Red Mosquito

The in between is me

You also never choose a thought or experience, therefore free will is an illusion

tree_ wrote:You also never choose a thought or experience, therefore free will is an illusion

agree there is no free will

I’m choosing not to experience this thread any more

Things are just happening and you are observing them

E.H. Ruddock wrote:I’m choosing not to experience this thread any more

Yeah but you didn’t choose to have that thought

tree_ wrote:

E.H. Ruddock wrote:I’m choosing not to experience this thread any more

Yeah but you didn’t choose to have that thought

I choose blue pill

Yes I have an inner monologue

just because you don't choose your thoughts does not mean your thoughts are not "you"

epilogue wrote:Yes I have an inner monologue

hahaha I can just imagine!

Dev wrote:just because you don't choose your thoughts does not mean your thoughts are not "you"

Think about what you just said. Who is this you you are referring to. Who is the one choosing or not choosing thoughts? It’s definitely not your toenails

tree_ wrote:

Dev wrote:just because you don't choose your thoughts does not mean your thoughts are not "you"

Think about what you just said. Who is this you you are referring to. Who is the one choosing or not choosing thoughts?

not totally getting where you are going with this

you are asking me to define my definition of "you"?

I suppose we both ought to have done this

For me this is not a subjective thing to define

unless we are bearing down an is/ought type of issue

for me "you" is only what is

and i am thinking for you, "you" is what ought to be, or what we should strive towards?

either way my "you" is still compatible with the process of becoming which is all predetermined and purely material

so it encompasses what I think is your idealistic approach to this issue.

help me out

If you can literally chop off your hand and then still feel your hand, how is that even possibly you? It is your body. It is something you observe and experience. But it is not you. I can see how a person could argue that you are your brain. But a brain is worthless without consciousness. When you boil it down you are simply consciousness

tree_ wrote:If you can literally chop off your hand and then still feel your hand, how is that even possibly you? It is your body. It is something you observe and experience. But it is not you. I can see how a person could argue that you are your brain. But a brain is worthless without consciousness. When you boil it down you are simply consciousness

What if that hand slaps Chris Rock?

tree_ wrote:If you can literally chop off your hand and then still feel your hand, how is that even possibly you? It is your body. It is something you observe and experience. But it is not you. I can see how a person could argue that you are your brain. But a brain is worthless without consciousness. When you boil it down you are simply consciousness

ok i dont think you really took my last post seriously but whatever

if you think consciousness is something non material you don't get something very basic. everything including consciousness is purely material. your thoughts are material.

the idea of souls or consciousness being something independent of the material world is archaic

even your buddy sam harris who you are clearly misinterpreting would back me up on this.

Dev wrote:

tree_ wrote:If you can literally chop off your hand and then still feel your hand, how is that even possibly you? It is your body. It is something you observe and experience. But it is not you. I can see how a person could argue that you are your brain. But a brain is worthless without consciousness. When you boil it down you are simply consciousness

ok i dont think you really took my last post seriously but whatever

if you think consciousness is something non material you don't get something very basic. everything including consciousness is purely material. your thoughts are material.

the idea of souls or consciousness being something independent of the material world is archaic

even your buddy sam harris who you are clearly misinterpreting would back me up on this.

No dude you must not know Sam Harris. I’m literally making his arguments. I get that it’s counter intuitive and difficult to grasp, but if you learn to meditate it actually becomes quite common sensical what I’m talking about

tree_ wrote:

Dev wrote:

tree_ wrote:If you can literally chop off your hand and then still feel your hand, how is that even possibly you? It is your body. It is something you observe and experience. But it is not you. I can see how a person could argue that you are your brain. But a brain is worthless without consciousness. When you boil it down you are simply consciousness

ok i dont think you really took my last post seriously but whatever

if you think consciousness is something non material you don't get something very basic. everything including consciousness is purely material. your thoughts are material.

the idea of souls or consciousness being something independent of the material world is archaic

even your buddy sam harris who you are clearly misinterpreting would back me up on this.

No dude you must not know Sam Harris. I’m literally making his arguments. I get that it’s counter intuitive and difficult to grasp, but if you learn to meditate it actually becomes quite common sense what I’m talking about

you are extrapolating the wrong things from is his philosophy on meditation. He is just trying to pave out a good meditation process for everyone. but you are taking those points and understanding them to make incorrect metaphysical conclusions. sam harris has verbatim said there is no place in the brain for a soul. I am quite sure he is a strict materialist who enjoys the benefits of meditation. but meditation is just a weird theoretical exercise. it's probably good for your mental health but it doesn't point to any conclusions about the true nature of existence.

Dev wrote:

tree_ wrote:

Dev wrote:

tree_ wrote:If you can literally chop off your hand and then still feel your hand, how is that even possibly you? It is your body. It is something you observe and experience. But it is not you. I can see how a person could argue that you are your brain. But a brain is worthless without consciousness. When you boil it down you are simply consciousness

ok i dont think you really took my last post seriously but whatever

if you think consciousness is something non material you don't get something very basic. everything including consciousness is purely material. your thoughts are material.

the idea of souls or consciousness being something independent of the material world is archaic

even your buddy sam harris who you are clearly misinterpreting would back me up on this.

No dude you must not know Sam Harris. I’m literally making his arguments. I get that it’s counter intuitive and difficult to grasp, but if you learn to meditate it actually becomes quite common sense what I’m talking about

you are extrapolating the wrong things from is his philosophy on meditation. He is just trying to pave out a good meditation process for everyone. but you are taking those points and understanding them to make incorrect metaphysical conclusions. sam harris has verbatim said there is no place in the brain for a soul. I am quite sure he is a strict materialist who enjoys the benefits of meditation. but meditation is just a weird theoretical exercise. it's probably good for your mental health but it doesn't point to any conclusions about the true nature of existence.

I didn’t say soul, I said consciousness. You are consciousness. Sam Harris agrees with this. It’s quite simple. meditation isn’t just some weird exercise, it’s getting to know yourself as you truly are. The vast empty space in which experiences happen

tree_ wrote:

Dev wrote:

tree_ wrote:

Dev wrote:

tree_ wrote:If you can literally chop off your hand and then still feel your hand, how is that even possibly you? It is your body. It is something you observe and experience. But it is not you. I can see how a person could argue that you are your brain. But a brain is worthless without consciousness. When you boil it down you are simply consciousness

ok i dont think you really took my last post seriously but whatever

if you think consciousness is something non material you don't get something very basic. everything including consciousness is purely material. your thoughts are material.

the idea of souls or consciousness being something independent of the material world is archaic

even your buddy sam harris who you are clearly misinterpreting would back me up on this.

No dude you must not know Sam Harris. I’m literally making his arguments. I get that it’s counter intuitive and difficult to grasp, but if you learn to meditate it actually becomes quite common sense what I’m talking about

you are extrapolating the wrong things from is his philosophy on meditation. He is just trying to pave out a good meditation process for everyone. but you are taking those points and understanding them to make incorrect metaphysical conclusions. sam harris has verbatim said there is no place in the brain for a soul. I am quite sure he is a strict materialist who enjoys the benefits of meditation. but meditation is just a weird theoretical exercise. it's probably good for your mental health but it doesn't point to any conclusions about the true nature of existence.

I didn’t say soul, I said consciousness. You are consciousness. Sam Harris agrees with this. It’s quite simple. meditation isn’t just some weird exercise, it’s getting to know yourself as you truly are. The vast empty space in which experiences happen

i can agree that "you" are consciousness, but "you" are not only consciousness. and from what I can tell you think that consciousness exists outside the body. which it does not. and sam I believe would back me up on that.

finally there is not thing you "truly" are that isn't already apparent. if you want to go that route in meaningful terms(hegel?). you are what you are(thesis) but also what you are not(antithesis), and thus both of these things at once(synthesis) which is pretty much meaningless as far as I am concerned. Or at least I don't know what that can help us to appreciate except that we are in a process of becoming.

If you take away your hand you are still you. If you take away your consciousness you are nobody