Masculism

[mookie]

do we need to revisit the whole men die sooner than women bullshit? men die sooner thus leaving old women to fend for themselves and generally becoming poverty stricken and disenfranchised by the society.

how is that a disadvantage?

Demographically, this statistic is drastically skewed towards women who live in rural areas or who are already living near or below the poverty line. Figures post-1990 suggest that about 15-20 percent of women experience a change of economic class due to loss of a spouse, and almost all of those are rural, non-whites, or a combination thereof. Almost literally none of them are in the top 40% economically.

So is this a gender issue, or another class abandonment issue?

it's a gender issue for the women affected. what do those women do in rural america? go work in a coal mine like their now dead husband did?

actually, it's something of a gender issue for the ones who are part of the top economic 40% too - I'd assume (since I have no statistical knowledge, and no desire to go a-hunting on the internetz ) that the women who are not affected negatively by their husband's death are the ones who have either worked against the restrictions on women and maintained their own careers (at a 20% discount from what men make, anyway) - or have been made economically secure through their husbands' and/or inherited wealth due to the social restrictions placed on them through out their lives and women. (I went to college for my Mrs. Degree etc etc)

that doesn't mean I discount the class abandonment issues that exist either - but women who are part of both classes - gender disadvantage and class disadvantage - are still women, and thus extra burdened by society to maintain a standard of living they had when a spouse was part of the economic contribution

I would argue the class is far more influencing than gender when it comes to loss of a spouse, and here's why…

My father was a very wealthy man. Because of this, he had the available resources to invest in a variety of economically sustaining resources. Trust funds, real estate, seven-figure life insurance policies, you name it. He also had a personal accountant whose sole job was centered around him and his business, and protecting his expanding assets.

When he died, all of this went to his wife, as did his business, which had long since developed a self-sustaining highly functioning managerial system and business plan.

I on the other hand, am middle-class. If I can deal with all of the expenses related to parenthood, homeownership, and basic living and still be able to include a little "fun" without adding to my debt, it's been a pretty good year. If I died tomorrow, my wife would be left with a house that's halfway paid off and in need of some maintenance, two aging vehicles that are fully paid off and approaching replacement, and very little other debt. But she would be attempting to maintain all this on just 55% of our previous household income (she makes a little more than I do).

Finally, my brother has spina bifida and some mild cognitive problems related to a shunt issue when he was younger. He and his wife live off of his Social Security, what little he gets as a freelance writer, and her $12 an hour job. They have no assets to speak of, a small but (for their situation) difficult to manage amount of debt, and a child.

Consider the differences in the impacts of the death of a spouse at those three starting points. Now consider how little the story would change in each of those cases if you reversed it and imagined the wife dying instead. There is far more opportunity for wealth management and sustainability, the higher you go up the economic ladder. It is way more influential than your gender

[surfndestroy]

do we need to revisit the whole men die sooner than women bullshit? men die sooner thus leaving old women to fend for themselves and generally becoming poverty stricken and disenfranchised by the society.

how is that a disadvantage?

So can we call partner/spousal homicide bullshit as it leaves the survivor/murderer to fend for themselves. Generally becoming poverty stricken, unemployed and incarcerated.

oh, ok, I didn't realize the reason all men died sooner than women was due to spousal murders. in that case, carry on, disadvantaged one

Stop living off of men and it won't affect your lifestyle when they die. The victim card; I've lived a life of dependence on others and then they go and die on me. A death that my continued but unnecessary dependence on them probably played a part in and that makes me a victim. Not the person buried. They were lucky, they died five years earlier.

If you think it's great to die early, you have that option. Please provide the alternative of a longer life to men.

[malice]

do we need to revisit the whole men die sooner than women bullshit? men die sooner thus leaving old women to fend for themselves and generally becoming poverty stricken and disenfranchised by the society.

how is that a disadvantage?

So can we call partner/spousal homicide bullshit as it leaves the survivor/murderer to fend for themselves. Generally becoming poverty stricken, unemployed and incarcerated.

oh, ok, I didn't realize the reason all men died sooner than women was due to spousal murders. in that case, carry on, disadvantaged one

Stop living off of men and it won't affect your lifestyle when they die. The victim card; I've lived a life of dependence on others and then they go and die on me. A death that my continued but unnecessary dependence on them probably played a part in and that makes me a victim. Not the person buried. They were lucky, they died five years earlier.

If you think it's great to die early, you have that option. Please provide the alternative of a longer life to men.

i personally have never lived off of men as an adult, and have had to support my significant other for well over a decade, so get the fuck out of here with stop living off men. I've struggeled for the vast majority of my adulthood, financially, as a result of being the head of the economic household- and not because I didn't hold down equivalent work positions to the men in my office- but because I wasn't able to make the same wages. in fact, one person at my old job noted to me - 'well, you know, george has a wife and child, so it's ok if he makes more money than you' (WAT????) that's the kind of society I, personally have to live in - not you.

I will also tell you that women have had no choice given to them in such matters until women started a stupid ass movement called feminism/liberalism

WE'RE the ones who fought to 'stop living off men' as you've so eloquently stated here.

and allow me to tell you - for a guy who has at least attempted and in some cases succeeded in having rational conversations with me about all this - I'm astounded that this is the kind of rubbish that continues to spew forth from your keyboard.

stop with your male persecution complex, snd, it's unfitting from you, and it's so outdated in general that I'm just going to dismiss anything you have to say from now on when you do it because you know that's not how the world is, and if you actually believe in this kind of crap - I'm certainly not going to waste my time trying to discuss it with you. you will feel this way about women for the rest of your life, and never understand that this is part of the reason women react like I do to your opinions - you are crazyglued to the idea that women play games to hoodwink all you poor white guys out there, and call it feminism.

to that, I can only offer a hardy FUCK THAT SHIT to you and wish you well.

[malice]

mc p - I'll comment later on what you posted - I'm feeling decidely irrationally female right now

[McParadigm]

That's okay. I've been feeling irrationally male all day.

[BurtReynolds]

I was thinking that peeing at urinals could be considered a disadvantage what with all the splashing and puddles, but that probably pales in comparison to sitting on a public toilet. All in all, public restrooms are repulsive.

[mookie]

Birds In Hell

[mookie]

do we need to revisit the whole men die sooner than women bullshit? men die sooner thus leaving old women to fend for themselves and generally becoming poverty stricken and disenfranchised by the society.

how is that a disadvantage?

So can we call partner/spousal homicide bullshit as it leaves the survivor/murderer to fend for themselves. Generally becoming poverty stricken, unemployed and incarcerated.

oh, ok, I didn't realize the reason all men died sooner than women was due to spousal murders. in that case, carry on, disadvantaged one

Stop living off of men and it won't affect your lifestyle when they die. The victim card; I've lived a life of dependence on others and then they go and die on me. A death that my continued but unnecessary dependence on them probably played a part in and that makes me a victim. Not the person buried. They were lucky, they died five years earlier.

If you think it's great to die early, you have that option. Please provide the alternative of a longer life to men.

i personally have never lived off of men as an adult, and have had to support my significant other for well over a decade, so get the fuck out of here with stop living off men. I've struggeled for the vast majority of my adulthood, financially, as a result of being the head of the economic household- and not because I didn't hold down equivalent work positions to the men in my office- but because I wasn't able to make the same wages. in fact, one person at my old job noted to me - 'well, you know, george has a wife and child, so it's ok if he makes more money than you' (WAT????) that's the kind of society I, personally have to live in - not you.

I will also tell you that women have had no choice given to them in such matters until women started a stupid ass movement called feminism/liberalism

WE'RE the ones who fought to 'stop living off men' as you've so eloquently stated here.

and allow me to tell you - for a guy who has at least attempted and in some cases succeeded in having rational conversations with me about all this - I'm astounded that this is the kind of rubbish that continues to spew forth from your keyboard.

stop with your male persecution complex, snd, it's unfitting from you, and it's so outdated in general that I'm just going to dismiss anything you have to say from now on when you do it because you know that's not how the world is, and if you actually believe in this kind of crap - I'm certainly not going to waste my time trying to discuss it with you. you will feel this way about women for the rest of your life, and never understand that this is part of the reason women react like I do to your opinions - you are crazyglued to the idea that women play games to hoodwink all you poor white guys out there, and call it feminism.

to that, I can only offer a hardy FUCK THAT SHIT to you and wish you well.

I think you really do need a vacation in Hawaii, actually.

I don't think snd has any grudges against all women though, maybe he's just not found the right combination yet. I don't mean to pry, but can I ask if you're generally happy being the breadwinner?

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that maybe you're a little stressed out about it.

[mookie]

Being the financial backbone of any relationship may or may not be easy. Depends on the intersectionality...

[malice]

do we need to revisit the whole men die sooner than women bullshit? men die sooner thus leaving old women to fend for themselves and generally becoming poverty stricken and disenfranchised by the society.

how is that a disadvantage?

So can we call partner/spousal homicide bullshit as it leaves the survivor/murderer to fend for themselves. Generally becoming poverty stricken, unemployed and incarcerated.

oh, ok, I didn't realize the reason all men died sooner than women was due to spousal murders. in that case, carry on, disadvantaged one

Stop living off of men and it won't affect your lifestyle when they die. The victim card; I've lived a life of dependence on others and then they go and die on me. A death that my continued but unnecessary dependence on them probably played a part in and that makes me a victim. Not the person buried. They were lucky, they died five years earlier.

If you think it's great to die early, you have that option. Please provide the alternative of a longer life to men.

i personally have never lived off of men as an adult, and have had to support my significant other for well over a decade, so get the fuck out of here with stop living off men. I've struggeled for the vast majority of my adulthood, financially, as a result of being the head of the economic household- and not because I didn't hold down equivalent work positions to the men in my office- but because I wasn't able to make the same wages. in fact, one person at my old job noted to me - 'well, you know, george has a wife and child, so it's ok if he makes more money than you' (WAT????) that's the kind of society I, personally have to live in - not you.

I will also tell you that women have had no choice given to them in such matters until women started a stupid ass movement called feminism/liberalism

WE'RE the ones who fought to 'stop living off men' as you've so eloquently stated here.

and allow me to tell you - for a guy who has at least attempted and in some cases succeeded in having rational conversations with me about all this - I'm astounded that this is the kind of rubbish that continues to spew forth from your keyboard.

stop with your male persecution complex, snd, it's unfitting from you, and it's so outdated in general that I'm just going to dismiss anything you have to say from now on when you do it because you know that's not how the world is, and if you actually believe in this kind of crap - I'm certainly not going to waste my time trying to discuss it with you. you will feel this way about women for the rest of your life, and never understand that this is part of the reason women react like I do to your opinions - you are crazyglued to the idea that women play games to hoodwink all you poor white guys out there, and call it feminism.

to that, I can only offer a hardy FUCK THAT SHIT to you and wish you well.

I think you really do need a vacation in Hawaii, actually.

I don't think snd has any grudges against all women though, maybe he's just not found the right combination yet. I don't mean to pry, but can I ask if you're generally happy being the breadwinner?

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that maybe you're a little stressed out about it.

I'd rather not interact with you at all whenever possible, kthx. go make your pronouncements about my general well being somewhere else other than to me, because I'm of little patience for it.

feel free to report my post though

[mookie]

do we need to revisit the whole men die sooner than women bullshit? men die sooner thus leaving old women to fend for themselves and generally becoming poverty stricken and disenfranchised by the society.

how is that a disadvantage?

So can we call partner/spousal homicide bullshit as it leaves the survivor/murderer to fend for themselves. Generally becoming poverty stricken, unemployed and incarcerated.

oh, ok, I didn't realize the reason all men died sooner than women was due to spousal murders. in that case, carry on, disadvantaged one

Stop living off of men and it won't affect your lifestyle when they die. The victim card; I've lived a life of dependence on others and then they go and die on me. A death that my continued but unnecessary dependence on them probably played a part in and that makes me a victim. Not the person buried. They were lucky, they died five years earlier.

If you think it's great to die early, you have that option. Please provide the alternative of a longer life to men.

i personally have never lived off of men as an adult, and have had to support my significant other for well over a decade, so get the fuck out of here with stop living off men. I've struggeled for the vast majority of my adulthood, financially, as a result of being the head of the economic household- and not because I didn't hold down equivalent work positions to the men in my office- but because I wasn't able to make the same wages. in fact, one person at my old job noted to me - 'well, you know, george has a wife and child, so it's ok if he makes more money than you' (WAT????) that's the kind of society I, personally have to live in - not you.

I will also tell you that women have had no choice given to them in such matters until women started a stupid ass movement called feminism/liberalism

WE'RE the ones who fought to 'stop living off men' as you've so eloquently stated here.

and allow me to tell you - for a guy who has at least attempted and in some cases succeeded in having rational conversations with me about all this - I'm astounded that this is the kind of rubbish that continues to spew forth from your keyboard.

stop with your male persecution complex, snd, it's unfitting from you, and it's so outdated in general that I'm just going to dismiss anything you have to say from now on when you do it because you know that's not how the world is, and if you actually believe in this kind of crap - I'm certainly not going to waste my time trying to discuss it with you. you will feel this way about women for the rest of your life, and never understand that this is part of the reason women react like I do to your opinions - you are crazyglued to the idea that women play games to hoodwink all you poor white guys out there, and call it feminism.

to that, I can only offer a hardy FUCK THAT SHIT to you and wish you well.

I think you really do need a vacation in Hawaii, actually.

I don't think snd has any grudges against all women though, maybe he's just not found the right combination yet. I don't mean to pry, but can I ask if you're generally happy being the breadwinner?

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that maybe you're a little stressed out about it.

I'd rather not interact with you at all whenever possible, kthx. go make your pronouncements about my general well being somewhere else other than to me, because I'm of little patience for it.

feel free to report my post though

So if you post in every thread, I can't post at all?

[malice]

I don't give a flying fuck where you post, I have no desire to interact with you, nor read your proclamations to me about my demeanor.

I'm pretty sure we've been over this countless times before.

do you see anyone else other than kevin casey making comments to me about whatever sand may or may not be in my vagina? no. know why? cause no one else gives a flying fuck either, only you.

post about the fucking subject at least if you have nothing humorous to contribute but bug the hell off with your analysis of my lifestyle.

it's highly uninteresting as well as inaccurate yet you seem to glom onto my every word like you know anything at all about me other than what I've posted here. srsly, what the hell do you care what I'm stressed about or not and what the hell does it have to do with what I have to say to snd?

he and I have talked a number of times about feminism privately, he's a grown up and so am i, I'm quite sure neither of us need you to intercede on anyone's behalf to tell me what you think of my stress levels.


clear enough for you? no? here's the tl/dr version:

post where ever you want - I have no way to stop you even if I cared to- and I don't.
stop posting to me as if you know me or anything about me - you don't. just as I don't bother posting to you about you and your life - I've no interest in it.

[---]

Any of my non-gender confirming spirit-male/spirit-females looking forward to sending their non-gender confirming boys to Camp You Are You?

[BurtReynolds]

For the first time in my life, I wish I had children.

[Birds in Hell]

Any of my non-gender confirming spirit-male/spirit-females looking forward to sending their non-gender confirming boys to Camp You Are You?

Dear god.

[broken iris]

zup, bro-sefs. Alex Jones delivers:

The War On Men: 10 Ways Masculinity is Under Attack
And why the elite – not women – are to blame

Infowars.com
February 19, 2014

Men are facing a full frontal assault on their rights, health and culture like never before. The war on masculinity has never been so brutal – but it’s not a war being waged by women. The attack is coming directly from the top, as the establishment desperately attempts to emasculate and disempower men in order to force women to be more dependent on the state, thereby enabling more power to be centralized and aiding the growth of big government.

Here are ten ways in which the state has declared war on men and masculinity;

1) Falling Fertility

Sperm counts amongst men have significantly decreased over the last half century and particularly over the last 25 years. In some European countries, sperm counts have dropped by as much as a third since 1989. Part of the fall can be explained by exposure to pesticides, endocrine-disrupting chemicals like Bisphenol A, and the many other artificial horrors that increasingly pervade our water and food supply. Many have made the connection between falling sperm counts and the open calls by innumerable elitists to drastically reduce world population by as much as 95%. Research shows that underpopulation, not overpopulation, will be the major demographic crisis of the 21st century as a result of humans failing to achieve the replacement rate of 2.1 children.

2) Chemical Warfare “Feminizing” Boys

Exposure to phthalates, which are found in many plastics, is “feminizing” boys by blocking normal male testosterone and causing genital abnormalities, according to scientists. “Boys exposed to high levels of these in the womb were less likely than other boys to play with cars, trains and guns or engage in “rougher” games like playfighting,” according to a BBC News report. According to Elizabeth Salter-Green, director of the chemicals campaign group CHEM Trust, phthalates are a true “gender-bender” because they lead to a reduction in “male behavior”.

3) Degradation of Positive Masculine Role Models

Whereas 50 years ago, advertising, Hollywood and television was filled with examples of positive masculine role models that young men could look up to, today’s entertainment industry routinely portrays men as clueless and bumbling oafs at best (think Homer Simpson, Everybody Loves Raymond, Married With Children) or at worst as aggressive sexual predators. Since advertising is primarily aimed at women, men in commercials are also now routinely depicted as either being emasculated losers or stupefied morons. Young men consuming this content grow up thinking that it is acceptable and even encouraged to aspire to these character traits. In doing so, they are robbed of their natural masculinity and find it extremely difficult to attract well-rounded women, who are rightly disgusted by such behavior. The entertainment industry is largely controlled by men, again underscoring the fact that this assault is a top down trend that has little or nothing to do with the gender war.

4) Metrosexual Malaise

Second wave feminism was a creation of the establishment itself and at its core has little whatsoever to do with genuine concern about women’s rights. Radical feminism deliberately confuses gender roles and makes young men apprehensive about exercising their masculinity for fear of being seen as overbearing or aggressive towards women. This has contributed to an entire generation of “metrosexual” men who are promiscuous, unwilling to commit to a relationship and unable to fulfil a women’s basic needs for healthy companionship, destabilizing society and making it more difficult for women to find suitable long term partners with whom to have children.

5) Cultural Marxism

Establishment-controlled second wave feminism also advances the doctrine of cultural marxism, which claims that oppression emerges from patriarchal society and culture, and not the state. Governments love cultural marxism because it absolves them of blame. The true source of all oppression has always been the state, but by blaming it on men or western culture in general (which is primarily shaped by men), the state hides its own responsibility.

6) The ‘Men are Paid More’ Myth

The establishment promulgates the myth that men are paid more than women because of discrimination, feeding into feminist doctrines about patriarchal systems oppressing women in the workplace. In reality, the “wage gap” of around 19 per cent between the two sexes in the United States is explained by a number of reasons that have nothing to do with discrimination, including the fact that men work more hours and men seek less desirable jobs that pay higher. As a result, men account for 93% of workplace deaths despite being only 54% of the workforce. 94% of workplace suicides every year are also men. The establishment buries these shockingly high male workplace fatality figures because they completely contradict the myth that the jobs market discriminates against women.

7) The “Privilege” Trap

Statists, collectivists and their mouthpieces in the media and the establishment claim that western men (in particular white men) cannot express a valid opinion on any issue related in any way to a “minority” (such as feminism or immigration) because they have “privilege”. The “privilege” talking point is a stunt through which liberals and feminists attempt to shut down free speech. In essence they are asserting the ludicrous notion that a man’s viewpoint has no value because of the color of his skin, his gender or his country of origin. This is an inherently racist position, yet it is routinely used by leftists to shout down their ideological adversaries and silence male voices.

8) The Legal System Discriminates Against Men

In both divorce and child custody proceedings, it is widely acknowledged that courts heavily favor women and discriminate against men. Men are routinely hit with onerous alimony payments even if women are capable of working and earning a good paycheck. Men only receive custody of their children in around 10 per cent of divorce cases in the United States. The ironic thing about this system is that it has primarily been instituted by other men, emphasizing again how the war on men is being waged not by women, but by the primarily male-dominated establishment itself.

9) Masculinity as a Dirty Word

Dissident feminist Camille Paglia recently wrote a Wall Street Journal piece in which she warned, “What you’re seeing is how a civilization commits suicide.” Paglia was referring to how the emancipation of masculine virtues by the establishment threatens to create massive destabilization in society due to less and less men being able to fill traditionally “masculine” roles in the jobs market. Paglia points to schools cutting recess, the effort to deny the biological distinctions between men and women, and the left’s characterization of controversial opinions as “hate speech” as examples of how masculinity is being deliberately eroded. “Masculinity is just becoming something that is imitated from the movies. There’s nothing left. There’s no room for anything manly right now,” warns Paglia, adding that young men have, “no models of manhood.”

10) Domestic Abuse Against Men

Whereas women have numerous safety nets to turn to if they become victims of domestic abuse, men have virtually none, despite the fact that domestic abuse against men is a huge and growing problem. In the UK for example, 44 per cent of domestic abuse victims are male, while more married men suffer abuse at the hands of their spouse than married women. While domestic abuse against women is constantly highlighted by the mass media, domestic abuse against men is a complete non-issue.

Conclusion

A totalitarian society can only survive if the male population has been gelded, emasculated and disenfranchised. With this natural bulwark against tyranny removed, the elite can centralize power and pursue collectivist tyranny unopposed. This is why men and masculinity are under assault on every level – and why both men and women should join forces to fight back against this common enemy.

[mookie]

I don't give a flying fuck where you post, I have no desire to interact with you, nor read your proclamations to me about my demeanor.

I'm pretty sure we've been over this countless times before.

do you see anyone else other than kevin casey making comments to me about whatever sand may or may not be in my vagina? no. know why? cause no one else gives a flying fuck either, only you.

post about the fucking subject at least if you have nothing humorous to contribute but bug the hell off with your analysis of my lifestyle.

it's highly uninteresting as well as inaccurate yet you seem to glom onto my every word like you know anything at all about me other than what I've posted here. srsly, what the hell do you care what I'm stressed about or not and what the hell does it have to do with what I have to say to snd?

he and I have talked a number of times about feminism privately, he's a grown up and so am i, I'm quite sure neither of us need you to intercede on anyone's behalf to tell me what you think of my stress levels.


clear enough for you? no? here's the tl/dr version:

post where ever you want - I have no way to stop you even if I cared to- and I don't.
stop posting to me as if you know me or anything about me - you don't. just as I don't bother posting to you about you and your life - I've no interest in it.

Fair enough, here are my terms...


Stop namedropping and disparaging old accounts like px and whomever else you think aren't worth posting on the same board as you and maybe you won't catch my attention again.

[harmless]

There is no war being waged on men. There is a war being waged on people of all kinds by patriarchy. And yes, patriarchy hates certain kinds of men also. But to frame it as a 'war against men' is ridiculously single-minded and outdated, since the word patriarchy already perfectly describes the systems of power at the heart of it.

[harmless]

Having said that, 'Kyriarchy' is a useful update of the Patriarchy idea.

[broken iris]

Having said that, 'Kyriarchy' is a useful update of the Patriarchy idea.

Wikipedia on Kyriarchy:
"In essence, all peoples are in some form or another 'oppressors' to some group of people while simultaneously being oppressed by some other group of people. In an effort to end their oppression, they increase the oppression they inflict, thus creating a vicious circle of sorts."


I would agree that is an accurate description of what is happening. Would you?