Batman V: Superman Dawn of Justice

[stip]

[bada]

Anyone else getting the feeling that all of McP's and Stips's opinions on the DC universe are based on watching a couple Superfriends episode 30 years ago?

[epilogue]

I agree with Stip that Superman's invincability is boring. But only in the context of the "grounded" and "realistic" Superverse that Singer and (especially) Nolan have created. There's a demand now for making these characters as real and "human" as possible. Superman is much more fascinating when he's dealing with threats that are real to him, not to just to Earth. Whatever one thinks of the Avengers films, my hope is that they'll open the gate for some more fantastical storytelling. Looks like X-Men is headed that way and I hope it pays off. Superman needs real Super-Threats.

Anyway, I didn't see Man of Steel. Not yet. But I do think that a lot of times the limited way in which these heroes have been put on screen has the strongest impact on how they are viewed/remembered. Superman is a better character than his movies have shown. He hasn't endured and thrived through decades of books for nothing.

[stip]

One of the strengths of the avengers universe is that it embraces those fantastical elements and doesn't try and turn them into character studies.

[epilogue]

One of the strengths of the avengers universe is that it embraces those fantastical elements and doesn't try and turn them into character studies.

Exactly. And if DC is going to be successful with it's characters who aren't named Batman, it's going to have to embrace the same thing. I'm glad The Avengers did as well as it did if for no other reason that it proves you don't need dark, brooding heroes.

The characters are interesting. But make them live up to themselves. Give them worthy challenges and obstacles and tell compelling stories.

[VinylGuy]

Anyone else getting the feeling that all of McP's and Stips's opinions on the DC universe are based on watching a couple Superfriends episode 30 years ago?

they hatred towards the dc universe is weird.

[BurtReynolds]

No one probably cares, but I thought the Arkham games created an amazing mix of the serious and dark Nolan Batman and the more fantastic elements from the comics and other sources. It can be done, but that universe is almost a horror one.

I know Warner bros.is attempting to apply that to the entire DC universe, but I don't know how successful that will be. I do think the DC universe feels much darker than Marvel in many of the comics, in many cases to its detriment. But don't let the Superfriends fool you, DC gets kinda fucked up sometimes.

[VinylGuy]

No one probably cares, but I thought the Arkham games created an amazing mix of the serious and dark Nolan Batman and the more fantastic elements from the comics and other sources. It can be done, but that universe is almost a horror one.

I know Warner bros.is attempting to apply that to the entire DC universe, but I don't know how successful that will be. I do think the DC universe feels much darker than Marvel in many of the comics, in many cases to its detriment. But don't let the Superfriends fool you, DC gets kinda fucked up sometimes.

Those Batman games are awesome. The use of the characters is great and its true they mix the dark stuff with the elements of the comics just fine.

[McParadigm]

I don't do video games, but my friend really liked the feel of those. From what he described, I can dig it.

[bada]

The reason the Marvel run movies work is they are put together by fans of the source material. Fox and WB have historically been run by people who don't get, don't like or outright hate superheroes. You can't embrace the fantastical elements if you think those elements are stupid. The hope is the money made by the Marvel run films will convince the studios to hand over the reigns to people who get the material and those people have the juice to keep the suits influence to a minimum. DC is inherently darker, weirder and more fantastical that Marvel so they have to embrace that or it won't work. Burt is right the Arkham games are the perfect middle point between sorta realism and full on comic craziness. They should be the template.

[MadTIGERmaN]

The reason the Marvel run movies work is they are put together by fans of the source material. Fox and WB have historically been run by people who don't get, don't like or outright hate superheroes. You can't embrace the fantastical elements if you think those elements are stupid. The hope is the money made by the Marvel run films will convince the studios to hand over the reigns to people who get the material and those people have the juice to keep the suits influence to a minimum. DC is inherently darker, weirder and more fantastical that Marvel so they have to embrace that or it won't work. Burt is right the Arkham games are the perfect middle point between sorta realism and full on comic craziness. They should be the template.

I honestly think Fox (especially Singer) wishes they could go back to X-1 and really plot out the story line. From all the interviews / bonus disc stuff, it always sounded to me like they were making X-1, if it did okay at the box office, maybe a second. the Marvel movies has really changed the game. Singer and one of the producers always wanted to do an Apocalypse story they just never thought theyd be able to make enough X-movies to set it up... till 2016

the main problem I have with the DC movies, is they just seem to be about destruction. Man of Steel's ending got to a point where half the city is destroyed, and thousands have to be dead, all 3 Nolan Bats movies had way to much destruction, its almost like they are setting up for a super hero civil war / registration act? (wait that was Marvel lol) The X-movies really handled the mass destruction well. Out side of the Statue of Liberty and the Golden Gate Bridge? and a few small buildings (train station / Jeans parents house / Icemans parents neighborhood) nothing got destroyed. (Mangold even stated its part of what drew him to the Wolverine story, is he didnt have to destroy a city, outside of the atom bomb at the opening) and Thor 2 really nailed did that well.

[Leatherhead]

I read the first few posts of the first page of this thread, and then the last page. I just wanted to say that Ben Affleck was probably the best part of "Daredevil." The problem I have with that movie mostly rests on the emphasis placed on the relationship between Daredevil and Elektra. Also, if you watch the Director's Cut of "Daredevil," it is a much better movie. I think Ben Affleck will do pretty good, if not great, as Batman.

[bune]

Imagine the shit storm if I went into the Tom Waits thread and said he sucked and followed up that statement with I never listened to one of his songs.

what about saying he sucked because you listened to one of his songs?

[bada]

Imagine the shit storm if I went into the Tom Waits thread and said he sucked and followed up that statement with I never listened to one of his songs.

what about saying he sucked because you listened to one of his songs?

500 posts saying "but what about this, what about this one....you have to listen to 5 albums before you get it......listen to this song in your car in the snow while driving 25 mph" and stuff like that with loads of YouTube windows. I suppose I could list a ton of great stories with "lame" characters but I've never been into trying to convince someone to like something.

[stip]

Tom Waits is an acquired and or/idiosyncratic taste and I totally get not liking him. I used to read comic books, I see most of the comic book movies, and I am a fan of the genre as a whole. I think Nolan's Batman trilogy is spectacular, I quite enjoyed watchman, I loved the avengers and Iron Man I, and thought iron man 3, captain America, and thor were all good. I'm certainly not resistant to what is being sold.

[red calzolaio]

Also, if you watch the Director's Cut of "Daredevil," it is a much better movie.

i have always heard this.

i liked Daredevil. dare i say, i liked it much more than Spiderman. i bring Spidey up because these movies came out at relatively the same time.

guess i need to go buy Daredevil director's cut on amazon! Wahooooo!

[lowlight79]

Also, if you watch the Director's Cut of "Daredevil," it is a much better movie.

i have always heard this.

i liked Daredevil. dare i say, i liked it much more than Spiderman. i bring Spidey up because these movies came out at relatively the same time.

guess i need to go buy Daredevil director's cut on amazon! Wahooooo!

I never thought, untill I saw this, how a character played the Coolio really put the whole movie together.

[bada]

Tom Waits is an acquired and or/idiosyncratic taste and I totally get not liking him. I used to read comic books, I see most of the comic book movies, and I am a fan of the genre as a whole. I think Nolan's Batman trilogy is spectacular, I quite enjoyed watchman, I loved the avengers and Iron Man I, and thought iron man 3, captain America, and thor were all good. I'm certainly not resistant to what is being sold.

Stip you said DC characters are lame that kind of effrontery will not be tolerated!

[BurtReynolds]

Tom Waits is an acquired and or/idiosyncratic taste and I totally get not liking him. I used to read comic books, I see most of the comic book movies, and I am a fan of the genre as a whole. I think Nolan's Batman trilogy is spectacular, I quite enjoyed watchman, I loved the avengers and Iron Man I, and thought iron man 3, captain America, and thor were all good. I'm certainly not resistant to what is being sold.

Stip you said DC characters are lame that kind of effrontery will not be tolerated!

i thought that was a dig at McP, not Stippleman.

[McParadigm]

I've never listened to Wonder Woman's music. It's true.