Red Mosquito

LetMeSleep wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:Yeah, i wasnt even referring to media outlets but casual music fans...They loved Backspacer and LB, and the band gained a lot of fans because of them.

Really? I haven't met one. In fact I would not have had any interaction with a person regarding PJ and their last two albums if I didn't post here. Zero.

Ditto.

BurtReynolds wrote:

LetMeSleep wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:Yeah, i wasnt even referring to media outlets but casual music fans...They loved Backspacer and LB, and the band gained a lot of fans because of them.

Really? I haven't met one. In fact I would not have had any interaction with a person regarding PJ and their last two albums if I didn't post here. Zero.

Ditto.

Same.

LetMeSleep wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:Yeah, i wasnt even referring to media outlets but casual music fans...They loved Backspacer and LB, and the band gained a lot of fans because of them.

Really? I haven't met one. In fact I would not have had any interaction with a person regarding PJ and their last two albums if I didn't post here. Zero.

oh yeah lots of people here in Argentina and south america. Mostly younger audiences.

--- wrote:And really, anytime you say something like "you can't judge art," you make yourself sound like a huge tool. It's that kind of egalitarianism that really defines who has anything worthwhile to say about art and who doesn't, because if you can't separate an Eliot poem from a high school diary, you really shouldn't be talking about poetry at all. Same goes for music, same goes for visual art, same goes for cinematography. The objective elements are what allow the emotion to take body in the work of art. You can't appreciate a good scene in a movie if it isn't shot in an artistic manner, and you can't really feel the emotion in a poem if the poet writes about time going "at a snail's pace."

I like this part of your overall point.

Like, if you can't say that Michael Ballhaus is better than Larry Fong what the hell is the point.

lol

VinylGuy wrote:

LetMeSleep wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:Yeah, i wasnt even referring to media outlets but casual music fans...They loved Backspacer and LB, and the band gained a lot of fans because of them.

Really? I haven't met one. In fact I would not have had any interaction with a person regarding PJ and their last two albums if I didn't post here. Zero.

oh yeah lots of people here in Argentina and south america. Mostly younger audiences.

I've had kinda the same experience as VG. Many casual PJ fans I know really liked the direction they took with BS and LB, specifically stuff like Fixer, Just Breathe, Sirens.

evenslow wrote:

--- wrote:And really, anytime you say something like "you can't judge art," you make yourself sound like a huge tool. It's that kind of egalitarianism that really defines who has anything worthwhile to say about art and who doesn't, because if you can't separate an Eliot poem from a high school diary, you really shouldn't be talking about poetry at all. Same goes for music, same goes for visual art, same goes for cinematography. The objective elements are what allow the emotion to take body in the work of art. You can't appreciate a good scene in a movie if it isn't shot in an artistic manner, and you can't really feel the emotion in a poem if the poet writes about time going "at a snail's pace."

I like this part of your overall point.

Like, if you can't say that Michael Ballhaus is better than Larry Fong what the hell is the point.

FYI



Also, Larry Fong is a really talented DP, pick a better example

LetMeSleep wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:Yeah, i wasnt even referring to media outlets but casual music fans...They loved Backspacer and LB, and the band gained a lot of fans because of them.

Really? I haven't met one. In fact I would not have had any interaction with a person regarding PJ and their last two albums if I didn't post here. Zero.

Yeah, same.

People are far more excited about pearl jam these days than they were between most years between 96-2004. And by people i mean those that didnt give a shit about them around vitalogy through riot act. Part of that is the promotional shit they have done over the years and their reputation as a live band (which contrary to crabby people on RM, are a great live band and put on a great show)

The general masses, i believe, rather hear ten-vitalogy and backfacer and LB

I also disagree that the advent of the Internet inherently means that PJ fans here are not giving their latter records the amount of time needed to make an honest appraisal. I'd understand the idea that the availability of music makes music that doesn't necessarily grab you a bit more ephemeral, but this is a Pearl Jam message board.

I would bet most people here think this band has responsible for some of their favorite music ever. That doesn't really sound like people who are going to give PJ a cursory listen and quickly move on. I would bet most of the posters (including myself) in stip's quote storm a few pages back gave Backspacer and Lightning Bolt far more time and consideration than the reviewers stip is citing as a source of these record's objective high quality.

Strat wrote:People are far more excited about pearl jam these days than they were between most years between 96-2004. And by people i mean those that didnt give a shit about them around vitalogy through riot act. Part of that is the promotional shit they have done over the years and their reputation as a live band (which contrary to crabby people on RM, are a great live band and put on a great show)

The general masses, i believe, rather hear ten-vitalogy and backfacer and LB

I think the "general masses" know Pearl Jam made Ten and remember some singles, and that's about it as far as their records go.

And I'm not saying that as a knock against Lightning Bolt. Most albums 20 years into a band's career aren't really remembered as being a central part of a band's lexicon, regardless of their quality.

digster wrote:

Strat wrote:People are far more excited about pearl jam these days than they were between most years between 96-2004. And by people i mean those that didnt give a shit about them around vitalogy through riot act. Part of that is the promotional shit they have done over the years and their reputation as a live band (which contrary to crabby people on RM, are a great live band and put on a great show)

The general masses, i believe, rather hear ten-vitalogy and backfacer and LB

I think the "general masses" know Pearl Jam made Ten and remember some singles, and that's about it as far as their records go.

And I'm not saying that as a knock against Lightning Bolt. Most albums 20 years into a band's career aren't really remembered as being a central part of a band's lexicon, regardless of their quality.

I'd say a good portion of people know songs more than albums. Just Breathe has become among their most played songs at classic rock radio.

I'd agree that a number of variables (including, but not primarily, better received late era albums) have shifted them from "band that fell apart after a good start" to "classic band" among a lot of people.

I see that stip quoted me on Inside Job.

Lol. I have listened to that song hundreds of times. That was at the peak of my fandom. I gave that song a chance. I put the effort in and i still came out thinking it was awful.

McParadigm wrote:

digster wrote:

Strat wrote:People are far more excited about pearl jam these days than they were between most years between 96-2004. And by people i mean those that didnt give a shit about them around vitalogy through riot act. Part of that is the promotional shit they have done over the years and their reputation as a live band (which contrary to crabby people on RM, are a great live band and put on a great show)

The general masses, i believe, rather hear ten-vitalogy and backfacer and LB

I think the "general masses" know Pearl Jam made Ten and remember some singles, and that's about it as far as their records go.

And I'm not saying that as a knock against Lightning Bolt. Most albums 20 years into a band's career aren't really remembered as being a central part of a band's lexicon, regardless of their quality.

I'd say a good portion of people know songs more than albums. Just Breathe has become among their most played songs at classic rock radio.

I'd agree that a number of variables (including, but not primarily, better received late era albums) have shifted them from "band that fell apart after a good start" to "classic band" among a lot of people.

Ive been to numerous modern day pj concerts. People sing their hearts out to a lot of the new material. Just Breathe was one of the biggest sing a longs ive heard at a pj show.

evenslow wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

LetMeSleep wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:Yeah, i wasnt even referring to media outlets but casual music fans...They loved Backspacer and LB, and the band gained a lot of fans because of them.

Really? I haven't met one. In fact I would not have had any interaction with a person regarding PJ and their last two albums if I didn't post here. Zero.

oh yeah lots of people here in Argentina and south america. Mostly younger audiences.

I've had kinda the same experience as VG. Many casual PJ fans I know really liked the direction they took with BS and LB, specifically stuff like Fixer, Just Breathe, Sirens.

Yeah, Just Breathe was huge here. Lots of fucking tattoos, really. The same with The Fixer.

Strat wrote:I see that stip quoted me on Inside Job.

Lol. I have listened to that song hundreds of times. That was at the peak of my fandom. I gave that song a chance. I put the effort in and i still came out thinking it was awful.

See, that's so you though. Trying to kill love all the time. The highest sin.

digster wrote:I also disagree that the advent of the Internet inherently means that PJ fans here are not giving their latter records the amount of time needed to make an honest appraisal.

I really don't think this is what I said. All I'm saying is that, with more and more choices, people have less and less reason to go back to records they've already honestly appraised in the negative, thus prompting a reappraisal. LV said in one of the MM threads that he didn't even know what some of the Backspacer songs sounded like. After 10 years of disappointing records, I don't think this being a PJ message board necessarily means people are listening to these new albums with the same commitment they may once have.

Musically speaking there is nothing to really sink your teeth into with new PJ. Up until Riot Act there was always something uniquely pearl jam about the instrumentation and guitar parts. Its not there anymore.

VinylGuy wrote:

evenslow wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

LetMeSleep wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:Yeah, i wasnt even referring to media outlets but casual music fans...They loved Backspacer and LB, and the band gained a lot of fans because of them.

Really? I haven't met one. In fact I would not have had any interaction with a person regarding PJ and their last two albums if I didn't post here. Zero.

oh yeah lots of people here in Argentina and south america. Mostly younger audiences.

I've had kinda the same experience as VG. Many casual PJ fans I know really liked the direction they took with BS and LB, specifically stuff like Fixer, Just Breathe, Sirens.

Yeah, Just Breathe was huge here. Lots of fucking tattoos, really. The same with The Fixer.

Sure, I don't doubt their singles have taken off in a way those middle records haven't; they're kind of designed that way. I was more talking about the albums making their way into the public concisiousness, which I just have not seen happen. People may cheer at The Fixer, but I don't really see them going bananas for Amongst the Waves or Infalliable in the way they might for Porch or Indifference.

digster wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

evenslow wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

LetMeSleep wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:Yeah, i wasnt even referring to media outlets but casual music fans...They loved Backspacer and LB, and the band gained a lot of fans because of them.

Really? I haven't met one. In fact I would not have had any interaction with a person regarding PJ and their last two albums if I didn't post here. Zero.

oh yeah lots of people here in Argentina and south america. Mostly younger audiences.

I've had kinda the same experience as VG. Many casual PJ fans I know really liked the direction they took with BS and LB, specifically stuff like Fixer, Just Breathe, Sirens.

Yeah, Just Breathe was huge here. Lots of fucking tattoos, really. The same with The Fixer.

Sure, I don't doubt their singles have taken off in a way those middle records haven't; they're kind of designed that way. I was more talking about the albums making their way into the public concisiousness, which I just have not seen happen. People may cheer at The Fixer, but I don't really see them going bananas for Amongst the Waves or Infalliable in the way they might for Porch or Indifference.

Of course not but people dont give a shit about albums no matter who the band/artist is. Not these days.