Star Wars: Episode VII: The Force Awakens (2015)

[BurtReynolds]

what if it has Jar Jar?

[McParadigm]

Im just saying that im going to have a fucking blast watching it and ill probably ride that high. And when/if that fades, thats okay too. if this movie ends up being less enjoyable, thats okay too.

No reason not to

[Strat]

what if it has Jar Jar?

Ill walk out of the fucking theater

[epilogue]

what if it has Jar Jar?

Han better shoot first.

[LetMeSleep]

It's 2.5 hrs of your life. It'll be fine guys.

[stip]

The notion that the new movie has a reasonable chance of being better than parts of the original trilogy.

It'll be more than good enough to revive Star Wars as a property that generates excitement and joy. There's no need to pull down better movies in order to sing its praises beyond that.

I dont think anyone has done that cept for burt?

Stip?

I dont recall him pulling down the OT to justify potentially loving this film.

I have said that the prequels impacted my perception of the OT, and my overall love for Star Wars. But all was forgiven in that final shot in the first teaser trailer

[stip]

oh, and obviously as scary as Darth vader is he couldn't beat smaug

[dimejinky99]

One of 6 different covers. Also some 3D lenticulars

[LoathedVermin72]

The notion that the new movie has a reasonable chance of being better than parts of the original trilogy.

It'll be more than good enough to revive Star Wars as a property that generates excitement and joy. There's no need to pull down better movies in order to sing its praises beyond that.

I dont think anyone has done that cept for burt?

Stip?

I dont recall him pulling down the OT to justify potentially loving this film.

I have said that the prequels impacted my perception of the OT, and my overall love for Star Wars. But all was forgiven in that final shot in the first teaser trailer

How did they affect your perception of the OT?

[epilogue]

The prequels managed to highlight the things that were bad about the OT. Things people were willing to let go or overlook or maybe didn't even notice in the way the movies were plotted and written became ugly and obvious. People began to rewatch the OT through the lens of the PT. Those movies were so bad, they made the flaws in other movies obvious to those how had never seen or cared about them before.

[E.H. Ruddock]

As bad as the prequels were, and as beloved as the OT was, what happens if these new ones are just somewhere in between? Will that be acceptable to Star Wars nerds?

[epilogue]

I have no idea.

But I have no grasp on what a Star Wars nerd is anymore. I mean that one guy in that long-ass speculation video is wearing a Star Wars shirt, surrounded by toys and says he's not a big fan. But he knows everything except the names of the new characters and he frequents Wookiepedia or whatever.

But I'd guess that the prequels were bad enough that even if these are just meh people will revere them.

[Strat]

The prequels managed to highlight the things that were bad about the OT. Things people were willing to let go or overlook or maybe didn't even notice in the way the movies were plotted and written became ugly and obvious. People began to rewatch the OT through the lens of the PT. Those movies were so bad, they made the flaws in other movies obvious to those how had never seen or cared about them before.

I still dont understand this unless you have some concrete examples.

Its like pearl jam, no matter what they do or what they have aged into, it will never change my love or perception of the greatness that came before it.

[epilogue]

The prequels managed to highlight the things that were bad about the OT. Things people were willing to let go or overlook or maybe didn't even notice in the way the movies were plotted and written became ugly and obvious. People began to rewatch the OT through the lens of the PT. Those movies were so bad, they made the flaws in other movies obvious to those how had never seen or cared about them before.

I still dont understand this unless you have some concrete examples.

Its like pearl jam, no matter what they do or what they have aged into, it will never change my love or perception of the greatness that came before it.

I was just trying to answer Vermin from my own experience. Maybe Stip will say something totally different. But virtually everyone I know (anecdotal evidence being limited and pretty much bullshit) has had the experience I described.

What the people I'm talking about love about the OT is the nostalgia of it. The way it made them feel. And there's nothing at all wrong with that. Most of what I like about art is the way it makes me feel. But the movies outside of Empire aren't well crafted. But people used to think they were. People would talk about how perfect the scripts were. Until they saw the PT and the blemishes overshadowed the fun.

The difference with the OT is that the fun way overshadows the blemishes. Same with Abrams' Star Trek (for me, not for a lot of people). Whatever is wrong with that movie, what's right about it is so fucking right that it's easy to ignore the stuff that's wrong -- not wrong, imperfect, or lacking.

[LoathedVermin72]

I wouldn't say ANH and ROTJ aren't well-crafted.

[epilogue]

I wouldn't say ANH and ROTJ aren't well-crafted.

Yeah, maybe that's unfair. What's a better word... ? Because they are well made. A lot of talent and time and imagination and craftsmanship went into them. They are technical achievements and all of that. But they are generic in structure. And obvious. And sort of paint-by-numbers films.

But yeah they are well made or whatever.

[LoathedVermin72]

I wouldn't say ANH and ROTJ aren't well-crafted.

Yeah, maybe that's unfair. What's a better word... ? Because they are well made. A lot of talent and time and imagination and craftsmanship went into them. They are technical achievements and all of that. But they are generic in structure. And obvious. And sort of paint-by-numbers films.

But yeah they are well made or whatever.

I dunno, I would argue that ANH is the best-structured film of the whole series. Characters undergo meaningful arcs and change in big ways without it feeling forced or disingenuous. ANH is the only SW film to date that is self-contained. Massive amounts of world-building and character development happen without the film feeling overly expository. The interactions between Luke, Obi-Wan, C-3PO, R2-D2, Han, Leia, Chewie, and Vader are dynamic, compelling, and meaningful. The protagonist's motivations are tied to the antagonist(s) in a personal way. It ends with a triumphant, well-earned (in story and character terms) victory. And it never comes off as rushed; the atmosphere breathes comfortably. I think it's an exceptionally well-crafted piece of pop filmmaking.

[Norah]

ANH has probably suffered from time and genre saturation. When it was released the whole fantasy genre wasn't as big as it got over the decades following it. It's a pretty straight forward fantasy story, with the hero living in exile learning about his true parentage and embarking on a journey to defeat a dark power. The whole idea of that story probably seemed a lot fresher when ANH was first released, but at this point in time it's one of dozens.

[LoathedVermin72]

ANH has probably suffered from time and genre saturation. When it was released the whole fantasy genre wasn't as big as it got over the decades following it. It's a pretty straight forward fantasy story, with the hero living in exile learning about his true parentage and embarking on a journey to defeat a dark power. The whole idea of that story probably seemed a lot fresher when ANH was first released, but at this point in time it's one of dozens.

That's the bones of the story, yeah, and looked at in such broad terms, yes, it is generic genre material. But the specificity beyond that basic blueprint is, as I just laid out, more sophisticated and remarkable than just that.

[epilogue]

I wouldn't say ANH and ROTJ aren't well-crafted.

Yeah, maybe that's unfair. What's a better word... ? Because they are well made. A lot of talent and time and imagination and craftsmanship went into them. They are technical achievements and all of that. But they are generic in structure. And obvious. And sort of paint-by-numbers films.

But yeah they are well made or whatever.

I dunno, I would argue that ANH is the best-structured film of the whole series. Characters undergo meaningful arcs and change in big ways without it feeling forced or disingenuous. ANH is the only SW film to date that is self-contained. Massive amounts of world-building and character development happen without the film feeling overly expository. The interactions between Luke, Obi-Wan, C-3PO, R2-D2, Han, Leia, Chewie, and Vader are dynamic, compelling, and meaningful. The protagonist's motivations are tied to the antagonist(s) in a personal way. It ends with a triumphant, well-earned (in story and character terms) victory. And it never comes off as rushed; the atmosphere breathes comfortably. I think it's an exceptionally well-crafted piece of pop filmmaking.

Exactly. The structure is pure paint-by-numbers. It's Joseph Campbell, chapter by chapter. I agree it's well made, as I've said. It's just boring and obvious. Practical. Satisfying but comfortable. There's no real danger. Which is why we love it. It's exciting without being risky. It's your first assignment in Screenwriting 101. And it works.