Red Mosquito

Django Butterworth wrote:

harmless wrote:I'm just ready to hear PJ talk about it.

Agree 1000% with this!

Now, kiss.

I'm reading some KoL articles ahead of their new album, and while they're not saying much, it's all more interesting and engaging than what PJ are saying. But they are a younger band.

darth_vedder wrote:Is it wrong that I kinda like the piano part in UK?

I like the piano part too. I don't think a guitar solo instead of the piano during the bridge is necessarily going to save it. Mike offers Amongst the Waves a monster solo and it feels out of place on that song. Those are both near greats that fall short because the songs have strong ideas that don't end up feeling dynamic. That's not an instrumental choice. When the piano first kicks in on Unthought Known you really feel like you're listening to something different. something special. PJ hadn't done that before. The piano in the bridge makes the song feel light and airy. These are interesting choices.

Speed of sound is overworked, so that's a mark against him, but on the other hand something like the fixer is textured incredibly well.

And it's probably hard to argue with what he did with just breathe since the song ended up being so successful. Pearl Jam is not a band with a locked in audience for that kind of song, and so clearly this ended up speaking to people. Like Platy said earlier, it's a schmaltzy song, but overall it's a well executed one.


the future days piano sounds pretty weak in the live version, but as Harmless, myself, and others have argued, it is hard to judge how something will work on an album based on a one off live performance--especially for a musical part that seems to be included for atmosphere.

Again, BoB may end up not doing a good job on this record, but with the exception of SoS the songs on backspacer generally sound good, and sound appropriate for the songs and the type of album pearl jam clearly wanted to make. Whatever issues some people have with Backspacer, I doubt BoB owns them. And I suspect that's not the case here.


OBrien is an editor. My understanding is that this is what a producer should do. Good editing will mean shaping a vision: 'add this part here, take this part away, move these things around.' And he apparently plays a lot of instruments and plays them well. Would people feel better if a session musician had come in to play the piano bit (that we haven't heard!) in Future Days instead of BoB.



Yes, the press thing is kinda unusual. Maybe he likes doing it. Maybe, since BoB's press came a month out, he is out doing it to so band interviews that will come out closer to the album launch will feel fresh when they finally happen? Are bands usually giving interviews about an album 6 weeks prior to a record coming out? if so, what do they have left to say that is worth hearing 6 weeks later?

harmless wrote:I'm reading some KoL articles ahead of their new album, and while they're not saying much, it's all more interesting and engaging than what PJ are saying. But they are a younger band.

Largely a different target audience too.

Guys, B'OB isn't doing anything producers don't do on a regular basis. It's just that from an aesthetic standpoint, I don't think he's doing those things very well.

Holy hell, stip. You must be getting more sleep lately.

harmless wrote:I'm reading some KoL articles ahead of their new album, and while they're not saying much, it's all more interesting and engaging than what PJ are saying. But they are a younger band.

To be fair though their album comes out a month earlier. We still may get some insight from the band. Mike gave some insight on the Vancouver interview

All good points and questions, stip.

'Producer' = 'Editor' is a very interesting comparison, but because my brain was locked into "sound engineer", someone who just does the job of fiddling with buttons, I didn't see it that way. So thanks for that. I can say without any hesitation that at my stage in my writing career, I welcome a very hands-on editorial approach, as long as it's truly collaborative. Why an older band would do that? I don't know, but I guess they have their reasons for deferring this power and responsibility to someone else. All writers have editors, at whatever stage they're at.

jdopj wrote:

harmless wrote:I'm reading some KoL articles ahead of their new album, and while they're not saying much, it's all more interesting and engaging than what PJ are saying. But they are a younger band.

To be fair though their album comes out a month earlier. We still may get some insight from the band. Mike gave some insight on the Vancouver interview

True.

Sgt. Crackpot wrote:Holy hell, stip. You must be getting more sleep lately.

Depends on the day I should be prepping for a class in 20 minutes but, you know, I need to talk about when the appropriate time to cruicfy BoB is.

The type of work B'OB does is exactly what you want from a producer, so long as they're making you sound better. Nigel Godrich is practically a member of Rahiohead and no one tells him to slow his roll. Nor should they.

harmless wrote:I'm reading some KoL articles ahead of their new album, and while they're not saying much, it's all more interesting and engaging than what PJ are saying. But they are a younger band.

I think pearl jam have always sucked about talking about their actual music.

cutuphalfdead wrote:Guys, B'OB isn't doing anything producers don't do on a regular basis. It's just that from an aesthetic standpoint, I don't think he's doing those things very well.

hard to argue with that.


What did you think of Mind Your Manners from a production standpoint (maybe not the best showcase song for that question), especially compared to similar tracks on S/T and Backspacer?

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:I'm reading some KoL articles ahead of their new album, and while they're not saying much, it's all more interesting and engaging than what PJ are saying. But they are a younger band.

I think pearl jam have always sucked about talking about their actual music.

that's probably true. I wonder why that is.

I'm most disturbed by the fact that there are no Matt songs on this album, and I wonder how much O'Brien had to do with that.

"Pearl Jam fans don't like Matt's songs, so let's exclude those."

Makes me furious.

Sgt. Crackpot wrote:

harmless wrote:I'm reading some KoL articles ahead of their new album, and while they're not saying much, it's all more interesting and engaging than what PJ are saying. But they are a younger band.

Largely a different target audience too.

Yeah, but I'm not sure it used to be. I'm not sure why PJ's audience needs patronising show-biz talk instead of genuine wit, self-deprecation and honesty. I'm just pretty sure BO'B's language doesn't represent PJ very well, unless their target demographic now really is the same kids watching X-Factor.

McParadigm wrote:Co-writing isn't common outside of the poppiest of pop formats

stip wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:I'm reading some KoL articles ahead of their new album, and while they're not saying much, it's all more interesting and engaging than what PJ are saying. But they are a younger band.

I think pearl jam have always sucked about talking about their actual music.

that's probably true. I wonder why that is.

Because when they were making their best music they were trying to avoid appearing to be greedy by promoting it given their already massive success and now, having never learned, they don't know how to talk about it as their creative spark has dwindled with age?

Wendy Carlos's Twin wrote:I'm most disturbed by the fact that there are no Matt songs on this album, and I wonder how much O'Brien had to do with that.

"Pearl Jam fans don't like Matt's songs, so let's exclude those."

Makes me furious.

I wish there were too. Hopefully all the stuff in the interview mentioning changing time signatures and interesting grooves will make up for this. He might've made the songs more rhythmically interesting as an act of rebellion. We can hope. It does sound like he puts a hint of that in MYM, even where it's not even needed (the intro).

Fact:

I'd rather have BoB play piano on a PJ record than Boom, but I'd rather have any other guy in the band play the piano over BoB.