Red Mosquito

yeah, i agree its tricky. Thats how i feel these days, but Gigaton could be a top three with time im sure.

listening to this now, alright should get more love.

PHATJ wrote:

Leatherhead wrote:

warehouse wrote:there should be way more 5 stars for this thing. its seems like both pro and anti backspacer people love this thing. again, best since yield, which is my 1-2 favorite album.

In time I think more people could move it to 5 stars. I think it can be hard to compare how much you like something that's so new, to something you've loved for years.

Do people generally do this with all their entertainment or is this just a PJ centric ideal?

When the most recent The National album came out last year I had no qualms calling it my favorite new music in many years and probably my favorite album by the band. That opinion didn’t get scoffed at. I don’t remember people saying “it’s great, but I have to wait for a few years before I can say it’s favorite”.

When you see a new movie you love, or TV series that is everything you want it to be, or read a new book that you instantly connect with, or eat a meal that blows your mind, do you wait for months or years before you call it your favorite? Or do you allow the awesome experience you are having with it to actually be your favorite thing for that time, and the foreseeable future, and maybe forever, if that’s what happens?

i think part of it is the 'test of time' thing. its hard to compare music i've loved most of my life with songs i've listened to for months. another part, which is probably more PJ centric, is growing up with this stuff. i have emotional connections with songs that cant be matched in such short a time.

with that said, there's been exceptions. when DOTC came out i said immediately it was one of the best pearl jam songs ever. i still feel that way.

Leatherhead wrote:

warehouse wrote:there should be way more 5 stars for this thing. its seems like both pro and anti backspacer people love this thing. again, best since yield, which is my 1-2 favorite album.

In time I think more people could move it to 5 stars. I think it can be hard to compare how much you like something that's so new, to something you've loved for years.

Yeah, every time I pop into this thread and see the poll, I'm tempted to bump to 5. But, all in good time.

warehouse wrote: i'm still having a hard time ranking this with the rest of the catalogue, for the reasons stated above. how am i supposed to rank a brand new album over an album that shaped my life since i was like 10? but the quality of songs on this thing doesnt seem to be in question. part of it is the diversity, they go all over the place with this one.

2002 was the last time a Pearl Jam album became emblematic of a stage in my life. That it's very easy to imagine feeling that way about Gigaton come 2038 was unforeseeable and is truly a gift.

I bumped it from a 4 to a 3 recently.

PHATJ wrote:

Leatherhead wrote:

warehouse wrote:there should be way more 5 stars for this thing. its seems like both pro and anti backspacer people love this thing. again, best since yield, which is my 1-2 favorite album.

In time I think more people could move it to 5 stars. I think it can be hard to compare how much you like something that's so new, to something you've loved for years.

Do people generally do this with all their entertainment or is this just a PJ centric ideal?

When the most recent The National album came out last year I had no qualms calling it my favorite new music in many years and probably my favorite album by the band. That opinion didn’t get scoffed at. I don’t remember people saying “it’s great, but I have to wait for a few years before I can say it’s favorite”.

When you see a new movie you love, or TV series that is everything you want it to be, or read a new book that you instantly connect with, or eat a meal that blows your mind, do you wait for months or years before you call it your favorite? Or do you allow the awesome experience you are having with it to actually be your favorite thing for that time, and the foreseeable future, and maybe forever, if that’s what happens?

This is a great point. I think it also speaks to how time between albums has infected people's opinions of them. I think No Code Benefits from a short time between albums and Lightning Bolt and Backspacer have problems on here because it's an album from the most analytical corner of the fanbase and they had years to tear it apart. For me, No Code objectively has a string of weaker songs in the bottom half of the record (exception being Present Tense). These songs didn't have as much of a chance to get "weeded out" because there the Yield excitement cycle started in the tail end of 1997. We heard rumblings they had finished a record and were doing Stones shows and No Code was in the rearview at that point. No more analysis, onto the next and now there's only these good vibes attached to it because Yield came to the rescue and took the weight off of some of the shakier aspects of No Code.

But back to PhatJ's point. In defense of No Code or any album, how you feel in the beginning should matter. And I also don't like albums having to be pitted against each other. You can like Backspacer and Gigaton, as different as they are from each other. Albums don't necessarily have to "age" well, they just have to impact you in some way in totality. I don't listen to Vs that mich anymore, but dangit if it doesn't define a certain portion of my high school years. It matters and that impact should be respected. For Gigaton, I'll always associated it with the malaise of the Trump era and long walks during social distancing. It will always have meaning because of that. However it "ages", it's impact on me now shouldn't be minimized. Also, PhatJ rocks, guys.

The National are a more recent band, and I don't think -- at least for fans of the band -- they're coming off a decade-long losing streak. I think where it becomes harder to accurately compare records, for me anyway, is when those older records extend back into formative years, and are isolated by this chasm of time where I felt disconnected from the band.

And PHATJ, I apologize if I came across as jerky earlier. I just feel like there have been a lot of instances of you responding to measured criticism/commentary on Gigaton with these sort of flippant shutdowns that close off what could be some interesting and enjoyable conversations, just because they are having thoughts about the album that don't have them arriving at the conclusion that it's 100% unequivocally perfect. Maybe it really is some elaborate put-on -- I don't really enjoy the exercise of constantly trying to decipher each RMer's sincerity level -- I'm just reflecting how it feels to me.

Thanks, KD. No hard feelings on my end. I also apologize for coming off as a dickhead much more than I ever intended to in any Pearl Jam or Gigaton discussions. I’m not trying to be a dick. Sarcastic? Often yes. Mischievous? Sometimes. But I’m usually just messing around in good humor. There are a few posters and certain incidents where that hasn’t been the case, and that’s on me. Maybe I’m just going crazy with this quarantine and isolation shit too.

Point is, I love the conversations, that’s why I’m on RM. Maybe I’ve gotten too shtick-ish, or dick-ish, or whatever. I’ll try to be nicer.

The magic of RM.

We're in this together

Hatfield wrote:

super nintendo chalmers wrote:

Birds in Hell wrote:Haven't been able to muster any enthusiasm to listen to this album.

Maybe things will swing back around at some point, but I wonder if my interest in Pearl Jam is now primarily historical.

Same. I did like three songs, put it aside for something and never returned.

SNC, I need you to keep giving Gigaton a try. You are a super fan from WAY back, at least in my online world. I think there is more in this album for you. I have you tried listening.......on WEED?!

I mean, seriously.

Tuolumne wrote:For me, No Code objectively has a string of weaker songs in the bottom half of the record (exception being Present Tense).

Could not agree more.

RockPusher wrote:

Tuolumne wrote:For me, No Code objectively has a string of weaker songs in the bottom half of the record (exception being Present Tense).

Could not agree more.

Yep

Also, confession- I was in love with Lightning Bolt when it came out. Looking back, I just didn't know any better. It had been a long time and I was always a fan of the longer, meandering, more experimental PJ. Lightning Bolt, for all its inhibited production, did present a step in the direction I favored. Additionally, I literally became a dad around that time, and so the dad-rock elements felt pretty good. I was into Future Days, for instance, where as now I recognize that it is a pretty weak song in many ways.

PHATJ wrote:Thanks, KD. No hard feelings on my end. I also apologize for coming off as a dickhead much more than I ever intended to in any Pearl Jam or Gigaton discussions. I’m not trying to be a dick. Sarcastic? Often yes. Mischievous? Sometimes. But I’m usually just messing around in good humor. There are a few posters and certain incidents where that hasn’t been the case, and that’s on me. Maybe I’m just going crazy with this quarantine and isolation shit too.

Point is, I love the conversations, that’s why I’m on RM. Maybe I’ve gotten too shtick-ish, or dick-ish, or whatever. I’ll try to be nicer.

Soyboy

This album just keeps getting better to me, it’s the opposite of the last 15 years of Pearl Jam.

warehouse wrote:there should be way more 5 stars for this thing. its seems like both pro and anti backspacer people love this thing. again, best since yield, which is my 1-2 favorite album.

You aren't wrong my DMB loving friend!

Hatfield wrote:

warehouse wrote:there should be way more 5 stars for this thing. its seems like both pro and anti backspacer people love this thing. again, best since yield, which is my 1-2 favorite album.

You aren't wrong my DMB loving friend!

Average score currently comes out to 4.09 currently.

it's far and away my favourite since Riot Act, but at the moment it's still a 4, because the first seven albums are all an untouchable 5 for me, and only time will tell if this album deserves that canon legendary status or not