Red Mosquito

is it 2 hours yet

Wait, did he play for the Marlins too?

@SkitchP wrote:is it 2 hours yet

It's two hours somewhere.

Rick Vaughn-kid had some heat

Lament wrote:The White Sox were his final team I think, right?

01 yes

Skitch is gonna draft Billy Young.

Canseco's '98 was a lesson in old school stats vs. sabermetrics: 46 home runs, 107 RBI, 29 stolen bases... 1.3 WAR.

On a side note, I've always remembered those HR/SB numbers because he was one SB away from being the second Jay in the 30-30 club that year.

philpritchard wrote:Canseco's '98 was a lesson in old school stats vs. sabermetrics: 46 home runs, 107 RBI, 29 stolen bases... 1.3 WAR.

On a side note, I've always remembered those HR/SB numbers because he was one SB away from being the second Jay in the 30-30 club that year.

Wasnt he DHing that year? What led to such a poor WAR? I have yet to fully grasp what WAR entails.

No one fully grasps WAR because it's not even standardized. Fangraphs and Baseball Reference each calculate it differently.

I usually go with BR's because I spend more time at their site, but I'd guess Fangraphs is probably a better representation solely because they handle advanced stats better than BR.

It's helpful to note that Canseco's OBP was .318 in '98.

numbers wrote:

philpritchard wrote:Canseco's '98 was a lesson in old school stats vs. sabermetrics: 46 home runs, 107 RBI, 29 stolen bases... 1.3 WAR.

On a side note, I've always remembered those HR/SB numbers because he was one SB away from being the second Jay in the 30-30 club that year.

Wasnt he DHing that year? What led to such a poor WAR? I have yet to fully grasp what WAR entails.

The big power was somewhat negated by a .318 OBP, leading to a 110 wRC+ (which means his offense was 10% better than the average major leaguer... so not bad, but not all that impressive).

His baserunning was pretty horrible overall (he has a negative baserunning score) and he got caught 17 times while picking up those 29 SB. So that's horrible.

He played about half his games in the outfield with poor defense and half his games at DH, which means his defensive value was awful.

So those 46 home runs were pretty much the only value he provided to the team, and even that's not such a big deal because everyone hit 40 home runs in 1998.

cutuphalfdead wrote:No one fully grasps WAR because it's not even standardized. Fangraphs and Baseball Reference each calculate it differently.

I usually go with BR's because I spend more time at their site, but I'd guess Fangraphs is probably a better representation solely because they handle advanced stats better than BR.

I started off on BR, but I prefer FanGraphs now (at least part of that is because of the amazing articles and research they put out). The two sites actually seem to work together on a lot of stuff and just disagree here and there. The big discrepancies you sometimes see on the two sites are usually based on defence and pitching.

According to the clock on this site, you can pick in 26 minutes, Skitch.

So if you are DHing it affects your WAR negatively? That doesn't seem fair.

Lament wrote:According to the clock on this site, you can pick in 26 minutes, Skitch.

oh, i know. And RM is world renowned for it's consistent time keeping accuracy.

Well you do nothing to affect the defense so...

But you aren't given an opportunity to. It's like holding IP against a reliever.

numbers wrote:So if you are DHing it affects your WAR negatively? That doesn't seem fair.

I think it has more to do with the fact that the Replacement level DH generally has better offensive numbers on average, so as a DH it requires better numbers than say a 2B.

numbers wrote:So if you are DHing it affects your WAR negatively? That doesn't seem fair.

WAR is a cumulative stat, the more good things you do to help your team the more that gets added to it. So if you're a DH it just means that you're never going to get WAR points for defense. It doesn't take away from your WAR, but it doesn't add to it either.

It's similar to relief pitchers. They're going to have a lower WAR than a starter (traditionally) simply because a RP is only going to give you 50-80 innings a year instead of 200.

@SkitchP wrote:

numbers wrote:So if you are DHing it affects your WAR negatively? That doesn't seem fair.

I think it has more to do with the fact that the Replacement level DH generally has better offensive numbers on average, so as a DH it requires better numbers than say a 2B.

Wait, WAR isn't calculated comparative to the average player at your position, it's calculated compared to the average player in general, no?