Red Mosquito

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:Imagine if it had a comfortably numb-esque solo.

Yup. I'd rather not.

I love that solo! Best part of the song. I might prefer sirens if mike totally went off. Maybe.

No, Mike gets plenty of(too much) room. What truly horrible lead work in Sirens.

Thejambi wrote:

Dr. Van Nostrand wrote:

Juvenal wrote:ARE YOU FUCKS STILL TALKING ABOUT PINK FUCKIN FLOYD!?!? JESUS FUCKING WEPT!

what else is there to talk about right now?

Can Jesus cry in heaven?

ill get back to you on that

Oh, Jimmy wrote:

BurtReynolds wrote:I really need to watch Some Kind of Monster again. I can't believe they released that to the public. They come off as such douchebags (except for poor Kirk).

And he came off as whiny bitch, which is just about as bad.

a little, yeah. i guess it was just nice to see someone who still just wanted to rock out. He seemed pretty embarrassed about the whole thing.

harmless wrote:

BurtReynolds wrote:In my opinion they do seem to lean on their influences more these days, and it shows. Some songs feel like pastiches. They haven't made them their own. So in many cases, no, it doesn't sound like Pearl Jam to me.

They spend so little time together, I guess they've forgotten what "their own" sounds like.

Just a theory, but I think it has alot to do with Stone's diminishing role/interest in the band and the fact that McCready's cheesedick songwriting is getting pushed to the fore.

Oh, Jimmy wrote:

harmless wrote:

BurtReynolds wrote:In my opinion they do seem to lean on their influences more these days, and it shows. Some songs feel like pastiches. They haven't made them their own. So in many cases, no, it doesn't sound like Pearl Jam to me.

They spend so little time together, I guess they've forgotten what "their own" sounds like.

Just a theory, but I think it has alot to do with Stone's diminishing role/interest in the band and the fact that McCready's cheesedick songwriting is getting pushed to the fore.

Maybe so.

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:Imagine if it had a comfortably numb-esque solo.

Yup. I'd rather not.

I love that solo! Best part of the song. I might prefer sirens if mike totally went off. Maybe.
The one at the end I mean.

That surprises me. You don't like the love ballad aspect of it but you want to increase the bit where it sounds most like a love ballad?

harmless wrote:That's a really well-considered post which interpreted correctly then addressed what I was saying. Thanks. Whether you think the "sonic experimentation" and instrumental palette of Pink Floyd was excessive (and I do, sometimes), it's undoubtedly true that it was all appropriate to what they were going for lyrically and thematically.

Have you ever heard "The Final Cut," Mark? It's a great example of Pink Floyd's inclination for tinkering around in the studio working to achieve an effect of minimalism rather than theatrical grandiosity, and even though it's held in pretty low esteem by some I think it's very possibly their strongest songwriting on record. If you've been put off by the "bigness" of their sound in the past this would be a great record to check out.

I wouldnt be upset if mike ripped off maggot brain, go on mike we all know you can pull it off.

Oh, Jimmy wrote:

harmless wrote:

BurtReynolds wrote:In my opinion they do seem to lean on their influences more these days, and it shows. Some songs feel like pastiches. They haven't made them their own. So in many cases, no, it doesn't sound like Pearl Jam to me.

They spend so little time together, I guess they've forgotten what "their own" sounds like.

Just a theory, but I think it has alot to do with Stone's diminishing role/interest in the band and the fact that McCready's cheesedick songwriting is getting pushed to the fore.

You know, theres an old interview somewhere where mike says he used to be too afraid of eddie to show him anything he wrote, maybe eddies still making up for that.

Anyway the answer to this is Jeff if only the rest of the album would leak and we could know whether this is true.

Oh, Jimmy wrote:

harmless wrote:

BurtReynolds wrote:In my opinion they do seem to lean on their influences more these days, and it shows. Some songs feel like pastiches. They haven't made them their own. So in many cases, no, it doesn't sound like Pearl Jam to me.

They spend so little time together, I guess they've forgotten what "their own" sounds like.

Just a theory, but I think it has alot to do with Stone's diminishing role/interest in the band and the fact that McCready's cheesedick songwriting is getting pushed to the fore.

We have no idea that Stone has a diminished role/interest in the band. In fact, he seems happy as a pig in shit while playing songs from the last two records.

Kevin Davis wrote:

harmless wrote:That's a really well-considered post which interpreted correctly then addressed what I was saying. Thanks. Whether you think the "sonic experimentation" and instrumental palette of Pink Floyd was excessive (and I do, sometimes), it's undoubtedly true that it was all appropriate to what they were going for lyrically and thematically.

Have you ever heard "The Final Cut," Mark? It's a great example of Pink Floyd's inclination for tinkering around in the studio working to achieve an effect of minimalism rather than theatrical grandiosity, and even though it's held in pretty low esteem by some I think it's very possibly their strongest songwriting on record. If you've been put off by the "bigness" of their sound in the past this would be a great record to check out.

Sounds cool, I will do.

stupidmop wrote:I wouldnt be upset if mike ripped off maggot brain, go on mike we all know you can pull it off.

Oh, Jimmy wrote:

harmless wrote:

BurtReynolds wrote:In my opinion they do seem to lean on their influences more these days, and it shows. Some songs feel like pastiches. They haven't made them their own. So in many cases, no, it doesn't sound like Pearl Jam to me.

They spend so little time together, I guess they've forgotten what "their own" sounds like.

Just a theory, but I think it has alot to do with Stone's diminishing role/interest in the band and the fact that McCready's cheesedick songwriting is getting pushed to the fore.

You know, theres an old interview somewhere where mike says he used to be too afraid of eddie to show him anything he wrote, maybe eddies still making up for that.

Anyway the answer to this is Jeff if only the rest of the album would leak and we could know whether this is true.

Fuck yes. If this thing would leak and we could find out whether these Jeff tunes kicked our collective ass, things might change. Basically I want some of my perceptions changed and having all of these songs together will do that if these Jeff songs are as good as they could be.

Would someone care to elaborate how Stone influenced "their own" sound and what is identified as their own sound? Just curious.

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:I wouldnt be upset if mike ripped off maggot brain, go on mike we all know you can pull it off.

Oh, Jimmy wrote:

harmless wrote:

BurtReynolds wrote:In my opinion they do seem to lean on their influences more these days, and it shows. Some songs feel like pastiches. They haven't made them their own. So in many cases, no, it doesn't sound like Pearl Jam to me.

They spend so little time together, I guess they've forgotten what "their own" sounds like.

Just a theory, but I think it has alot to do with Stone's diminishing role/interest in the band and the fact that McCready's cheesedick songwriting is getting pushed to the fore.

You know, theres an old interview somewhere where mike says he used to be too afraid of eddie to show him anything he wrote, maybe eddies still making up for that.

Anyway the answer to this is Jeff if only the rest of the album would leak and we could know whether this is true.

Fuck yes. If this thing would leak and we could find out whether these Jeff tunes kicked our collective ass, things might change. Basically I want some of my perceptions changed and having all of these songs together will do that if these Jeff songs are as good as they could be.

Generally i find Jeff's songs or songs he has co-written more interesting than Stone's.

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:Imagine if it had a comfortably numb-esque solo.

Yup. I'd rather not.

I love that solo! Best part of the song. I might prefer sirens if mike totally went off. Maybe.
The one at the end I mean.

That surprises me. You don't like the love ballad aspect of it but you want to increase the bit where it sounds most like a love ballad?

I dunno. Its the cheeseball radio friendly aspect that I have a problem with more than the love ballad aspect. The bit that makes it sound most like a love ballad to me is "want you to knnoooooowww I always loved yoooouuuuuuu" and that fucking piano. Im a sucker for a solo that speaks to your souuulll, for what its worth I think the only time mike has achieved this is the aforementioned maggot brain cover.

Also, theres a high probability that haf this happened I would have been complaining that "everything other than the solo sucks ugh what a waste"

Mine wrote:

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:I wouldnt be upset if mike ripped off maggot brain, go on mike we all know you can pull it off.

Oh, Jimmy wrote:

harmless wrote:

BurtReynolds wrote:In my opinion they do seem to lean on their influences more these days, and it shows. Some songs feel like pastiches. They haven't made them their own. So in many cases, no, it doesn't sound like Pearl Jam to me.

They spend so little time together, I guess they've forgotten what "their own" sounds like.

Just a theory, but I think it has alot to do with Stone's diminishing role/interest in the band and the fact that McCready's cheesedick songwriting is getting pushed to the fore.

You know, theres an old interview somewhere where mike says he used to be too afraid of eddie to show him anything he wrote, maybe eddies still making up for that.

Anyway the answer to this is Jeff if only the rest of the album would leak and we could know whether this is true.

Fuck yes. If this thing would leak and we could find out whether these Jeff tunes kicked our collective ass, things might change. Basically I want some of my perceptions changed and having all of these songs together will do that if these Jeff songs are as good as they could be.

Generally i find Jeff's songs or songs he has co-written more interesting than Stone's.

I'd probably agree with this. Lowlight was Jeff, right? That's a good hippy tree-hugger.

I guess what I'm wanting is for Jeff's songs, however good they are, to have lyrics which are pertinent with the artwork. I'm very quickly realising that some of this artwork takes liberties with what these songs are actually about. And that's fine, it's all about interpretation, but if we have to spend too long interpreting the artwork for *every* song, it's going to sound like a gimmick, a cheap trick (no pun intended).

harmless wrote:

Kevin Davis wrote:

harmless wrote:That's a really well-considered post which interpreted correctly then addressed what I was saying. Thanks. Whether you think the "sonic experimentation" and instrumental palette of Pink Floyd was excessive (and I do, sometimes), it's undoubtedly true that it was all appropriate to what they were going for lyrically and thematically.

Have you ever heard "The Final Cut," Mark? It's a great example of Pink Floyd's inclination for tinkering around in the studio working to achieve an effect of minimalism rather than theatrical grandiosity, and even though it's held in pretty low esteem by some I think it's very possibly their strongest songwriting on record. If you've been put off by the "bigness" of their sound in the past this would be a great record to check out.

Sounds cool, I will do.

Worth reading some of the back story on it too, and maybe even having the lyrics handy. From Wikipedia:

The Final Cut is an anti-war concept album, whose lyrics explore what Waters regards as the betrayal of fallen British servicemen — such as his father — who during World War II sacrificed their lives in the spirit of a post-war dream. This post-war dream was that their victory would usher in a more peaceful world,[3] whose leaders would no longer be so eager to solve disputes by resorting to war. The album's lyrics are critical of Thatcher, whose policies and decisions Waters regarded as an example of this betrayal. She is referred to as "Maggie" throughout the album.

The whole page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Final_Cut_%28album%29

Like most of Pink Floyd's concept albums (probably most concept albums in general), it begins to feel silly if you devote too much time to how each song fits into a "storyline" or something like that, but having some of those larger themes looming in the background really adds emotional weight to the songs. For a band that were supposedly all about theatrics and excess, their songs had a tremendous amount of heart.

Mine wrote:Would someone care to elaborate how Stone influenced "their own" sound and what is identified as their own sound? Just curious.

I have no idea to be honest.

I find it funny how everyone assumes some member got fleeced on the decisions on this album. Maybe they all agreed on what should be on the album, and they are all happy with the final result. And maybe, after 23 years in the biz, they are not so naive as to blindly follow the producers every recommendation.

Ladies and gentlemen, no matter how you feel about these songs, this is Pearl Jam.

liebzz wrote:I find it funny how everyone assumes some member got fleeced on the decisions on this album. Maybe they all agreed on what should be on the album, and they are all happy with the final result. And maybe, after 23 years in the biz, they are not so naive as to blindly follow the producers every recommendation.

Ladies and gentlemen, no matter how you feel about these songs, this is Pearl Jam.

I don't think they're blindly following anything, but I do think they're not interested in defying his decisions and ideas at the moment because they're not that interested in being a recording band.

harmless wrote:

liebzz wrote:I find it funny how everyone assumes some member got fleeced on the decisions on this album. Maybe they all agreed on what should be on the album, and they are all happy with the final result. And maybe, after 23 years in the biz, they are not so naive as to blindly follow the producers every recommendation.

Ladies and gentlemen, no matter how you feel about these songs, this is Pearl Jam.

I don't think they're blindly following anything, but I do think they're not interested in defying his decisions and ideas at the moment because they're not that interested in being a recording band.

I think the truth lies somewhere in the middle, that there was a compromise as to what would be included and what the sound would be like in order to make everyone somewhat happy with the final result.

I disagree that they are not interested in being a recording band. This album, so far, has been nothing if not utterly fascinating - evidenced by they 900+ pages of discussion here. At least in these circles, that makes their recording status quite relevant even if polarizing.

EDIT: I would also add that none of these songs so far feel like they are just mailing it in to my ears.