Backspacer: Official Album Thread

[Lament]

I've never made a sex tape before

What's wrong with you?

[stip]

I dated adventurous women when it was logistically difficult, and married one who would think the idea was silly

[Lament]

There's a parallel here to be made to your relationship with Pearl Jam, but I'm gonna let someone else make it.

[Heathen]

The fact that such an intellectually dishonest person is in charge of educating the youth of America is making me very anxious about the future of our civilization.

[stip]

We do leave the windows open so god can watch

[stip]

The fact that such an intellectually dishonest person is in charge of educating the youth of America is making me very anxious about the future of our civilization.

Don't worry. I don't get all of them

[Heathen]

Yeah but if you made it to teacher then that means there might be many, many more of your kind in that profession.

[harmless]

The best part about glitter and doom was that I no longer need to go see tom waits. I have a bootleg.

If the performance came off like a trainwreck in the live album, it was certainly a trainwreck in person. You're just not listening hard enough 'cause you're so pumped to be there. But you don't get to say "they're a great live band." That's demonstrably untrue.

Shit, sometimes the bootlegs sound even better than the actual shows. That was certainly the case with the show I saw last year. And it has nothing to do with the performance itself, but the fact that I can hear it more clearly because their live sound mix is mush.

This might be something to do with the fact that I'm always sitting in the wheelchair balcony thing for gigs, rather than rocking out in the standing area at the front. I get to just sit back, listen, light a doobie and kick back and enjoy. So yeah, I get all tingly and excited when the atmosphere is great but I can also hear every fuck up, and each one eats away at my soul a tiny bit.

[harmless]

I don't really light a doobie. That would be fun though.

[stip]

The best part about glitter and doom was that I no longer need to go see tom waits. I have a bootleg.

If the performance came off like a trainwreck in the live album, it was certainly a trainwreck in person. You're just not listening hard enough 'cause you're so pumped to be there. But you don't get to say "they're a great live band." That's demonstrably untrue.

Shit, sometimes the bootlegs sound even better than the actual shows. That was certainly the case with the show I saw last year. And it has nothing to do with the performance itself, but the fact that I can hear it more clearly because their live sound mix is mush.

I missed this post. I'm almost home and give it a real response

[harmless]

Stip, there is no meaningful rebuttal to that post.

[harmless]

PJ were once a great live band, which created enough trust and addiction in some of their fans to last them long after that live greatness had waned. That'll do.

[stip]

Stip, there is no meaningful rebuttal to that post.

of course there is.

[stip]

excuse me for a moment while I make it.

[stip]

The best part about glitter and doom was that I no longer need to go see tom waits. I have a bootleg.

If the performance came off like a trainwreck in the live album, it was certainly a trainwreck in person. You're just not listening hard enough 'cause you're so pumped to be there. But you don't get to say "they're a great live band." That's demonstrably untrue.

Shit, sometimes the bootlegs sound even better than the actual shows. That was certainly the case with the show I saw last year. And it has nothing to do with the performance itself, but the fact that I can hear it more clearly because their live sound mix is mush.

My issue is this. When people talk about whether or not a band is good live they are usually (I think) talking about the experience of seeing that band perform live. And the musical performance is obviously a critical part of that. But it is not the only part. If it wasn't, then we could really just get by with listening to bootlegs and calling it a day. The bootlegs will probably be the best document of how accurately songs were played, what notes were missed, etc. And if what you really want to hear is a band playing some songs then the bootlegs will be fine. And clearly pearl jam isn't as good on that front as they used to be.

But that's not the entirety of the live performance. If it was I would be correct and we could just stay home and listen to bootlegs and not need to go to a show ever again. The experience of hearing it in person is woven into what live music is. This is why the bootlegs are not enough. And a lot goes into the experience that cannot be captured by a bootleg. The resonance of a singer's voice, for instance. But even more important is the feeling of being there, the way in which existing in that moment, participating in it, helps amplify the experience. This is why almost everyone raved about the shows they went to on the forums and didn't start griping about them until later.

The experience of being there is something that the artist helps to create. The interactions with the audience, the ability to take the audience on a journey, to control their emotions, to build up energy and offer a release, to create the sense that you are a part of something larger than yourself. And Pearl Jam does that masterfully well. The devotion to that aspect of the live performance probably undercuts the playing. Pearl Jam is regularly playing 30+ song sets with a vast array of material they are drawing on. It means that they will not be able to go all out on every single song. It means that songs could be rehearsed better. And you'll hear that on a bootleg. But when you're there in the moment you don't care because part of the excitement is not knowing what is coming next. It could be anything.

You said yourself you don't notice mistakes because you're pumped to be there. My point is that you're pumped for a reason. And that reason is an integral part of what live music is. What I take issue with is a definition of live music that excludes the live part. That the live experience is somehow illusory and the truth is in the bootleg. The bootleg is an incomplete document, an imperfect reproduction, even if there are elements of live music that it reproduces perfectly

Pearl jam plays more and more to that aspect of live music. Perhaps once upon a time they could do both. But I'm not arguing pearl jam is in their prime. I am saying that pearl jam today focuses on making sure that your concert experience is amazing. And near as I can tell, they are still enormously successful at hitting that mark.

[McParadigm]

if what you really want to hear is a band playing some songs.....clearly pearl jam isn't as good on that front as they used to be.

aw-huh

the ability to take the audience on a journey, to control their emotions, to build up energy and offer a release, to create the sense that you are a part of something larger than yourself. And Pearl Jam does that masterfully well.

[digster]

I think the music matters less in general to the concertgoers at a typical PJ show now, for better or for worse. People are there to see friends, drink, high-five when you get a rare b-side. I'm not attaching a value judgment to that; it just is. PJ don't need to be on their game nearly as much.

As for the live environment/atmosphere, I agree entirely, and think that there is a unique aspect to shows that may not come across on a bootleg and comes across better in the room. Thing is, though, PJ has always been able to do that; I felt it at my first show and at my last show. They used to be able to do it while playing well, though.

[stip]

if what you really want to hear is a band playing some songs.....clearly pearl jam isn't as good on that front as they used to be.

aw-huh

the ability to take the audience on a journey, to control their emotions, to build up energy and offer a release, to create the sense that you are a part of something larger than yourself. And Pearl Jam does that masterfully well.

Sit down, you're ruining it for everyone

[Norah]

Wait, so vocal resonance can't be captured in a recording now?

[stip]

elements are lost, yes.