Bowie - Blackstar (2016) & RIP David Bowie :(

[Kaius]

"I don't like her music or shtick, so she's talentless dreck."

[epilogue]

Guys, I vote we quit talking about Lady Gaga in the Bowie thread. Take it to the "Things I Just Don't Understand" thread. At least the Annie Clarke comparison is within the realm of reason.

[VinylGuy]

"I don't like her music or shtick, so she's talentless dreck."

Nobody said that i think...

[Kaius]

"Annie Clark plays guitar and is less mainstream and thus more hip so she would be a way better tribute to that Bowie guy who was so hip and not mainstream"

[Kaius]

"I don't like her music or shtick, so she's talentless dreck."

Nobody said that i think...

That was a direct quote sir.

[epilogue]

"Annie Clark plays guitar and is less mainstream and thus more hip so she would be a way better tribute to that Bowie guy who was so hip and not mainstream"

Um, that's not at all what I was saying when I suggested Annie Clark.

[Kaius]

"I didn't say that"

[Brett]

Before she was Lady Gaga, wasn't she a pretty successful songwriter for other singers? I see Trag's post about some guy that he claims did the actual writing, but I wonder if that's the same case as the "Cobain wrote all of Hole's songs" line of belief. Essentially that a woman can't write music, so a man must have done it and let her take the credit.

Though to be honest, I don't like her music anyway, and I couldn't care less.

[tragabigzanda]

Top 10 maybe?
Hello Morning
Close Captioned
The Kill
Place/Position
Do You Like Me?
Latest Disgrace
Recap Modotti
Nightshop
Break
Life & Limb

I'd maybe bump Life & Limb for Epic Problem

[LoathedVermin72]

Originality and risk are not the only things that can make music good. In fact, in and of themselves, they do not make music good.

[epilogue]

Originality and risk are not the only things that can make music good. In fact, in and of themselves, they do not make music good.

And while we're at it, we should probably go ahead and divorce the word "talent" entirely from words like "risk" and "failure" and "originality" as well.

[LoathedVermin72]

Trag, I think your personal experiences in the business have caused you to place inordinate focus on artists' motivations and methods, which ultimately have little-to-nothing to do with the quality of the art itself.

[Mine]

She was never able to sustain her initial success and she was probably considered the most promising new mainstream act in the beginning. Her record sells went from 15 million (in 2008) to 6 to 2,5 million to something above 600,000 worldwide. That's a standard decline in pop though she does have the talent that lets her sustain a career but nowhere near what was expected from her. She's at a point in her music career when she desperately needs a comeback.
From a mainstream success point of view she's just another supposed to be new Madonna that wasn't.

[epilogue]

Now that she's a Golden Globe Award winning actress who continues to get rave reviews for her work, I wonder how much she really cares about a full fledged singing or pop music career at this point. Be interesting to see what she does.

[tragabigzanda]

[epilogue]

And while we're at it, we should probably go ahead and divorce the word "talent" entirely from words like "risk" and "failure" and "originality" as well.

Fine, but then what are we left with? Technique? We've already established she knows how to sing and write lyrics. Should we judge her on her keen fashion sense? Does she get to pretend she's as great as Bowie 'coz they both wore weird outfits for a time?

All I've ever been talking about in this thread is her talent as a singer. That's it. I don't give a good tin shit how anyone else judges anything she does or wears or writes. Saying she has no talent is false and ignorant. That's all I've ever argued here.

Now that she's a Golden Globe Award winning actress who continues to get rave reviews for her work, I wonder how much she really cares about a full fledged singing or pop music career at this point. Be interesting to see what she does.

Sure. She definitely has that "it factor," I'll give her that. But what has she done that anyone here would call compelling music? That's not a rhetorical question.

Well, it may not be rhetorical but it's pretty stupid. She has multiple albums worth of material that someone, in fact MANY people, would call compelling music. Alejandro, Bad Romance, Born this Way, Poker Face, Just Dance, Paparazzi... this list goes on and on. Like Verm said, just because you or I don't like it, just because it's not what we prefer it absolutely doesn't mean its worthless or not compelling.

For myself, I'm not a big fan of her music. Most of it is uninteresting to annoying. But there are standouts. I absolutely love Alejandro and think it is compelling to the say the least. I also enjoy Bad Romance and Born this Way quite a bit.

[LoathedVermin72]

But what has she done that anyone here would call compelling music? That's not a rhetorical question.

Of course. I thought I made that pretty clear. I think she's made a ton of great pop songs. Again, the fact that you don't find her music is compelling does not mean she has no talent or value. That is solipsistic nonsense.

[Jorge]

"Speechless" is a hell of a song. I also watched her quote a Rachmaninoff piano concerto into an acoustic performance of "Paparazzi". Come on guys, you sound really silly when you say she has no talent.

[Kevin Davis]

I don't understand the idea that someone would have to have had a career that perfectly reflects Bowie's in order to credibly go on TV and sing a few of his songs. It's the Grammys -- who cares? Plus, I'm not terribly confident that Annie Clark is really a "tribute"-type artist -- she sounded like a robot up there singing "Lithium" a few years ago.

[Jorge]

But she did a hell of a job playing "Big Black Mariah" that one time.