Red Mosquito

stip wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:I guess I'm having trouble seeing what quality has to do with perspective in regards to this discussion.

i dont' see MYM as an internalized song the way that you (and harmless?) seem to. I find it to be quite similar to a song like whipping or bushleaguer. That's why if you feel that mYM is a direction you want to see them move in that it may just be a question of better execution of a similar song.

I could be misunderstanding you, though. Does that make sense?

I'm not sure that MYM is a direction I want to see them move into. I love the song and I'm glad they wrote it. But I'm not even sure if I'm convinced it's a better song.

durdencommatyler wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

harmless wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:I guess I'm having trouble seeing what quality has to do with perspective in regards to this discussion.

It doesn't, really, I'm just defending those songs.

All three songs are of Ed critiquing someone or something that he seems to personally disagree with. I'm really not following the differentiation.

I guess because, to me, there is an effort, a search going on in MYM. He isn't just railing against something. Sure, that's there, that's a big part of it. But there's an exploration, a movement toward understanding in the song that isn't there in songs that I'm calling more "external" like Whipping and Bushleaguer. His mind is made up in those songs and he's acting in accordance.

ahh, okay. i see that

stip wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

harmless wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:I guess I'm having trouble seeing what quality has to do with perspective in regards to this discussion.

It doesn't, really, I'm just defending those songs.

All three songs are of Ed critiquing someone or something that he seems to personally disagree with. I'm really not following the differentiation.

I guess because, to me, there is an effort, a search going on in MYM. He isn't just railing against something. Sure, that's there, that's a big part of it. But there's an exploration, a movement toward understanding in the song that isn't there in songs that I'm calling more "external" like Whipping and Bushleaguer. His mind is made up in those songs and he's acting in accordance.

ahh, okay. i see that

It's definitely and agnostic approach happening in MYM. I think he is strongly committed to attacking organized religion and the conflict within it while leaving the door open to faith.

I see your point now .

stip wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

harmless wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:I guess I'm having trouble seeing what quality has to do with perspective in regards to this discussion.

It doesn't, really, I'm just defending those songs.

All three songs are of Ed critiquing someone or something that he seems to personally disagree with. I'm really not following the differentiation.

I guess because, to me, there is an effort, a search going on in MYM. He isn't just railing against something. Sure, that's there, that's a big part of it. But there's an exploration, a movement toward understanding in the song that isn't there in songs that I'm calling more "external" like Whipping and Bushleaguer. His mind is made up in those songs and he's acting in accordance.

ahh, okay. i see that

But I also see calling MYM external. I just think it's MORE internal. Perhaps its a borderline song, a 'tweener. But coupled with what I remember of LB and FD, I think it leans more toward internal, which is why I'm predicting an internal outing with album #10.

But, I admit, I've only listened to those other two (LB & FD) once each.

Thejambi wrote:

stip wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

harmless wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:I guess I'm having trouble seeing what quality has to do with perspective in regards to this discussion.

It doesn't, really, I'm just defending those songs.

All three songs are of Ed critiquing someone or something that he seems to personally disagree with. I'm really not following the differentiation.

I guess because, to me, there is an effort, a search going on in MYM. He isn't just railing against something. Sure, that's there, that's a big part of it. But there's an exploration, a movement toward understanding in the song that isn't there in songs that I'm calling more "external" like Whipping and Bushleaguer. His mind is made up in those songs and he's acting in accordance.

ahh, okay. i see that

It's definitely and agnostic approach happening in MYM. I think he is strongly committed to attacking organized religion and the conflict within it while leaving the door open to faith.

I see your point now .

they sound like live songs since we have live recordings. I don't think you can read much into them for better or worse until the studio

stip wrote:they sound like live songs since we have live recordings. I don't think you can read much into them for better or worse until the studio

Agreed.

So, no new songs?

stip wrote:they sound like live songs since we have live recordings. I don't think you can read much into them for better or worse until the studio

I still maintain that, with this band especially, if you don't like the song live you aren't going to like the studio version either.

i prefer the vast majority of their songs in the studio. some of my favorite studio songs I dont really care to hear live at all.

stip wrote:i prefer the vast majority of their songs in the studio. some of my favorite studio songs I dont really care to hear live at all.

Such as?

verb_to_trust wrote:

stip wrote:i prefer the vast majority of their songs in the studio. some of my favorite studio songs I dont really care to hear live at all.

Such as?

All of them, in my case. This view that if you've heard live PJ, you've heard PJ at their best, is really starting to piss me off.

verb_to_trust wrote:

stip wrote:i prefer the vast majority of their songs in the studio. some of my favorite studio songs I dont really care to hear live at all.

Such as?

Rearview mirror, I am Mine, Insignificance

I'm assuming most people are hearing why live RVM is not a patch on the original, yes? Verb_to_trust, even you have to concede that one, right?

1/2 full is maybe the only PJ song I can definitely say I prefer to hear live.

stip wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:

stip wrote:i prefer the vast majority of their songs in the studio. some of my favorite studio songs I dont really care to hear live at all.

Such as?

Rearview mirror, I am Mine, Insignificance

In My Tree, Immortality, Got Some, Jeremy, Hail, Hail, Lukin, Light Years, Breakerfall

stip wrote:1/2 full is maybe the only PJ song I can definitely say I prefer to hear live.

With the obvious exception of I Am Mine, I think Riot Act works really well live. TMW (though a set killer) usually sounds great. You Are, Help Help, Can't Keep, Save You and Love Boat Captain are almost always strong live numbers. And when they get played, Cropduster and Ghost sound great too.

I'm not saying the songs are usually bad live. Just not as good as the studio version. The value added from pearl jam live is being there live, and the energy in the room. Grainy bootlegs tend to not capture that

I'd prefer any song live because it would mean I would be at a Pearl Jam concert rather than wearing headphones on the way to work.

stip wrote:I'm not saying the songs are usually bad live. Just not as good as the studio version. The value added from pearl jam live is being there live, and the energy in the room. Grainy bootlegs tend to not capture that

I assume some people mean that when they like something live they like it live not a recording of them playing live? I do like listening to bootlegs but you're not going to beat the quality of a studio recording. I'm not sure of any songs (excluding Backspacer which I don't listen to) where I'd rush to a live version over the studio. Probably only Yellow Ledbetter from the Daughter single, an early Even Flow and the Monkey Wrench DTE. Man of the Hour and Fatal from Benaroya are possibilities.