America..why won't you just ban the fucking gun?

[Simple Torture]

Quick thought/question: do politicians (especially GOPers, but I'm willing to toss in everyone) skirt the issue of mental illness and gun control because it'll involve having to talk about access to guns for vets with PTSD?

[simple schoolboy]

Quick thought/question: do politicians (especially GOPers, but I'm willing to toss in everyone) skirt the issue of mental illness and gun control because it'll involve having to talk about access to guns for vets with PTSD?

The NRA hasnt skirted the issue, and its not my impression that the GOP has either. If anything, they were given guff for bringing it up as a distraction. They've also gotten pushback, because anything less than involuntary commitment seems like an abridgement of rights without due process, just like the no fly/ terrorist watchlist.

It doesn't seem like a particulalry fertile avenue for reducing harm as its both difficult to come up with a reasonable lower threshold on making folks ineligible and its not a main driver of gun deaths. Theres certainly room for tightening up reporting requirements, but other than that it seems like a bit of a distraction.

Californias response has been to allow family members to report someone and get their guns taken away. 21 days later the person can start the legal process to be cleared. I dont know how useful that is, without a 72 hour hold for a psychiatric hold. All I forsee is a whole bunch of pissed exes using it as leverage in custodial cases, and other similar abuses.

What we really need is more beds in psychiatric facilities. That'd be too easy though.

[jwfocker]

Quick thought/question: do politicians (especially GOPers, but I'm willing to toss in everyone) skirt the issue of mental illness and gun control because it'll involve having to talk about access to guns for vets with PTSD?

The NRA hasnt skirted the issue, and its not my impression that the GOP has either. If anything, they were given guff for bringing it up as a distraction. They've also gotten pushback, because anything less than involuntary commitment seems like an abridgement of rights without due process, just like the no fly/ terrorist watchlist.

It doesn't seem like a particulalry fertile avenue for reducing harm as its both difficult to come up with a reasonable lower threshold on making folks ineligible and its not a main driver of gun deaths. Theres certainly room for tightening up reporting requirements, but other than that it seems like a bit of a distraction.

Californias response has been to allow family members to report someone and get their guns taken away. 21 days later the person can start the legal process to be cleared. I dont know how useful that is, without a 72 hour hold for a psychiatric hold. All I forsee is a whole bunch of pissed exes using it as leverage in custodial cases, and other similar abuses.

What we really need is more beds in psychiatric facilities. That'd be too easy though.

Interesting. I've read nothing that would make anyone think this what so ever. Curious stance to have.

[Mine]

The NRA hasnt skirted the issue, and its not my impression that the GOP has either. If anything, they were given guff for bringing it up as a distraction.

It's still a staple argument whenever gun control is addressed and i have the impression as if it became the artificial common ground between liberals and conservatives.

What we really need is more beds in psychiatric facilities. That'd be too easy though.

Isn't this just a small part of the issues with mental care (probably everywhere)? The people who are and can be hospitalized in psychiatric facilities are far less than the people who aren't but need to be under care and medication to control their symptoms which is probably a bigger issue in practice.

[LetMeSleep]

As an outsider, I can't for the life of me see how anyone can have any objection to what Obama has proposed.

[bada]

As an outsider, I can't for the life of me see how anyone can have any objection to what Obama has proposed.

[Strat]

As an outsider, I can't for the life of me see how anyone can have any objection to what Obama has proposed.

Welcome to 'merica

[b_i_revisited]

Quick thought/question: do politicians (especially GOPers, but I'm willing to toss in everyone) skirt the issue of mental illness and gun control because it'll involve having to talk about access to guns for vets with PTSD?

The NRA hasnt skirted the issue, and its not my impression that the GOP has either. If anything, they were given guff for bringing it up as a distraction. They've also gotten pushback, because anything less than involuntary commitment seems like an abridgement of rights without due process, just like the no fly/ terrorist watchlist.

I agree, but it the NRA and Red Team tend to do it in a disingenuous way and only when defending someone who looks like them.

It doesn't seem like a particulalry fertile avenue for reducing harm as its both difficult to come up with a reasonable lower threshold on making folks ineligible and its not a main driver of gun deaths. Theres certainly room for tightening up reporting requirements, but other than that it seems like a bit of a distraction.

I agree it's very difficult to set a threshold and opens up an avenue for abuse and discrimination, but I disagree about the potential effectiveness of it if you include more common mental health issues like depression and PTSD. Roughly two out of every three gun deaths in the US are suicides:

2013:
firearm suicides 21,175
homicides 11,201

A interesting breakdown to keep in mind when you hear things like "35,000 people were killed by guns in the US last year" (and US suicide rates are comparable to other first world nations, the only difference is we shoot ourselves, driving up our gun death stats, and they don't) and also a very good reason to not only expand mental health care availability under insurance, something I applaud President Obama for doing in the ACA, but also a reason for making periodic psychological evaluations a requirement for owning a gun. Detecting depression earlier in gun owners would help reduce suicides and counseling would help reduce the instances of acquaintance murder by gun, which is the most common kind. Please also note that according to a recent Washington Post investigation into fatal shootings by police, over 1/4 of those shot had mental illness issues. Assuming the goal is to reduce the total number of lives lost to guns, it seems to me that addressing mental health in the population at large the best place to start and would have many peripheral benefits as well.

[Biff Pocoroba]

Maybe because it's a new year but we got a new emergency procedures handout. It lists what to do in case of severe weather or fire but this one is changed to include active shooter as well.

[Fuck You Jobu]

2nd time in a week a clerk in Chicago shot armed robbers with guns.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/loca ... story.html

Clerk with concealed gun permit shoots 2 robbers at cellphone store

A employee at a Far South Side cellphone retailer shot two would-be robbers late Wednesday morning, at least the second time in a week a worker has shot two robbery suspects at a Chicago business, according to police and store officials.

Two men drew handguns as they entered a cellphone store, 2051 E. 95th St., in the Calumet Heights neighborhood around 11 a.m., prompting a worker to take out his own firearm and shoot them, according to an account from employees given to Neil Tadros, who identified himself as the district manager for T-Mobile.

The employee shot both of the suspects, but they fled the store, got in a car and drove themselves to the hospital, Tadros said. At the time the suspects brandished weapons, employees acted, “pretty much to protect themselves when guns are drawn at them,” Tadros said.

“Thank God for concealed carry.”

The men, ages 24 and 35, walked into South Shore Hospital and were transferred in serious condition to Stroger Hospital, police said. The 35-year-old man suffered a gunshot wound to his left arm and groin, and the 24-year-old man was shot in the left arm and abdomen, police said.

The two were suspects in the attempted robbery, and charges were pending, police said.

AJ Joudeh, who identified himself as a regional manager for T-Mobile, said the company allows employees with concealed carry licenses to have weapons at work. In the aftermath of Wednesday’s shooting, Joudeh closed the store and sent employees home for the day.

A cellphone store employee with a concealed carry license shot two would-be robbers. Jan. 13, 2016. (Tony Briscoe / Chicago Tribune)
“From what I hear, they’re doing fine,” Joudeh said of the workers.

T-Mobile spokeswoman Annie Garrigan said the store is an independant dealer of T-Mobile products, not owned or operated by the company.

Both Tadros and Joudeh said the clerk had a concealed carry permit, which a police spokesman also confirmed.

Tadros said he hopes allowing employees to have weapons with a concealed carry license will be a deterrent.

“A lot of people think they can go out and rob people without anyone defending themselves,” Tadros said. “It’s a great thing to have to protect yourself even when you’re not in your business. If you’re out in the streets and someone is threatening your life, you can go out and protect yourself."

On Saturday, a liquor store employee shot and killed two teens, 15 and 17, inside Z&S Food & Liquor, 1351 W. 87th St., when they tried to rob the store around 8:30 p.m., authorities said.

[doug rr]

reports coming out of san diego of an active shooter at a naval hospital

[dpupenya]

reports coming out of san diego of an active shooter at a naval hospital

False alarm

[dpupenya]

What's up in Denver

[dpupenya]

Guess it was a couple rival bike gangs at a convention...

[Stickman]

Michigan Man Goes On 7 Hour Rampage, kills 6 randomly

[stip]

That seems like a small total given what this guy did

[hlniv]

From a CNN article on the Kalamazoo shootings...

For the past 10 years, Sally and Gary Pardo have lived across the street from Dalton's single-family home on Douglas Street in Kalamazoo.

Sally Pardo told CNN that Dalton is married with two children and that they seemed to be a "typical American family."

"This seems so out of sorts for him," said husband Gary Pardo, who described Dalton as "quiet" and "nice."

He did tell CNN, however, "I know he liked guns."

Getting, the prosecutor, said he didn't know whether Dalton had a license for the handgun that was seized at the time of his arrest.

Hadley, the public safety chief, said authorities have seized other weapons from Dalton's residence as well. It was not immediately known whether those weapons were used in the commission of crimes.

I know it's not a crime to like guns. But why does it seem that almost every one of these mass shootings is by someone who is generally normal, but just so happens to be a gun nut? Normal people snap. And then when they have ample firearms at their ready disposal, this is a easily foreseen outcome.

Let's think about that for a second in our debate about guns in this country....

[Peeps]

we really need to ban uber

[Redemption]

If you talk about shooters, which for some terrible reason has been happening more and more lately.....

there have been cases where some of the people had their concealed weapon permits, people were packing handguns.....but they didn't want to be identified as one of the shooters, so they did nothing. kind of gives you an idea of the chaos of those situations.

So uhm, take the guns away....who's in charge of that? the gov't?


I would be supportive of an assault rifle ban, fucking deer don't shoot back, you don't need 30 round clips. however i would very much be against a gov't agency who's sole purpose was to disarm the people.

[hlniv]

Who said anything about taking guns away?

Just make them fucking hard to get. Like really fucking hard. Like even harder than getting a drivers license!

For the deadly weapon called the automobile, we make people pass an operator test before getting a state issued ID card that is required by law to be in your possession when operating the weapon. We regulate safety measures, provide government funds to manage the use, require liability insurance, and make all operators reregister their weapon every year along with paying a tax on that registration.

For the deadly weapon called the gun, we make people fill out a form, maybe wait a while, maybe not, maybe show an ID, maybe not. And that's it. It makes no fucking sense