HBO Television Show: True Detective

[Norah]

"I'm gonna skull fuck you, you bitch!"

Whoever's reviewing this over at the AV Club has been making the point that the writer/director of this series has done a pretty great job of keeping Marty out of Walter White/Tony Soprano anti-hero territory, and I think a line like that is a great example of how. Besides the fact that we want him to get the killer off of the street, who's actually rooting for Marty? Not me.

The AV Club always has the best TV reviews. I pretty much go to them after watching any episode of any show I'm really into.

[DeLima]

I can't believe I only have 2 episodes to go. I want more!

watching them all in a row must be so good

[Norah]

I'd say the only flaw with this show was how pulpy it became in the last two episodes (very X-Files-like). And it placed us in the point of view of the killer & extinguished much of the show's mystery.

It did get kind of x-filesy those last two episodes.

[zeb]

This was a show about Marty and Rust, and the other characters to me existed purely as a means to develop the 2 leads. And i think that difference in view is probably the main point between those who view the show as being misogynist, and those that don't. To me, the women had to be weak characters, as those are the type women the flawed detectives would have in their lives. Portraying strong women in this show would not have made the same points regarding Marty and Rust that having the women (and ultimately all the side characters) as disposable... because to Marty and especially Rust, other people were disposable, police work is what mattered.

This. All of this.

[Norah]

This was a show about Marty and Rust, and the other characters to me existed purely as a means to develop the 2 leads. And i think that difference in view is probably the main point between those who view the show as being misogynist, and those that don't. To me, the women had to be weak characters, as those are the type women the flawed detectives would have in their lives. Portraying strong women in this show would not have made the same points regarding Marty and Rust that having the women (and ultimately all the side characters) as disposable... because to Marty and especially Rust, other people were disposable, police work is what mattered.

This. All of this.

for sure

[DeLima]

This was a show about Marty and Rust, and the other characters to me existed purely as a means to develop the 2 leads. And i think that difference in view is probably the main point between those who view the show as being misogynist, and those that don't. To me, the women had to be weak characters, as those are the type women the flawed detectives would have in their lives. Portraying strong women in this show would not have made the same points regarding Marty and Rust that having the women (and ultimately all the side characters) as disposable... because to Marty and especially Rust, other people were disposable, police work is what mattered.

This. All of this.

I don't even think Maggie is weak...just not focused on. There certainly are tons of women-centric shows and movies where the make characters are two dimensional.

[broken iris]

This was a show about Marty and Rust, and the other characters to me existed purely as a means to develop the 2 leads. And i think that difference in view is probably the main point between those who view the show as being misogynist, and those that don't. To me, the women had to be weak characters, as those are the type women the flawed detectives would have in their lives. Portraying strong women in this show would not have made the same points regarding Marty and Rust that having the women (and ultimately all the side characters) as disposable... because to Marty and especially Rust, other people were disposable, police work is what mattered.

This. All of this.

I don't even think Maggie is weak...just not focused on. There certainly are tons of women-centric shows and movies where the make characters are two dimensional.

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V

....

One criticism of the show making the rounds is that the show is too male-centric, both exploiting the females it features and at the same time ignoring them. There is some truth to this, but not as much as detractors claim. In contrast to the layered, nuanced characterization of Cohle and Hart, the female characters seem much sketchier. The only major woman character is Hart's wife, Maggie (Michelle Monaghan), who for eight episodes (except for one bare-breasted sex scene and another quickie sex scene) plays the single note of "long-suffering." The other featured females are Hart's bare-breasted mistresses who either want handcuffed sex or anal sex. Not so much layered nuance as lively nipples.

Certainly there is no reason to show naked breasts except to thumb their noses at network TV ("Look what we can do that you can't!") and to promote their new slogan: "HBO: We give you hard dramas -- and hard-ons." (Nipples are practically a trademark of HBO series, their version of the MGM lion or Looney Toons' Bugs Bunny.) While I agree that the use of bare boobs is less about character development and more about gratuitous titillation, the raw sensuality otherwise portrayed is actually a legitimate part of the story. Yes, it's a male-centric buddy cop story, a more literary and darker version of popcorn fare like Lethal Weapon and Rush Hour. It's more in the serious vein of BBC's Sherlock and BBC's Life on Mars. Because the series is from the points of view of these two men, the females become more symbolic and less realistically complex. This is often a convention of serious literature. Jane Austen's male characters might keep their shirts and pants on, but they are no less symbolic shadow puppets of male types. The women appear as the men in the series see them, which is part of the reason they are unable to have meaningful relationships with women. So, rather than a flaw, the portrayal of women is a strength in that it reveals the weakness in the protagonists.

[Mecca]

Lol

[Rangi Guy]

Just finished Episode 2 last night - it's slowly drawing me in..

[Harry Lime]

So, rather than a flaw, the portrayal of women is a strength in that it reveals the weakness in the protagonists.

Which is basically the argument I was making.

[WtOB?]

just finished watching this. well, that was awesome.

[DeLima]

just finished watching this. well, that was awesome.

the light's winning

[VinylGuy]

I need to get around Marty and Rust these days.

[southp]

This is probably the best show I've ever seen or ever will see on TV.

[Norah]

I can think of a few shows that are better than this.

[southp]

I can think of a few shows that are better than this.

Which did you prefer over TD?

[Norah]

I can think of a few shows that are better than this.

Which did you prefer over TD?

Breaking Bad is the one that immediately comes to mind. The Wire too probably.

[epilogue]

I can think of a few shows that are better than this.

Which did you prefer over TD?

Breaking Bad is the one that immediately comes to mind. The Wire too probably.

And Mad Men, Game of Thrones, Broadchurch, Top of the Lake, Sherlock, etc. The list goes on and on, for me.

[EJ]

Rome

[Norah]

I can think of a few shows that are better than this.

Which did you prefer over TD?

Breaking Bad is the one that immediately comes to mind. The Wire too probably.

And Mad Men, Game of Thrones, Broadchurch, Top of the Lake, Sherlock, etc. The list goes on and on, for me.

Yeah, Game of Thrones too. And I really, really liked True Detective.