Backspacer: Official Album Thread

[bodysnatcher]

Lightning Bolting

[stip]

also, there's got to be a major difference between a ramshackle 60s cover that was recorded live on a soundcheck then released as a fan club single then off to the airwaves and became a hit by popular demand then put on a benefit album for Kosovar refugees and a song that uses the very musical stereotypes and idiosycrasies that PJ tried to shack off for most of their career. those hair metal mannerisms were what the Seattle scene stood against in the beginning and that stance surely appealed to me.

i'm not going to diss the song's lyrics or overall musical performance of the band but it's a clear and conscious choice from this band and BO'B and it's some kind of artistic u-turn that can't go unnoticed.

It's a song that probably wouldn't have appeared on earlier records, although pj deteactors in the early years considered pj one small remove from hair metal anyway.

My larger point was that I see no reason to think that the existence of stuff like red dot, soon forget, or wasted reprise were somehow keeping songs like sirens off the record, or that they are incompatible

i get what you're saying and you may be right. that being said, Ed claimed, when promoting LB and to ackowledge the corporate rock/hair metal roots of Sirens, that they'd stop caring what Mark Arm thought about their songs. so there's that stance that may (or may not) signify that current PJ doesn't care either about what they used to be. there's got to be something to think about when the band you used to love is now recording a power-ballad single that the singer can barely handle live just weeks after its release.

I think the fact that they aren't letting their sound be determined by what some random guy thinks is cool is great. They've been out of high school for a long time. What that has to do with whether or not Eddie can handle a song live don't know.

releasing their most commercial song yet, that's a huge departure - or a stylistic regression? - as a single that their frontman can't convincingly reproduce live speaks volumes as to where the band is, the importance they put in being a great band. i don't think there was this kind of occurences (downtuning newly-released songs) before Backspacer. now it's almost like it's their modus operandi.

So Eddie can't nail a song or things are downtuned because they are lazy or because it's part of the PRAMG or both?

There are two seperate things going on here. Eddies more limited capacity as a vocalist and writing songs that mark arm won't like. I wouldn't conflate them

[VinylGuy]

The Fixer live is pretty cool, specially if you are there. Its really fun.

[stip]

Sirens was great in NYC 2

[digster]

There's nothing necessarily wrong with trying to write radio hits provided you can do it well. Pearl Jam haven't really offered much evidence that they can do it well. I don't really care what their motivation is, whether it's writing songs to hit the charts or make Mark Arm happy, provided the end result is something worthwhile.

[Heathen]

Aren't trying a really shitty thing and lightning bolting basically the same thing?

[Heathen]

I don't think the songs are very good. And I don't really buy the idea that it's a different approach, or that they're breaking new ground or experimenting or anything like that. It's a rock album made by a rock band with songs that I don't enjoy (except for Got Some).

This is the closest we'll ever come to sucking each other's cock.

[Lament]

This is the closest we'll ever come to sucking each other's cock.

[stip]

There's nothing necessarily wrong with trying to write radio hits provided you can do it well. Pearl Jam haven't really offered much evidence that they can do it well. I don't really care what their motivation is, whether it's writing songs to hit the charts or make Mark Arm happy, provided the end result is something worthwhile.

Well, they have managed to score some pretty big radio hits. Isn't that evidence?

[hlniv]

I still dont get the hatred Backspacer gets. Maybe because of the fixer video or the Target thing? Because even if you dont like it musically or lyrically, it was a very different approach for the band.

And yes, they gained a lot of new fans with this one.

There have been many explanations of the commonly held low opinion of this album throughout this thread, i.e. my post on page 16 for one. I think the reasoning behind these opinions is pretty well communicated. Of course, there are some who disagree, but its pretty hard to justify saying that you don't get why people don't like it. It's been discussed ad nauseam.

I still vehemently disagree with the opinion that they "gained a lot of new fans with this one". I'm sure some people who hadn't liked Pearl Jam prior did enjoy the album, but I'm willing to wager vast sums of money that there were more who owned their prior albums, and wrote them off after this album. My estimate (based on zero quantifiable data, granted) is that the net result is negative fan flow.

Of course, were there some new folks who liked Just Breathe? - yes. My admin assistant (31 years old - smoking hot) is one. But she still ain't no PJ fan.

[hlniv]

The Fixer live is pretty cool, specially if you are there. Its really fun.

Uggh....

I bet Miley Cyrus is pretty "fun" live, too

[Jorge]

There's nothing necessarily wrong with trying to write radio hits provided you can do it well. Pearl Jam haven't really offered much evidence that they can do it well. I don't really care what their motivation is, whether it's writing songs to hit the charts or make Mark Arm happy, provided the end result is something worthwhile.

Well, they have managed to score some pretty big radio hits. Isn't that evidence?

Yeah, I don't know if those are the words I would've used, considering the first half of their career is chock-full of radio hits. I think it's more about the type of pop songwriting they've been attempting.

[digster]

There's nothing necessarily wrong with trying to write radio hits provided you can do it well. Pearl Jam haven't really offered much evidence that they can do it well. I don't really care what their motivation is, whether it's writing songs to hit the charts or make Mark Arm happy, provided the end result is something worthwhile.

Well, they have managed to score some pretty big radio hits. Isn't that evidence?

I meant write good songs when trying to write radio hits. I wasn't meaning to bring up chart positions or anything.

[Tuolumne]

This could be generalizing, but some of the Backspacer criticism seems to be "it's not what I expect of them" or "it's not what they do best", which is ironic from those that adore Vitalogy and No Code (of which I am one) when that was all we heard from the Ten lovers at the time.

[stip]

There's nothing necessarily wrong with trying to write radio hits provided you can do it well. Pearl Jam haven't really offered much evidence that they can do it well. I don't really care what their motivation is, whether it's writing songs to hit the charts or make Mark Arm happy, provided the end result is something worthwhile.

Well, they have managed to score some pretty big radio hits. Isn't that evidence?

I meant write good songs when trying to write radio hits. I wasn't meaning to bring up chart positions or anything.

I realized that after I replied.

But I think sirens, fixer, and just breathe are all good songs. Not all time classics, but good. I enjoy all 3. For a long time I would have come close to calling fixer a top song, but not anymore

[stip]

Backspacer is Pearl Jam with a tan, and a shitty goatee, and frosted tips.

Which is still better than Pearl Jam pulling its wagon into town and going "Whatever it was you liked, we can still do that! Really! I swear! Mid-90's crunch? Anthemic balladry? Wave-like structures that build and then restart? Meandering mood pieces with cryptic lyrics? Oh god please still like us because we can almost write songs that remind you of way better songs from before..."

Give me Pearl Jam trying a really shitty thing over Pearl Jam Lightning Bolting all over any day of the week.

So this template was okay for ten, and vs, and vitalogy, and no code, and yield, and probably binaural, and riot act, and s/t, and backspacer, but now it's suddenly a problem at the level of formula, as opposed to execution?

[Lament]

99% of everything in this world is in the execution, c'mon now.

[stip]

Look, all I'm saying is that every Pearl Jam album is largely structured the same way, with the same types of songs. This may be a valid critique, but given how it applies to every stage of a 20+ year career it seems like something of an odd charge to level exclusively at lightning bolt.

[stip]

For instance, if you think the bright immediacy and a sensibility that is pushing the songs towards accessibility and familiarity is a problem with Lightning Bolt that makes sense. It's a critique that is actually leveled at the album--rather than being shocked and mildly outraged by the fact that pearl jam made a pearl jam record.

[bodysnatcher]

it's kinda like making a portrait in Photoshop versus an oil painting.