Red Mosquito

stip wrote:for those of you who say this song feels 'organic', what do you mean by that?

something that sounds like real people playing real instruments in a room

Heathen wrote:

stip wrote:for those of you who say this song feels 'organic', what do you mean by that?

something that sounds like real people playing real instruments in a room

This is a big part of it.

stip wrote:for those of you who say this song feels 'organic', what do you mean by that?

The complete opposite to the beginning of "lightning bolt"

okay everyone clap!!! clap!! !build!! EMOTIONAL RELEASE TIME!

okay, right, but remember that these are also very different types of songs. You can't easily compare these to each other, can you? It makes sense to prefer one type to another, though.

actually I'm not sure what i'm responding to here.


These feel unmastered to me. I really wonder how much of people's issues with later day pearl jam really come down to production--issues with how the songs feel due to their presentation, rather than the writing itself.

stip wrote:okay, right, but remember that these are also very different types of songs. You can't easily compare these to each other, can you? It makes sense to prefer one type to another, though.

actually I'm not sure what i'm responding to here.


These feel unmastered to me. I really wonder how much of people's issues with later day pearl jam really come down to production--issues with how the songs feel due to their presentation, rather than the writing itself.

It just feels though it was a very specific effort to start the song off that way; so that the fans can get get all riled up and clapping before it breaks. When the alternative approach may be "what does this song require"

stip wrote:I really wonder how much of people's issues with later day pearl jam really come down to production--issues with how the songs feel due to their presentation, rather than the writing itself.

Eh, if that was the case I'd have to hate Parachutes, Marker In The Sand, and Army Reserve.

stip wrote:for those of you who say this song feels 'organic', what do you mean by that?

It just seems to have a kind of life that's been lacking for some time.

The song moves, it tilts and careens and dips and dives, and does so completely un-self-consciously. There's space within and around the central riff that lets the other instruments explore their respective places in the larger composition. The melody isn't immediate, and is the antithesis of, say, Worldwide Suicide. WWS's vocal melody feels contrived, compressed, and overwrought, and it feels like the delivery's affectation is composed for the sake of a hook. It seems like it was crafted irrespective of the contributions of the other five members, while LiR's delivery feels as though it's mindful of - and purposely situated within - the contributions of the other members. It feels like all five band members are allowed to bring this piece to life, while songs like WWS and The Fixer and MYM are kitschy and disposable, and entirely unconcerned with creating space for the rest of the band to flourish.

The life in this song sounds to me like the sum of five vibrant musicians each breathing life into the framework of a composition, rather than being constrained by structures and ambitions imposed by one primary songwriter. This is a Pearl Jam song, not an Eddie Vedder song.

Guys, thodoks gets it.

stip wrote:okay, right, but remember that these are also very different types of songs. You can't easily compare these to each other, can you? It makes sense to prefer one type to another, though.

actually I'm not sure what i'm responding to here.


These feel unmastered to me. I really wonder how much of people's issues with later day pearl jam really come down to production--issues with how the songs feel due to their presentation, rather than the writing itself.

Production is brilliant in RA and I find it lackluster. The production has been poor the past two and it has only highlighted the weaknesses in the writing. Better production may have helped in overall listenability but wouldn't have made them better songs.

--- wrote:

stip wrote:for those of you who say this song feels 'organic', what do you mean by that?

It just seems to have a kind of life that's been lacking for some time.

The song moves, it tilts and careens and dips and dives, and does so completely un-self-consciously. There's space within and around the central riff that lets the other instruments explore their respective places in the larger composition. The melody isn't immediate, and is the antithesis of, say, Worldwide Suicide. WWS's vocal melody feels contrived, compressed, and overwrought, and it feels like the delivery's affectation is composed for the sake of a hook. It seems like it was crafted irrespective of the contributions of the other five members, while LiR's delivery feels as though it's mindful of - and purposely situated within - the contributions of the other members. It feels like all five band members are allowed to bring this piece to life, while songs like WWS and The Fixer and MYM are kitschy and disposable, and entirely unconcerned with creating space for the rest of the band to flourish.

The life in this song sounds to me like the sum of five vibrant musicians each breathing life into the framework of a composition, rather than being constrained by structures and ambitions imposed by one primary songwriter. This is a Pearl Jam song, not an Eddie Vedder song.

--- wrote:

stip wrote:for those of you who say this song feels 'organic', what do you mean by that?

It just seems to have a kind of life that's been lacking for some time.

The song moves, it tilts and careens and dips and dives, and does so completely un-self-consciously. There's space within and around the central riff that lets the other instruments explore their respective places in the larger composition. The melody isn't immediate, and is the antithesis of, say, Worldwide Suicide. WWS's vocal melody feels contrived, compressed, and overwrought, and it feels like the delivery's affectation is composed for the sake of a hook. It seems like it was crafted irrespective of the contributions of the other five members, while LiR's delivery feels as though it's mindful of - and purposely situated within - the contributions of the other members. It feels like all five band members are allowed to bring this piece to life, while songs like WWS and The Fixer and MYM are kitschy and disposable, and entirely unconcerned with creating space for the rest of the band to flourish.

The life in this song sounds to me like the sum of five vibrant musicians each breathing life into the framework of a composition, rather than being constrained by structures and ambitions imposed by one primary songwriter. This is a Pearl Jam song, not an Eddie Vedder song.

wow, how did you do that?

EJ wrote:

--- wrote:

stip wrote:for those of you who say this song feels 'organic', what do you mean by that?

It just seems to have a kind of life that's been lacking for some time.

The song moves, it tilts and careens and dips and dives, and does so completely un-self-consciously. There's space within and around the central riff that lets the other instruments explore their respective places in the larger composition. The melody isn't immediate, and is the antithesis of, say, Worldwide Suicide. WWS's vocal melody feels contrived, compressed, and overwrought, and it feels like the delivery's affectation is composed for the sake of a hook. It seems like it was crafted irrespective of the contributions of the other five members, while LiR's delivery feels as though it's mindful of - and purposely situated within - the contributions of the other members. It feels like all five band members are allowed to bring this piece to life, while songs like WWS and The Fixer and MYM are kitschy and disposable, and entirely unconcerned with creating space for the rest of the band to flourish.

The life in this song sounds to me like the sum of five vibrant musicians each breathing life into the framework of a composition, rather than being constrained by structures and ambitions imposed by one primary songwriter. This is a Pearl Jam song, not an Eddie Vedder song.

wow, how did you do that?

Yea, im just going to stop posting all together....

stip wrote:okay, right, but remember that these are also very different types of songs. You can't easily compare these to each other, can you? It makes sense to prefer one type to another, though.

actually I'm not sure what i'm responding to here.


These feel unmastered to me. I really wonder how much of people's issues with later day pearl jam really come down to production--issues with how the songs feel due to their presentation, rather than the writing itself.

without alternate recordings to use as an example, I don't see how the production can be removed from the writing.

productive output is what people respond to - overproduced good music is essentially bad music - think of Let It Be - which George Martin is famous for noting: "produced by Phil Spector, or, rather, over-produced by Phil Spector"

stip wrote:you could be right, soulfire. these were my first impressions, and primarily based on the lyrics that kind of jumped out at me. Euthanasia, possibly (with the law must step aside lyric). Even abortion, from a certain angle.

This is what happens when I post something within hours instead of days

I get that same feeling, the liberation is death and especially the line about the "law must step aside" puts everything into focus of a potential euthanasia situation.

We think these songs are post Riot Act/pre ST, right?

The whole Terry Schiavo mess was March 2005.

mray10 wrote:

stip wrote:you could be right, soulfire. these were my first impressions, and primarily based on the lyrics that kind of jumped out at me. Euthanasia, possibly (with the law must step aside lyric). Even abortion, from a certain angle.

This is what happens when I post something within hours instead of days

I get that same feeling, the liberation is death and especially the line about the "law must step aside" puts everything into focus of a potential euthanasia situation.

We think these songs are post Riot Act/pre ST, right?

The whole Terry Schiavo mess was March 2005.

I think you may have just found the key that unlocked this song.

Soulfire wrote:

mray10 wrote:

stip wrote:you could be right, soulfire. these were my first impressions, and primarily based on the lyrics that kind of jumped out at me. Euthanasia, possibly (with the law must step aside lyric). Even abortion, from a certain angle.

This is what happens when I post something within hours instead of days

I get that same feeling, the liberation is death and especially the line about the "law must step aside" puts everything into focus of a potential euthanasia situation.

We think these songs are post Riot Act/pre ST, right?

The whole Terry Schiavo mess was March 2005.

I think you may have just found the key that unlocked this song.

good work mray

Me thinks it's about abortion. We all know how Ed loves abortion n all...

cutuphalfdead wrote:

stip wrote:I really wonder how much of people's issues with later day pearl jam really come down to production--issues with how the songs feel due to their presentation, rather than the writing itself.

Eh, if that was the case I'd have to hate Parachutes, Marker In The Sand, and Army Reserve.

it's not all that, obviously. And think about how much MORE you'd like those songs.

guys, I'm still not feeling this one. It's fine. But that's it.

stip wrote:These feel unmastered to me. I really wonder how much of people's issues with later day pearl jam really come down to production--issues with how the songs feel due to their presentation, rather than the writing itself.

I don't really make a distinction. A song is what a song sounds like. Not what the sheet looks like. At least to me. Now I know what you mean of course, so would I like Life Wasted, Unemployable, The Fixer or WWS with a different production? Probably not, unless it was produced in a way that makes the lyrics unhearable.