge audience. Ten is musically very related to that scene. Everyone who argues the music is inspired by earlier styles should take in consideration that all of the 80's rock also was.
I think Ten's commercial success had a lot to do with it's "familiar" sound at the time. It was both part of the scene that would be on it's way out in a year and the one that was coming after it. The biggest difference between 10 and a ton of 80's albums is Ed's vocal style.
The fact that most of it's audience was very young isn't surprising either and it's part of the reason it didn't age all that well. Ten didn't offer anything interesting to people who where familiar with the previous 3 decades of rock and it aged accordingly. Ten's "life" has many elements of typically mainstream records because it's what it essentially was.

Ten has aged very well--it just sounds out of place with the rest of pearl jam's catalog. It still moves a fair amount of copies every month

You know there is a Alanis Morisette fan on a forum that argues the same things using the same arguments you are but about Jagged Little Pill at this very moment.

[stupidmop]

More graphs, thats what this thread needs.

[BurtReynolds]

Pop singer albums skewed old even at that point. It's the same reason Garth Brooks went from OMG big as Beatles to "remember him?" Cultural lasting records are a part of a different kind of ongoing story...The Monkees had the top selling album of 1967, but they weren't part of that story.

But think of the music scene just before Ten. The overlap between pop and (hard) rock was very substantial both musically and in the way it was promoted and "consumed" by the public. Many power ballads were labelled hard rock for instance. Rock either more or less hard or more or less mainstream or essentially pop with distorted guitars had a huge audience. Ten is musically very related to that scene. Everyone who argues the music is inspired by earlier styles should take in consideration that all of the 80's rock also was.
I think Ten's commercial success had a lot to do with it's "familiar" sound at the time. It was both part of the scene that would be on it's way out in a year and the one that was coming after it. The biggest difference between 10 and a ton of 80's albums is Ed's vocal style.
The fact that most of it's audience was very young isn't surprising either and it's part of the reason it didn't age all that well. Ten didn't offer anything interesting to people who where familiar with the previous 3 decades of rock and it aged accordingly. Ten's "life" has many elements of typically mainstream records because it's what it essentially was.

Ten has aged very well--it just sounds out of place with the rest of pearl jam's catalog. It still moves a fair amount of copies every month

You know there is a Alanis Morisette fan on a forum that argues the same things using the same arguments you are but about Jagged Little Pill at this very moment.

that's an absurd comparison for so many reasons. if Ten "hasn't aged well", which I'm not even sure what that means, it would only be because it was so heavily copied by shitty 90s altrock bands, not because of any connection to 80s music. It was such a huge influence on 90s radio rock, which was different than 80s rock, therefore Ten is solidly 90s rock. it's not even close really.

[stip]

Pop singer albums skewed old even at that point. It's the same reason Garth Brooks went from OMG big as Beatles to "remember him?" Cultural lasting records are a part of a different kind of ongoing story...The Monkees had the top selling album of 1967, but they weren't part of that story.

But think of the music scene just before Ten. The overlap between pop and (hard) rock was very substantial both musically and in the way it was promoted and "consumed" by the public. Many power ballads were labelled hard rock for instance. Rock either more or less hard or more or less mainstream or essentially pop with distorted guitars had a huge audience. Ten is musically very related to that scene. Everyone who argues the music is inspired by earlier styles should take in consideration that all of the 80's rock also was.
I think Ten's commercial success had a lot to do with it's "familiar" sound at the time. It was both part of the scene that would be on it's way out in a year and the one that was coming after it. The biggest difference between 10 and a ton of 80's albums is Ed's vocal style.
The fact that most of it's audience was very young isn't surprising either and it's part of the reason it didn't age all that well. Ten didn't offer anything interesting to people who where familiar with the previous 3 decades of rock and it aged accordingly. Ten's "life" has many elements of typically mainstream records because it's what it essentially was.

Ten has aged very well--it just sounds out of place with the rest of pearl jam's catalog. It still moves a fair amount of copies every month

You know there is a Alanis Morisette fan on a forum that argues the same things using the same arguments you are but about Jagged Little Pill at this very moment.

If Jagged Little Pill still sold at a respectable clip there would probably be something to that argument. My point is that if there is an ongoing interest in a record 20 years after it came out it's hard to say it didn't age well.

[Anders]

Jagged Little Pill is ok. It's no Ten obviously. Saw Alanis live in 96 at Roskilde, one of my first proper concerts, and it was a good experience.

Also saw Neil Young, Rage ATM, Sepultura, RHCP, Bowie and more alongside 120.000 people. Good times.

[digster]

Pop singer albums skewed old even at that point. It's the same reason Garth Brooks went from OMG big as Beatles to "remember him?" Cultural lasting records are a part of a different kind of ongoing story...The Monkees had the top selling album of 1967, but they weren't part of that story.

But think of the music scene just before Ten. The overlap between pop and (hard) rock was very substantial both musically and in the way it was promoted and "consumed" by the public. Many power ballads were labelled hard rock for instance. Rock either more or less hard or more or less mainstream or essentially pop with distorted guitars had a huge audience. Ten is musically very related to that scene. Everyone who argues the music is inspired by earlier styles should take in consideration that all of the 80's rock also was.
I think Ten's commercial success had a lot to do with it's "familiar" sound at the time. It was both part of the scene that would be on it's way out in a year and the one that was coming after it. The biggest difference between 10 and a ton of 80's albums is Ed's vocal style.
The fact that most of it's audience was very young isn't surprising either and it's part of the reason it didn't age all that well. Ten didn't offer anything interesting to people who where familiar with the previous 3 decades of rock and it aged accordingly. Ten's "life" has many elements of typically mainstream records because it's what it essentially was.

Ten has aged very well--it just sounds out of place with the rest of pearl jam's catalog. It still moves a fair amount of copies every month

You know there is a Alanis Morisette fan on a forum that argues the same things using the same arguments you are but about Jagged Little Pill at this very moment.

If Jagged Little Pill still sold at a respectable clip there would probably be something to that argument. My point is that if there is an ongoing interest in a record 20 years after it came out it's hard to say it didn't age well.

Agreed. PJ fans are really the only people I think that seem to have an issue with Ten. It's easily the record they're most well-known and celebrated for, and people still talk positively about it (or talk about it all, unlike the Jagged Little Pill comparison).

[Mine]

Pop singer albums skewed old even at that point. It's the same reason Garth Brooks went from OMG big as Beatles to "remember him?" Cultural lasting records are a part of a different kind of ongoing story...The Monkees had the top selling album of 1967, but they weren't part of that story.

But think of the music scene just before Ten. The overlap between pop and (hard) rock was very substantial both musically and in the way it was promoted and "consumed" by the public. Many power ballads were labelled hard rock for instance. Rock either more or less hard or more or less mainstream or essentially pop with distorted guitars had a huge audience. Ten is musically very related to that scene. Everyone who argues the music is inspired by earlier styles should take in consideration that all of the 80's rock also was.
I think Ten's commercial success had a lot to do with it's "familiar" sound at the time. It was both part of the scene that would be on it's way out in a year and the one that was coming after it. The biggest difference between 10 and a ton of 80's albums is Ed's vocal style.
The fact that most of it's audience was very young isn't surprising either and it's part of the reason it didn't age all that well. Ten didn't offer anything interesting to people who where familiar with the previous 3 decades of rock and it aged accordingly. Ten's "life" has many elements of typically mainstream records because it's what it essentially was.

Ten has aged very well--it just sounds out of place with the rest of pearl jam's catalog. It still moves a fair amount of copies every month

You know there is a Alanis Morisette fan on a forum that argues the same things using the same arguments you are but about Jagged Little Pill at this very moment.

If Jagged Little Pill still sold at a respectable clip there would probably be something to that argument. My point is that if there is an ongoing interest in a record 20 years after it came out it's hard to say it didn't age well.

I have no idea how much is selling to be honest. Maybe McP does. The argument about not ageing well is a relative one. Ten isn't considered THE album of that period. For some reason Nevermind is, as Nirvana is considered the by far most representative band. I'm not a fan btw. it's just that Ten seems to have aged considerably worse considering that both albums sold practically the same in the US. The cultural event didn't really leave all the much behind and Ten's popularity isn't unlike many of the kids' obsessions in a band that lasts for a season. I'm not attributing all of it's success to that btw but i believe it's a bigger part of it that a PJ fan is willing to admit.

[Mine]

If Jagged Little Pill still sold at a respectable clip

Ten is helped by existing in a lot of versions both original and remastered in that regard.

[digster]

This is the first I'm hearing that Ten has aged poorly to the world at large.

[BurtReynolds]

Ten is practically the definition of an album with longevity. I don't know what Mine is talking about. it was a juggernaut for years. sure, it's not doing much right now, but Christ. Nevermind is THE Grunge album, sure, but Ten is THE OTHER grunge album.

[Mine]

Ok i give up.
Ten is the best rock album ever released. Hell it's the best music ever created. It's the most influential album of all times. In fact every album conceived after its release is largely influenced by it. It made every other piece of music irrelevant by comparison and it still does. It's innovative, ground breaking, not derivative at all even if it borrowed a solo from a band that borrowed it from another.

[stip]

yeah, I wonder if this needs to be chalked up to trans-Atlantic differences.

[stip]

Ok i give up.
Ten is the best rock album ever released. Hell it's the best music ever created. It's the most influential album of all times. In fact every album conceived after its release is largely influenced by it. It made every other piece of music irrelevant by comparison and it still does. It's innovative, ground breaking, not derivative at all even if it borrowed a solo from a band that borrowed it from another.

well lets not go nuts. It's no Jagged Little Pill or Cracked Rearview

[Anders]

I still think most PJ songs that casual or non fans know are Ten songs like Alive, Jeremy, Black and Even Flow. For those that really don't know any rock music, they might still acknowledge Alive if they hear it. It's THE Pearl Jam album.

[BurtReynolds]

Ok i give up.
Ten is the best rock album ever released. Hell it's the best music ever created. It's the most influential album of all times. In fact every album conceived after its release is largely influenced by it. It made every other piece of music irrelevant by comparison and it still does. It's innovative, ground breaking, not derivative at all even if it borrowed a solo from a band that borrowed it from another.

well that just sounds like an overreaction.

[Anders]

yeah, I wonder if this needs to be chalked up to trans-Atlantic differences.

No, Ten is easily best known in Europe as well. Sometimes I hear Small Town or Corduroy in a pub or a commercial or something, but that doesn't change what Ten is to the casual fan.

[stip]

I don't mean where Ten stands relative to the rest of the catalog--I'm speaking more in terms of its cultural footprint.

[hlniv]

Ok i give up.
Ten is the best rock album ever released. Hell it's the best music ever created. It's the most influential album of all times. In fact every album conceived after its release is largely influenced by it. It made every other piece of music irrelevant by comparison and it still does. It's innovative, ground breaking, not derivative at all even if it borrowed a solo from a band that borrowed it from another.

No, that would be Human Clay. Even PJ copied it prior to its release.

[Mine]

yeah, I wonder if this needs to be chalked up to trans-Atlantic differences.

It absolutely is, i admit it. Ten and Nevermind sold about the same in the US but Nevermind sold considerably more elsewhere and Pearl Jam is a band who you either know well or not at all. I do wonder why Nevermind/Nirvana ended up having such an edge over Ten and Pearl Jam though, because judging but what I'm reading here it doesn't make a lot of sense.