Can we talk about the sterling/silver thing?

[Norah]

How many homicides must be caused by affirmative action before we see it for the mistake it is?

[Lament]

Every other week a student in Milwaukee is mugged by a black kid in a hoodie. Harry Lime has the emails to prove it.

[Lament]

homicide

[Harry Lime]

I treat these issues as if there are grey areas. And they are grey areas. It's you guys who treat the issues as cut-and-dried. That's your mistake.

And since none of you have anything remotely interesting or insightful to add, I don't know why I waste my time.

[Jorge]

Oh stop. Because that's exactly what I'm doing, right? I know you take pleasure in it, but stop distorting shit people say.

What? Buddy, I'm agreeing with you. You and I, we see things as they are, unencumbered by media sensationalism. These minorities and these women and these gays have us walking on eggshells, making us apologize for every little thing we say, and I'm sick of it. We've got the truth on our side. What have they got? Squat.

[@SkitchP]

homicide

[Harry Lime]

Oh stop. Because that's exactly what I'm doing, right? I know you take pleasure in it, but stop distorting shit people say.

What? Buddy, I'm agreeing with you. You and I, we see things as they are, unencumbered by media sensationalism. These minorities and these women and these gays have us walking on eggshells, making us apologize for every little thing we say, and I'm sick of it. We've got the truth on our side. What have they got? Squat.

I'm sorry, did you read Mark Cuban's response? Do you have any thoughts on it?

I'm waiting.

[Lament]

Jorge can't respond. He just got mugged by a black kid in a hoodie on the streets of Milwaukee.

If only he'd have known better...

[Lament]

I suppose it shouldn't be a surprise that a "point" as juvenile and sophomoric as the one Cuban was trying to make would find a fan here.

Harry Lime, what's your favorite Ayn Rand novel?

[Harry Lime]

I suppose it shouldn't be a surprise that a "point" as juvenile and sophomoric as the one Cuban was trying to make...

Because, frankly, a lot of people here don't know how to correctly perceive it.

I don't know what else to say.

[Lament]

I'm now genuinely curious as to what on earth you think Cuban's point is.

I wish Chud hadn't already used to popcorn gif, cause this ought to be good...

[Harry Lime]

Everyone of us has some level of irrational fear or intolerance. If we didn't, we might not be human. We then exorcise our demons by looking outside ourselves and crucifying the most obvious suspect of those crimes, so it saves us the hard task of looking in the mirror. It takes a lot of humility and guilt to look at our own demons. That's tough to do. In order to truly better our community and our own self, we have to look inward, and say, "I'm a hypocrite. How can I make this right?"

Sorry, I don't find that to be juvenile.

[Lament]

On a board full of stupid things, you've managed to raise the bar.

Harry Lime, I salute you.

[Harry Lime]

It's actually a message that derives from a lot of respectable virtues and teachings. I don't see it as very stupid. I'm sorry you feel that way.

[Lament]

"Everybody breaks the law in some manner. It's pretty hypocritical for us to exorcise our demons on the really obvious lawbreakers, the murderers and rapists, when in fact we should be looking in the mirror and dealing with ourselves."

There's a difference between harboring a prejudice and acting on it. I don't care if you or Mark Cuban or whoever the fuck chooses to act on it, even by doing something as seemingly meaningless as crossing the street to avoid someone. But that doesn't mean everybody does it, and that doesn't mean anybody else has to think it's ok. As far as I'm concerned Cuban's "crossing the street" analogy is just another way to try to justify prejudice, and I refuse to do so. A legitimately enlightened person would realize that even if deep down inside they wanted to cross the street, to do so would be giving into an irrational fear, and in turn they would not cross the street.

So if Mark Cuban being comfortable with his prejudices makes you feel better about yours, then good for you. But you're making a pretty big leap if you think everyone in the world is the same way, and an even bigger one if you think he's making some kind of profound point.

[Harry Lime]

I said everyone has a level of intolerance. I didn't say it was as big as Sterling's, or even had to do with Sterling's prejudices specifically. I only meant to say that we're not all perfect.

Cuban was only emphasizing the need for empathy. So was Jason Whitlock with that article I posted earlier. It does no good to "kick the problem down the road," instead we have to put ourselves in Sterling's shoes and ask, "Why?". It makes it easier to do that by taking a look at your own faults as well.

So if Mark Cuban being comfortable with his prejudices makes you feel better about yours, then good for you.

He's not comfortable with it. Neither am I with my own. That's the point.

And when you said earlier that the Martin case is still hugely felt "Down here", do you mean the Chicago area where you live, or did you move to Florida?

[BurtReynolds]

Who amongst us wouldn't exterminate mutants with giant robots?

[Lament]

I said everyone has a level of intolerance. I didn't say it was as big as Sterling's, or even had to do with Sterling's prejudices specifically. I only meant to say that we're not all perfect.

Cuban was only emphasizing the need for empathy. So was Jason Whitlock with that article I posted earlier. It does no good to "kick the problem down the road," instead we have to put ourselves in Sterling's shoes and ask, "Why?". It makes it easier to do that by taking a look at your own faults as well.

So if Mark Cuban being comfortable with his prejudices makes you feel better about yours, then good for you.

He's not comfortable with it. Neither am I with my own. That's the point.

And when you said earlier that the Martin case is still hugely felt "Down here", do you mean the Chicago area where you live, or did you move to Florida?

I live in Florida. I've lived in Florida for six of the last eight years. Most of it in Orlando, and much of it not far from where the Martin murder took place.

I don't feel there's a need for empathy with anyone who isn't trying to overcome their prejudices. Sterling has made it clear throughout his life that he has no desire to. He will never have my empathy, and no one who is comfortable with their prejudices ever will. No one is claiming to be perfect. That doesn't mean that we should look the other way or be accepting of people who are downright loathsome.

I've had some pretty heinous things happen to me, and I've been able to avoid attributing them to any group of people that the person perpetrating them belonged to. It's really not that hard for any moderately enlightened person to do. If you can't separate an individual from the group, then I don't need to ask "Why?" because the answer is right there. And furthermore, I don't need to look at Sterling and ask "Why?" I look at people who want to empathize with him and ask "Why?" because they're the ones who keep the climate for prejudice thriving.

[Harry Lime]

I said everyone has a level of intolerance. I didn't say it was as big as Sterling's, or even had to do with Sterling's prejudices specifically. I only meant to say that we're not all perfect.

Cuban was only emphasizing the need for empathy. So was Jason Whitlock with that article I posted earlier. It does no good to "kick the problem down the road," instead we have to put ourselves in Sterling's shoes and ask, "Why?". It makes it easier to do that by taking a look at your own faults as well.

So if Mark Cuban being comfortable with his prejudices makes you feel better about yours, then good for you.

He's not comfortable with it. Neither am I with my own. That's the point.

And when you said earlier that the Martin case is still hugely felt "Down here", do you mean the Chicago area where you live, or did you move to Florida?

I've had some pretty heinous things happen to me, and I've been able to avoid attributing them to any group of people that the person perpetrating them belonged to. It's really not that hard for any moderately enlightened person to do. If you can't separate an individual from the group, then I don't need to ask "Why?" .

I agree. I actually do the same.

But would you say that some people are more scared of statistics than the actual race, which subsequently gets interpreted as racism? You scoffed at those Milwaukee mugging reports, but it's true. Most of the muggings & theft around the University were perpetrated by black suspects. Would you then call someone a racist for being nervous while walking home alone at night, and seeing a black person?

Also, what are your thoughts with black on black, and black on white gang violence? Especially in Chicago. Plenty of whites have brought forth the argument that we're obsessed with the Martin shooting, but we mention nothing about the crimes committed by black on whites.

Is it because the whites don't share the same difficult history in this country? Do we feel less obligated, maybe even guilty, if we address black violence to the same degree?

I only mention this, because whites will be considered racist for asking these questions. Hell, Bill Cosby was called a racist of his own race because he addressed concerns about gang violence.

[Lament]

But would you say that some people are more scared of statistics than the actual race, which subsequently gets interpreted as racism? You scoffed at those Milwaukee mugging reports, but it's true. Most of the muggings & theft around the University were perpetrated by black suspects. Would you then call someone a racist for being nervous while walking home alone at night, and seeing a black person?

I think people probably use statistics to justify being afraid of a race of people. And while I may or may not call someone a racist for feeling nervous in that setting, I'd say feeling nervous is a product of a certain amount of racism. But I dunno, I spent five years living in Prince George's County, Maryland when it had some of the highest crime rates in the country and never felt nervous (even after two of my friends were mugged at gun point and my drummer's car was jacked during practice), so maybe that's just me.

Also, what are your thoughts with black on black, and black on white gang violence? Especially in Chicago. Plenty of whites have brought forth the argument that we're obsessed with the Martin shooting, but we mention nothing about the crimes committed by black on whites.

I think black on black violence is systematically ignored in a way that continues to perpetuate it. Bomani Jones made some outstanding points about this (using the absurd violence on the south side of Chicago, which is where I was born and where most of my extended family still lives) in light of the initial Sterling comments. I think it's a black eye for the city as a whole that so much of the power and money there is ok with certain areas becoming a warzone as long as their neighborhood stays safe. For a city with maybe the most boastful, egotistical people in America, they sure don't back up their talk with action.

And I don't buy the argument that we hear nothing about the crimes committed against white people by black people. Huge cases rarely come around, and when they do they're for different reasons. This one happened to be a Latino man killing a black kid. The last big national crime story before that was probably Casey Anthony, which was a white girl killing a white baby. Before that it might have been Matthew Shepard, a bunch of white kids killing a gay white kid. And the biggest crime story of the last fifty years was OJ Simpson, a black man killing a white woman and white man. Trayvon Martin was the first national case we obsessed over in recent history that involved a black teenager getting killed. Considering how often black teenagers get killed, it's fucking insane to suggest that we pay more attention to black teens dying than white people. We obsessed over it because the town of Sanford wasn't even going to have a HEARING for that piece of shit Zimmerman; They were just going to take his word that this teenager was a threat and needed to be killed without any further investigation. That's why people down here went fucking nuts and it blew up into a national story. If the initial response wasn't to say "Huh, well he said the kid had it coming, no need to look any further," this would have stayed in Florida like the rest of the Stand Your Ground stories that are ripped out of nightmare scenarios. It was the national coming out party a very controversial law that is taking root all over the south and much of the rest of the country didn't even realize was a thing.

Is it because the whites don't share the same difficult history in this country? Do we feel less obligated, maybe even guilty, if we address black violence to the same degree?

I think many white people don't want to address it because to do so would be to entertain that possibility that the past can't be brushed under the carpet as easily as people would like to think it can and that there are still monumental lingering and active effects from slavery that aren't getting any better. Just because a white person might not actively be racist doesn't mean they're not playing a part in perpetuating an unfair and racist system. But it's a lot easier to ignore that than it is to realize that maybe you're benefiting from a system at the expense of others even though you've never actively attempted to.