Post-Riot Act Moneygrab

[McParadigm]

It's always been important and enjoyable to me to find humor in things that might otherwise be sources of disappointment or frustration. In a way, doing so even becomes oddly celebratory, like having a wake or a birthday party catered by the Flaming Lips (or the Birthday Party, I guess).

However, on message board Red Mosquito, internet users such as stip have been recently ruining that outlet for me. By having different opinions, and by bringing them up in thread after fucking thread, they have managed to limit my ability to enjoy a thing that I would otherwise enjoy. This is clearly a problem on their end, and I shall complain about it vehemently.

[McParadigm]

I dislike it.

[McParadigm]

I still dislike it guys.

[CopperTom]

It's Stip's birthday. He can ruin it today.

[malice]

i mean if everyone who isn't cumming in their pants is by default instead posting gleeful smug reflexive viciousness in an attempt to make everyone hate pearl jam here, i suppose id' agree that it does nothing to negate his point.

the issue for me is that i don't see the conversations that occur in PJ Chat as gleeful smug reflexive viciousness - even when the griping it at its worst (best? I dunno) - I see it as a lot of high expectation that got toppled somewhere along the line and a desire to talk about that.
if that can't be included in the conversations within a pearl forum then where can it be talked about?

Then you're not reading very carefully.

At least speaking for myself, actual discussions about everything you just said are great and interesting. And you'll have to sift through an awful lot of angry or bitter or dismissive or condescending shit to find them. Some gifs too. They're there sometimes, but they're buried

There is a difference between conversations and people howling about how awful something sucks with such volume and energy and ubiquitousness that it becomes hard for those to enjoy it to enjoy it. And the fact that some people are tongue in cheek about it doesn't change that

Kind of like when people on the pit go after someone for being critical. I bet they don't understand why some people are put off by that either.


Rm is sometimes better than that dynamic. There are a lot of interesting and funny people here. But it used to always be better. And now it's just the same much of the time. And sometimes it is worse,

I probably don't read everything very carefully, i usually skip over conversation that begins to degrade into how awful things suck - mainly because it provides no value to me.
maybe it provides value to someone else - what do I know? mainly though, I don't invest in it the way I think some posters do because it doesn't bother me either way if people like things or dislike them here.

I don't have a super clear memory of what PJ Chat used to be like 'before' - I barely posted in this area, and that was when my pearl jam fandom was at an all time high.
but my fandom was my own, mainly because that's how i process music, i think - i don't think i know anyone either online or irl that holds the same opinions of their music as i have over the years, so i've never been one to sing their praises other than to voice an appreciation rather than try to define it.
maybe that's more what you're hoping for? I'm unsure.

(I do get annoyed at some of the excessive giffing though)

[given2trade]

There's nothing noble about listening to a band making mediocre music in its third decade when there are bands making better music in their first out there.

This is true. But the loss of musical accomplishment is less relevant to me than the loss of interest.

It is the gleeful smug reflexive viciousness behind so much of it. In the same way that what is repulsive about the pit is not that they like the band.

It probably reads like smugness to someone who is still invested in the band as an ongoing musical entity, because there is genuine laughter and enjoyment involved. But it's born of a complicated combination that includes fascination, amusement, disappointment, frustration, and bewilderment. Like dime watching footage of George Lucas making the prequels, maybe.

And most of what has made this whole thing so gloriously entertaining is the fact that they spent a huge portion of their career intensely passionate about the idea of music, the creation of, and the crooks and crannies of the resulting human connection....and have now come to adopt an approach that so completely commoditizes and compartmentalizes that aspect of their careers that it almost feels like they're making fun of it.

There is an underlying cynicism to marketing Mother Love Bone dog collars, or to selling a $25 plastic sippy-cup over the internet that just has a rush job "EV" slapped on it, or to giving interviews where you talk about songwriting like it's something you still do and have every expectation of doing better than ever in the future....when the truth is, you know better. You know exactly how little you're willing to invest in that effort. You know that you can't be bothered to put in more than a handful of work weeks in the studio during a half decade's time, and are willing to let your producer play a lead role in the development of your new album because SOMEone needs to be directing this thing towards cohesion and personality, I guess, and I just can't be bothered to care. You know that these promises of great things no longer serve any purpose other than to convince people to buy your new album, and not notice the man behind the curtain.

The fact that Pearl Jam went from being so thoroughly bright eyed optimistic about music (for such a long period of time) that they were occasionally mocked or admired for it, to being so tired and calculating about their own sonic accomplishments....well, that would be amazing in and of itself. That they still try to hang on to the basic surface qualities of that optimism, because they find it lucrative? Or just because they're that far gone in their plot loss? Well, sorry, but that makes it funny. Really funny. Like some very, very long skit comedy thing that's only just now really getting good.

You and thenno or spenno or whatever his name is should just be the only people allowed to post in this thread. Oh and Stip of course.

[McParadigm]

This is as far as my vehemence takes me, I'm afraid. So I shall have to move on to other topics.

But goddamn you stip stipperson. I will have my revenge.

[McParadigm]

You and thenno or spenno or whatever his name is should just be the only people allowed to post in this thread. Oh and Stip of course.

The McSpennadigm Forum would be RM's large hadron collider.

[given2trade]

Some of us like to talk about the fact that this band started out great (91-94), went into a period of self-imposed mediocrity (96-02) and then gradually started to come out of it (2006 onwards). Such people think this band is still pretty great in 2014. Not because they're 'good for their age', but because we prefer what they put out compared to any other band or musician in the present day. We truly believe the quality of their work now is better than anything they've done since their early heyday.

Yes, we exist. But we prefer to stay underground.

Given 95-03ish were the best years for the band musically, you should probably stay underground.

JUST KIDDING!!! (I'm not kidding.)

[BurtReynolds]

See you all back here next week!

[Tuolumne]

There's nothing noble about listening to a band making mediocre music in its third decade when there are bands making better music in their first out there.

This is true. But the loss of musical accomplishment is less relevant to me than the loss of interest.

It is the gleeful smug reflexive viciousness behind so much of it. In the same way that what is repulsive about the pit is not that they like the band.

It probably reads like smugness to someone who is still invested in the band as an ongoing musical entity, because there is genuine laughter and enjoyment involved. But it's born of a complicated combination that includes fascination, amusement, disappointment, frustration, and bewilderment. Like dime watching footage of George Lucas making the prequels, maybe.

And most of what has made this whole thing so gloriously entertaining is the fact that they spent a huge portion of their career intensely passionate about the idea of music, the creation of, and the crooks and crannies of the resulting human connection....and have now come to adopt an approach that so completely commoditizes and compartmentalizes that aspect of their careers that it almost feels like they're making fun of it.

There is an underlying cynicism to marketing Mother Love Bone dog collars, or to selling a $25 plastic sippy-cup over the internet that just has a rush job "EV" slapped on it, or to giving interviews where you talk about songwriting like it's something you still do and have every expectation of doing better than ever in the future....when the truth is, you know better. You know exactly how little you're willing to invest in that effort. You know that you can't be bothered to put in more than a handful of work weeks in the studio during a half decade's time, and are willing to let your producer play a lead role in the development of your new album because SOMEone needs to be directing this thing towards cohesion and personality, I guess, and I just can't be bothered to care. You know that these promises of great things no longer serve any purpose other than to convince people to buy your new album, and not notice the man behind the curtain.

The fact that Pearl Jam went from being so thoroughly bright eyed optimistic about music (for such a long period of time) that they were occasionally mocked or admired for it, to being so tired and calculating about their own sonic accomplishments....well, that would be amazing in and of itself. That they still try to hang on to the basic surface qualities of that optimism, because they find it lucrative? Or just because they're that far gone in their plot loss? Well, sorry, but that makes it funny. Really funny. Like some very, very long skit comedy thing that's only just now really getting good.

I'm glad you psychoanalyzed the whole 'contrarian PJ fan' mentality of RM, and it sounds like a pretty honest and correct accounting and honors your strong analytical skills of a point of view which I do not share. But, shit man, are we supposed to keep all of that top of mind whenever we see the thousands of posts reflecting this view? That's where I only see the "probably reads like smugness" part of your post. Because it IS smug as all shit, and just cause you explained it as eloquently as you did doesn't mean it isn't smug the next thousand posts we see articulating this point of view. It's smug, reflexive, and beating a dead horse.

[Lament]

I like when Ed sings like a cow.

[Jorge]

I like when he feeds like a cow.

[Lament]

Are you saying Lightning Bolt is cud?

[Birds in Hell]

As your birthday present, here's this fucking conversation again.

Happy birthday, stip. I hope you too felt gleefully smug at some point today!

[Norah]

Show me.

Forums.theskyiscrape.com

Can you show where change has been embraced?

This forum is full of people who all simultaneously like VS, Vitalogy, No Code, Yield, and Binaural. Are you telling me there was no change between those albums?

[Norah]

There is that one guy who seems like his sole purpose is to convince people that the Philly 2009 shows are the worst thing ever. At least is seems that way.

Those were the shows where Ed and Jeff fed babies to lions while Stone shot heroin into his eyeballs on stage, right?

Wendy Carlos's Twin

That's his sole purpose. And to call you an idiot.

He does go on and on about the Philly shows, but to be fair, he has made some pretty substantial contributions to the fan community. Have you heard his soundboard remasters?

[bodysnatcher]

Show me.

Forums.theskyiscrape.com

Can you show where change has been embraced?

This forum is full of people who all simultaneously like VS, Vitalogy, No Code, Yield, and Binaural. Are you telling me there was no change between those albums?

I embraced Eddie's change of mind to growing his hair back out instead of keeping a mohawk until the end of the war, like he initially stated.

[Wendy Carlos's Twin]

Some of us like to talk about the fact that this band started out great (91-94), went into a period of self-imposed mediocrity (96-02) and then gradually started to come out of it (2006 onwards).

LOL

[Iholdthepain]

Some of us like to talk about the fact that this band started out great (91-94), went into a period of self-imposed mediocrity (96-02) and then gradually started to come out of it (2006 onwards). Such people think this band is still pretty great in 2014. Not because they're 'good for their age', but because we prefer what they put out compared to any other band or musician in the present day. We truly believe the quality of their work now is better than anything they've done since their early heyday.

Yes, we exist. But we prefer to stay underground.

Aside from this post, the last few pages of this thread really fucking suck!