Red Mosquito

wease wrote:What about pre-hive crimes? Uncle Frankie has been molesting 7-year-old Sally. Sally never told anyone. But now little Sally’s mom and dad and hell, the whole world knows about it. Not only they, they have the memories and feelings of her being molested by him and his memories and feelings of molesting her. All at once those experiences are shared by the world. Is he now punished? They can’t do harm to other humans. Whose sense of right or wrong does the collective adhere to? Sally’s or Uncle Frankie? Does the collective accept Frankie’s sense of morality and see no wrong in molesting little kids?

guys is wease ok

We can’t rule out that the infected are being controlled. Someone’s calling the shots.

I do wonder, and I’ll keep an eye out next episode for clues, if the collective mind “feels” what everyone felt or just “knows” what everyone thought. I think there’s a distinction there.

I also think that something no one has honed in on in this thread is how pirate lady said that they “Can’t choose”—in context it was choosing between Carol and McFucksALot, because choosing would hurt one of them. But I wonder if that spreads out to other types of decisions, and how that will play down the line. Is Carol going to try and convince them that forcing her into the collective will harm her, as a way of staving it off and buying time? We’ll see.

Simple Torture wrote:I do think it’s an interesting moral problem. Would you give up YOUR individuality to end suffering forever? And if you’re willing to do that, if you think it’s the right thing to do, does that mean it’s a moral imperative required of every other person? (I see you, Kant.) So maybe tree is right that this wouldn’t just feel better but is GOOD in a way no other thing people could do would be good?

(With the caveat, as Carol points out, that no one asked for this.)

Thank you for this. Seems like the logical outcome of humanity's (consciousness's) evolution

Simple Torture wrote:

wease wrote:What about pre-hive crimes? Uncle Frankie has been molesting 7-year-old Sally. Sally never told anyone. But now little Sally’s mom and dad and hell, the whole world knows about it. Not only they, they have the memories and feelings of her being molested by him and his memories and feelings of molesting her. All at once those experiences are shared by the world. Is he now punished? They can’t do harm to other humans. Whose sense of right or wrong does the collective adhere to? Sally’s or Uncle Frankie? Does the collective accept Frankie’s sense of morality and see no wrong in molesting little kids?

guys is wease ok

Lol

It doesn't work like that wease

10 mins into episode 1 and it's hilarious how extremely Vince Gilligan this is

Enjoying it

daft twat wrote:

wease wrote:What about pre-hive crimes? Uncle Frankie has been molesting 7-year-old Sally. Sally never told anyone. But now little Sally’s mom and dad and hell, the whole world knows about it. Not only they, they have the memories and feelings of her being molested by him and his memories and feelings of molesting her. All at once those experiences are shared by the world. Is he now punished? They can’t do harm to other humans. Whose sense of right or wrong does the collective adhere to? Sally’s or Uncle Frankie? Does the collective accept Frankie’s sense of morality and see no wrong in molesting little kids?

I don’t think little Sally’s mom and dad have this knowledge at all. I don’t think they’re occupying those bodies. They’ve been erased or put in hibernation or something. I think collective brought its own moral compass and will act according to that, not to something they learned while watching the molestation home movies they now have access to.

That may be, but they do have the knowledge of it. Remember Carol asking the little kid about speculums used for Pap smears? And everyone has the knowledge to fly jet aircraft. Everyone has access to everyone else’s memories and feelings.

spike wrote:We can’t rule out that the infected are being controlled. Someone’s calling the shots.

aliens? aliens

Jorge wrote:10 mins into episode 1 and it's hilarious how extremely Vince Gilligan this is

Enjoying it

exactly!

tree_ wrote:

Simple Torture wrote:

wease wrote:What about pre-hive crimes? Uncle Frankie has been molesting 7-year-old Sally. Sally never told anyone. But now little Sally’s mom and dad and hell, the whole world knows about it. Not only they, they have the memories and feelings of her being molested by him and his memories and feelings of molesting her. All at once those experiences are shared by the world. Is he now punished? They can’t do harm to other humans. Whose sense of right or wrong does the collective adhere to? Sally’s or Uncle Frankie? Does the collective accept Frankie’s sense of morality and see no wrong in molesting little kids?

guys is wease ok

Lol

It doesn't work like that wease

Why does it not? If everyone on the planet is sharing memories, how would it NOT work like this?

Damn, Rhea Seehorn is killing it

wease wrote:

tree_ wrote:

Simple Torture wrote:

wease wrote:What about pre-hive crimes? Uncle Frankie has been molesting 7-year-old Sally. Sally never told anyone. But now little Sally’s mom and dad and hell, the whole world knows about it. Not only they, they have the memories and feelings of her being molested by him and his memories and feelings of molesting her. All at once those experiences are shared by the world. Is he now punished? They can’t do harm to other humans. Whose sense of right or wrong does the collective adhere to? Sally’s or Uncle Frankie? Does the collective accept Frankie’s sense of morality and see no wrong in molesting little kids?

guys is wease ok

Lol

It doesn't work like that wease

Why does it not? If everyone on the planet is sharing memories, how would it NOT work like this?

Because it would make everyone dysfunctional and unhappy, which is not the case

tree_ wrote:

wease wrote:

tree_ wrote:

Simple Torture wrote:

wease wrote:What about pre-hive crimes? Uncle Frankie has been molesting 7-year-old Sally. Sally never told anyone. But now little Sally’s mom and dad and hell, the whole world knows about it. Not only they, they have the memories and feelings of her being molested by him and his memories and feelings of molesting her. All at once those experiences are shared by the world. Is he now punished? They can’t do harm to other humans. Whose sense of right or wrong does the collective adhere to? Sally’s or Uncle Frankie? Does the collective accept Frankie’s sense of morality and see no wrong in molesting little kids?

guys is wease ok

Lol

It doesn't work like that wease

Why does it not? If everyone on the planet is sharing memories, how would it NOT work like this?

Because it would make everyone dysfunctional and unhappy, which is not the case

That’s why I mentioned that the infected are being controlled. Why would only the positive memories or helpful skills be what motivates and directs the hive mind?

spike wrote:

tree_ wrote:

wease wrote:

tree_ wrote:

Simple Torture wrote:

wease wrote:What about pre-hive crimes? Uncle Frankie has been molesting 7-year-old Sally. Sally never told anyone. But now little Sally’s mom and dad and hell, the whole world knows about it. Not only they, they have the memories and feelings of her being molested by him and his memories and feelings of molesting her. All at once those experiences are shared by the world. Is he now punished? They can’t do harm to other humans. Whose sense of right or wrong does the collective adhere to? Sally’s or Uncle Frankie? Does the collective accept Frankie’s sense of morality and see no wrong in molesting little kids?

guys is wease ok

Lol

It doesn't work like that wease

Why does it not? If everyone on the planet is sharing memories, how would it NOT work like this?

Because it would make everyone dysfunctional and unhappy, which is not the case

That’s why I mentioned that the infected are being controlled. Why would only the positive memories or helpful skills be what motivates and directs the hive mind?

That could be. Or it's simply motivated by what's best as possible for all.

Biggest drop in quality between episodes 1 and 2 I've seen. Whew. Episode 1 was awesome, episode 2 dipped into The Good Place style silliness. Next ep will determine whether I keep watching

tree_ wrote:

spike wrote:

tree_ wrote:

wease wrote:

tree_ wrote:

Simple Torture wrote:

wease wrote:What about pre-hive crimes? Uncle Frankie has been molesting 7-year-old Sally. Sally never told anyone. But now little Sally’s mom and dad and hell, the whole world knows about it. Not only they, they have the memories and feelings of her being molested by him and his memories and feelings of molesting her. All at once those experiences are shared by the world. Is he now punished? They can’t do harm to other humans. Whose sense of right or wrong does the collective adhere to? Sally’s or Uncle Frankie? Does the collective accept Frankie’s sense of morality and see no wrong in molesting little kids?

guys is wease ok

Lol

It doesn't work like that wease

Why does it not? If everyone on the planet is sharing memories, how would it NOT work like this?

Because it would make everyone dysfunctional and unhappy, which is not the case

That’s why I mentioned that the infected are being controlled. Why would only the positive memories or helpful skills be what motivates and directs the hive mind?

That could be. Or it's simply motivated by what's best as possible for all.

that's entirely hypothetical and outside the actual subjective experience of the people; "what's best as possible for all" is a value judgment of experience, not experience itself

Jorge wrote:Biggest drop in quality between episodes 1 and 2 I've seen. Whew. Episode 1 was awesome, episode 2 dipped into The Good Place style silliness. Next ep will determine whether I keep watching

what I'm hoping is that the dark, weird, silly tonal shifts reflect the colour palette in the end; I like a bit of tonal whiplash as long as the extremes feel balanced, and I don't think two episodes is enough to tell whether they ultimately will be or not; third episode will be very interesting on that front (for what it's worth I found the last one or two seasons of Better Call Saul kind of a slog because the tone felt nothing but dry and procedural and lost some of the silliness)

P.S. Breaking Bad juggles its tones flawlessly imo

and Pluribus feels all over the place in a similar way to The X-Files, and that only made sense when a lot of it had been aired (until it didn't, of course)

Jorge wrote:episode 2 dipped into The Good Place style silliness

C'mon.