Red Mosquito

Impeachment needs to stop being thought of in tactical terms and start being thought of in ethical terms. Do it because it's the right thing to do, that's it.

cutuphalfdead wrote:Impeachment needs to stop being thought of in tactical terms and start being thought of in ethical terms. Do it because it's the right thing to do, that's it.

But does a moral victory really fucking matter at all? Does it accomplish anything?

durdencommatyler wrote:

cutuphalfdead wrote:Impeachment needs to stop being thought of in tactical terms and start being thought of in ethical terms. Do it because it's the right thing to do, that's it.

But does a moral victory really fucking matter at all? Does it accomplish anything?

I think it would be a huge boost for him and he’d use it tactically.
But you’d want the Dems to be seen to do fuckin something at this stage. And as Strat said their inaction and letting him off unchallenged will be noticed by undecideds

dimejinky99 wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

cutuphalfdead wrote:Impeachment needs to stop being thought of in tactical terms and start being thought of in ethical terms. Do it because it's the right thing to do, that's it.

But does a moral victory really fucking matter at all? Does it accomplish anything?

I think it would be a huge boost for him and he’d use it tactically.
But you’d want the Dems to be seen to do fuckin something at this stage. And as Strat said their inaction and letting him off unchallenged will be noticed by undecideds

The thing is, these are all reasonable viewpoints. Now
Imagine you’re Nancy Pelosi. I think she’s doing a fine job, all things considered.

cutuphalfdead wrote: Do it because it's the right thing to do, that's it.

durdencommatyler wrote:

cutuphalfdead wrote:Impeachment needs to stop being thought of in tactical terms and start being thought of in ethical terms. Do it because it's the right thing to do, that's it.

But does a moral victory really fucking matter at all? Does it accomplish anything?

I'd certainly be inspired by a party that simply did the right thing.

cutuphalfdead wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

cutuphalfdead wrote:Impeachment needs to stop being thought of in tactical terms and start being thought of in ethical terms. Do it because it's the right thing to do, that's it.

But does a moral victory really fucking matter at all? Does it accomplish anything?

I'd certainly be inspired by a party that simply did the right thing.

I think there was a moment when the opening of impeachment hearings might have played well. Polling showed that the public didn't believe Barr was being honest and overwhelmingly believed that Donald Trump had committed crimes, but also hadn't read or just didn't understand the scope of the report. In that moment, the declaration would have sent the national discussion into "what does this mean and what happens next." Instead, by stumbling about and refusing even to follow up on ignored subpoenas, the Democrats left a vacuum into which the traditional "Dems in disarray" media nail biting became the primary message. The only thing they had to talk about was that impeachment was unpopular, which is essentially meaningless in the initial event but becomes/became more engrained the more they make it THE story.

At this point, after multiple rounds of "THIS will be the thing that makes it poll well" that ended unremarkably, opening impeachment would look to a lot of people like sour grapes. Unless something else shocks the public into a level of upset that mirrors Trump's worst numbers, the chance to do the right thing (and it was the right thing) without suffering a bit of a messaging loss has itself probably been lost.

I'm assuming it won't happen, and that (barring a truly terrible debate performance) Joe Biden is likely to be the nominee. Really not looking forward to listening to those two dipshits talk about their dicks and answer simple questions in the dumbest way possible for the better part of a year. Hopefully Warren or Harris is the VP.

i think you're right

i just really, really hope Warren is the nominee.

They have one more decent move: go after his kids and hope he goes so off the rails he makes the independents into never trumpers

cutuphalfdead wrote:i just really, really hope Warren is the nominee.

She would never beat Trump. Her best bet is as VP candidate behind Biden.

Joe Biden will never ever beat trump. Can we wake up to that and find a more suitable candidate please?

dimejinky99 wrote:Joe Biden will never ever beat trump. Can we wake up to that and find a more suitable candidate please?

"Donald Trump will never ever beat anyone." -most of us, 2015

Simple Torture wrote:

dimejinky99 wrote:Joe Biden will never ever beat trump. Can we wake up to that and find a more suitable candidate please?

"Donald Trump will never ever beat anyone." -most of us, 2015

His point still stands. None of the Democrats have really set themselves apart. A giant group of stiffs.

wease wrote:

cutuphalfdead wrote:i just really, really hope Warren is the nominee.

She would never beat Trump. Her best bet is as VP candidate behind Biden.

I don’t agree with this at all, but it doesn’t matter because the decision has essentially been made. Any potential for a significant change in fortune was undercut by those absurd debate rules.

at what point do people he attacks start addressing him as accused child rapist?

Nothing says “I’m definitely not a racist” quite like deciding the best way to attack Al Sharpton is to say that he “hates whites.”

McParadigm wrote:

wease wrote:

cutuphalfdead wrote:i just really, really hope Warren is the nominee.

She would never beat Trump. Her best bet is as VP candidate behind Biden.

I don’t agree with this at all, but it doesn’t matter because the decision has essentially been made. Any potential for a significant change in fortune was undercut by those absurd debate rules.

I am very scared of what Warren would do the economic future of the US and question her embrace of identity politics, but she is a highly intelligent and functioning adult with excellent credentials and understanding of how government. She's a far superior choice to four more years of Trump and I agree with McP here that if she were on a debate stage with Trump it would be a massacre. I disagree that Biden is locked in at this point, but he's certainly the front runner.

I'd say the top ten Democrats would all do fine against Trump. He's less coherent than he was in 2016, and none of them have the built in unpopularity that Hillary had. Some of this undecideds that broke for him HAVE to be regretting that decision.

Still liking Harris here.