Red Mosquito

And that doesn't contradict anything Bob Dylan ever said or did.

I've changed my mind on some shit I said 20 years ago, have you? But I guess I'm being an "apologist" here, so I'll keep quiet now.....

bada wrote:We need to clear something up gang. Eddie married someone who did some modeling not a supermodel.

Yeah she is far from supermodel territory.

Tuolumne wrote:I've changed my mind on some shit I said 20 years ago, have you? But I guess I'm being an "apologist" here, so I'll keep quiet now.....

You never stop bringing the lulz, I'll give you that. Remember how angry you got at me years ago in the PJ20 thread? Good times.

Tuolumne wrote:I've changed my mind on some shit I said 20 years ago, have you? But I guess I'm being an "apologist" here, so I'll keep quiet now.....

It's definitely been twenty years since Ed was rampaging against the administration Rice was a part of. I mean, he was basically just a little kid when he was railing against W. He couldn't have been older than what, 19, 20 years old?

Lament wrote:

Tuolumne wrote:I've changed my mind on some shit I said 20 years ago, have you? But I guess I'm being an "apologist" here, so I'll keep quiet now.....

It's definitely been twenty years since Ed was rampaging against the administration Rice was a part of. I mean, he was basically just a little kid when he was railing against W. He couldn't have been older than what, 19, 20 years old?

I agree with that. Hypocrisy. It just doesn't incense me as much as it does you b/c I don't see how this is effecting any bad behavior in any practical way. It effects neither me nor the band nor the band's little universe at all. I read the news report and I go "yeah, hypocritical". It just doesn't piss me off, particularly the kind where I go "I'm done with this band".

Tuolumne wrote:I agree with that. Hypocrisy. It just doesn't incense me as much as it does you b/c I don't see how this is effecting any bad behavior in any practical way. It effects neither me nor the band nor the band's little universe at all. I read the news report and I go "yeah, hypocritical". It just doesn't piss me off, particularly the kind where I go "I'm done with this band".

It doesn't incense me at all. I'm the one who argued they've probably always been this way.

I don't really see a lot of anger anywhere in this thread, despite constantly seeing people state that people are super upset about things. I see a lot people of making fun of Pearl Jam, but honestly their behavior calls for mocking because it's pretty regularly ridiculous these days.

Birds in Hell wrote: I've made this point before but I do think Beth's influence on both Ed's public persona and his music is frequently understated.

I don't buy this.

Lament wrote:

Tuolumne wrote:I agree with that. Hypocrisy. It just doesn't incense me as much as it does you b/c I don't see how this is effecting any bad behavior in any practical way. It effects neither me nor the band nor the band's little universe at all. I read the news report and I go "yeah, hypocritical". It just doesn't piss me off, particularly the kind where I go "I'm done with this band".

It doesn't incense me at all. I'm the one who argued they've probably always been this way.

I don't really see a lot of anger anywhere in this thread, despite constantly seeing people state that people are super upset about things. I see a lot people of making fun of Pearl Jam, but honestly their behavior calls for mocking because it's pretty regularly ridiculous these days.

It is. We all know the only sensible thing to do when you have lots of money is to put it in a big pile and then stare at it with sullen resentment

cutuphalfdead wrote:And that doesn't contradict anything Bob Dylan ever said or did.

Oh please. He has tons of stuff in his music about class and greed.

BurtReynolds wrote:

bada wrote:We need to clear something up gang. Eddie married someone who did some modeling not a supermodel.

Yeah she is far from supermodel territory.

Maybe Eddie needs money for an upgrade

stip wrote:

cutuphalfdead wrote:And that doesn't contradict anything Bob Dylan ever said or did.

Oh please. He has tons of stuff in his music about class and greed.

Social justice doesn't have to be anti-capitalism.

And I'm not an expert on it, but I know more than one die hard Bob Dylan fan who laugh at people who call him a sell out over the commercials he's done, saying that Bob is doing what he's always said he would do. I don't have the sources to back it up, but that's what I've heard.

I think we should back off guys, the guys obviously need the money. Botox and hairplugs cost a lot these days.

stip wrote:

Lament wrote:

Tuolumne wrote:I agree with that. Hypocrisy. It just doesn't incense me as much as it does you b/c I don't see how this is effecting any bad behavior in any practical way. It effects neither me nor the band nor the band's little universe at all. I read the news report and I go "yeah, hypocritical". It just doesn't piss me off, particularly the kind where I go "I'm done with this band".

It doesn't incense me at all. I'm the one who argued they've probably always been this way.

I don't really see a lot of anger anywhere in this thread, despite constantly seeing people state that people are super upset about things. I see a lot people of making fun of Pearl Jam, but honestly their behavior calls for mocking because it's pretty regularly ridiculous these days.

It is. We all know the only sensible thing to do when you have lots of money is to put it in a big pile and then stare at it with sullen resentment

What are you talking about?

Anyway, in conclusion, Pearl Jam sucks the last 10 years for a gazillion reasons. Most importantly:

1) Every album since 2003 sucks.
2) 10 Club sucks like nothing has ever sucked before. Complete disrespect for their fans in the name of money, whether it was multiple hours trying to get tickets (biggest gripe), censoring their message board, or ripping them off for shirts, posters, or dog collars.
3) They have gone completely corporate in a gazillion ways, no reason to list them all. We are just a decade away from a "Pearl Jam fantasy camp/meet and greet package". If anyone wants to bet me whether Pearl Jam offers meet and greats the next 10 years, I will take that bet.

It's kind of hard to respect the band when 1, 2, and 3 are all true, no matter how you want to delude yourself. I could give a shit if they want to make money. I'm a capitalist. I've worked in the stock market my entire life. But these guys put out shitty music and try to extort their fans while doing so, with absolutely no regard to their time (hours fighting for tickets on numerous occasions over the years when they could have fixed it a decade ago, ticket block systems in 2003 where people waited on line for hours so they could save on labor, etc.).

And guess what...yes...I'm done. I don't like Pearl Jam anymore. After 70+ shows, I don't listen any of their music because I cringe at an old Crazy Mary or Black when I think about how commercially dumb this band has become.

I'm glad a lot of people get joy out of seeing them live. The last time I went I rolled my eyes the entire time because I felt like I was being used. And that's after 70 shows!

I'm happy the band is happy. That's pretty much the only rational I've ever come up with for why things changed so much from 2000/2003 to now. That doesn't mean I want to go see a Vegas act. And trust me, I grew up in Vegas, PEARL JAM IS NOW A VEGAS ACT. That's probably the best way to put it.

Id probably argue that a coherent social justice perspective has to be anti capitalist, and Dylan's pedigree traces itself back to the IWW for fucks sake.

pearl jams music is never anti capitalism either. There are concerns about the coercive social and political consequences of destructive greed. That is perfectly compatible with making money. It all comes down to whether or not doing so causes harm

given2trade wrote:

stip wrote:

Lament wrote:

Tuolumne wrote:I agree with that. Hypocrisy. It just doesn't incense me as much as it does you b/c I don't see how this is effecting any bad behavior in any practical way. It effects neither me nor the band nor the band's little universe at all. I read the news report and I go "yeah, hypocritical". It just doesn't piss me off, particularly the kind where I go "I'm done with this band".

It doesn't incense me at all. I'm the one who argued they've probably always been this way.

I don't really see a lot of anger anywhere in this thread, despite constantly seeing people state that people are super upset about things. I see a lot people of making fun of Pearl Jam, but honestly their behavior calls for mocking because it's pretty regularly ridiculous these days.

It is. We all know the only sensible thing to do when you have lots of money is to put it in a big pile and then stare at it with sullen resentment

What are you talking about?

Anyway, in conclusion, Pearl Jam sucks the last 10 years for a gazillion reasons. Most importantly:

1) Every album since 2003 sucks.
2) 10 Club sucks like nothing has ever sucked before. Complete disrespect for their fans in the name of money, whether it was multiple hours trying to get tickets (biggest gripe), censoring their message board, or ripping them off for shirts, posters, or dog collars.
3) They have gone completely corporate in a gazillion ways, no reason to list them all. We are just a decade away from a "Pearl Jam fantasy camp/meet and greet package". If anyone wants to bet me whether Pearl Jam offers meet and greats the next 10 years, I will take that bet.

It's kind of hard to respect the band when 1, 2, and 3 are all true, no matter how you want to delude yourself. I could give a shit if they want to make money. I'm a capitalist. I've worked in the stock market my entire life. But these guys put out shitty music and try to extort their fans while doing so, with absolutely no regard to their time (hours fighting for tickets on numerous occasions over the years when they could have fixed it a decade ago, ticket block systems in 2003 where people waited on line for hours so they could save on labor, etc.).

And guess what...yes...I'm done. I don't like Pearl Jam anymore. After 70+ shows, I don't listen any of their music because I cringe at an old Crazy Mary or Black when I think about how commercially dumb this band has become.

I'm glad a lot of people get joy out of seeing them live. The last time I went I rolled my eyes the entire time because I felt like I was being used. And that's after 70 shows!

I'm happy the band is happy. That's pretty much the only rational I've ever come up with for why things changed so much from 2000/2003 to now. That doesn't mean I want to go see a Vegas act. And trust me, I grew up in Vegas, PEARL JAM IS NOW A VEGAS ACT. That's probably the best way to put it.

and they yell at their fans..well done Matty..couldnt agree more

lol stip you're adorable

There is a lot if stuff worth criticizing the 10c over. The merchandise isn't one of them. Shit, it may be the only thing not worth criticizing.

given2trade wrote:lol stip you're adorable

I teared up a little knowing you cared enough to write a goodbye letter to your fandom