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Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 12:06 am
by B
The zoo comment wasn't fair, but I enjoyed it.

https://www.hrc.org/press-releases/gend ... rans-youth
Another study, published in the Journal of the American Medical Association, agreed, saying, "receipt of gender-affirming care, including puberty blockers and gender-affirming hormones, was associated with 60% lower odds of moderate or severe depression and 73% lower odds of suicidality over a 12-month follow-up."
According to the National Center for Transgender Equality’s 2015 U.S. Transgender Survey, only 3% of respondents have detransitioned permanently at some point.

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 12:34 am
by Bi_3
Activism over science is very on brand. There are a shocking number of outright lies in that link:
Transgender children are not undergoing irreversible medical changes.
Hormone therapy and surgical care are not offered to young people, but reserved for those who can give truly informed consent.
Transgender children do not undergo gender-affirming surgeries, but may receive fully reversible medications that put puberty on hold

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 1:35 am
by B
Bi_3 wrote:Activism over science is very on brand. There are a shocking number of outright lies in that link:
Transgender children are not undergoing irreversible medical changes.
Hormone therapy and surgical care are not offered to young people, but reserved for those who can give truly informed consent.
Transgender children do not undergo gender-affirming surgeries, but may receive fully reversible medications that put puberty on hold

I can't speak for all hospitals, but this is what Boston Children's was offering when your friends at Libs of TikTok went after them. It aligns with those statements.
The types of gender-affirming care that Children’s offers ranges from simple interventions such as allowing patients to use preferred names and pronouns in their medical records, to counseling, hormonal therapy to delay puberty or transition to a different gender. For patients 15 and older, breast surgery is an option, as is genital surgery for those 18 and older.

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 10:36 am
by Bi_3
B wrote:
Bi_3 wrote:Activism over science is very on brand. There are a shocking number of outright lies in that link:
Transgender children are not undergoing irreversible medical changes.
Hormone therapy and surgical care are not offered to young people, but reserved for those who can give truly informed consent.
Transgender children do not undergo gender-affirming surgeries, but may receive fully reversible medications that put puberty on hold

I can't speak for all hospitals, but this is what Boston Children's was offering when your friends at Libs of TikTok went after them. It aligns with those statements.
The types of gender-affirming care that Children’s offers ranges from simple interventions such as allowing patients to use preferred names and pronouns in their medical records, to counseling, hormonal therapy to delay puberty or transition to a different gender. For patients 15 and older, breast surgery is an option, as is genital surgery for those 18 and older.

This is kinda fascinating... to me that statement from the hospital directly contradicts what the HRC link says are 'facts' about affirming care but you read it as the opposite. Like a '2 + 2 = 5' moment. Gonna be hard for society to reconcile things if we cannot agree on what meaning simple sentences convey and might be at the root of a lot of the broader issues on this topic.

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 12:06 pm
by B
Bi_3 wrote:Gonna be hard for society to reconcile things if we cannot agree on what meaning simple sentences convey and might be at the root of a lot of the broader issues on this topic.
Transgendered individuals are not required to secure your understanding before they ask their doctor for gender affirming care.

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 12:45 pm
by BurtReynolds
And if the doctor says it's not a good idea?

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 12:51 pm
by B
Oh man, you caught me endorsing medical interventions done by homeless people in self-storage crates! Fuck!

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 1:10 pm
by tree_
B wrote:
Bi_3 wrote:Gonna be hard for society to reconcile things if we cannot agree on what meaning simple sentences convey and might be at the root of a lot of the broader issues on this topic.
Transgendered individuals are not required to secure your understanding before they ask their doctor for gender affirming care.
The hyperbole is ridiculous. Defining words clearly is not bigotry.

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 1:24 pm
by B
Language has been used to control marginalized people for the comfort of those in power since the days of grunts.

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 1:28 pm
by tree_
B wrote:Language has been used to control marginalized people for the comfort of those in power since the days of grunts.
Then why use words at all anymore? Let's just go full dolphin

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 1:38 pm
by BurtReynolds
It's just mindless rhetoric. They have no actual argument.

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 1:42 pm
by BurtReynolds
B wrote:Language has been used to control marginalized people for the comfort of those in power since the days of grunts.
Actually it's more of the opposite. I'm begging you people to read Nietzsche. He very clearly explains how this all came about.

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 1:43 pm
by BurtReynolds
B wrote:Oh man, you caught me endorsing medical interventions done by homeless people in self-storage crates! Fuck!
What?

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 1:57 pm
by Bi_3
BurtReynolds wrote:
B wrote:Language has been used to control marginalized people for the comfort of those in power since the days of grunts.
Actually it's more of the opposite. I'm begging you people to read Nietzsche. He very clearly explains how this all came about.
Tale as old as time....

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Tower-of-Babel


Edit: Let me explain this further before anyone accuses me of religiously motivated bigotry.

Scholar Alyssa Roat writes:
The ancient historian Josephus states of Nimrod, ‘He also said he would be revenged on God if he should have a mind to drown the world again; for that he would build a tower too high for the waters to be able to reach and that he would avenge himself on God for destroying their forefathers (Antiquities of the Jews, Book 1, Chapter 4).

God saw that the people were working together toward a common goal. But unfortunately, the goal they were working toward was steeped in arrogance and in direct opposition to God’s command to multiply and “fill the earth” (Genesis 9:1).

In their attempt to maintain unity and create a name for themselves, God’s people rebelled against God’s sovereign authority and embraced their own self-sufficiency. They felt they didn’t need God to rule over them—they could rule themselves and reach the heavens on their own terms, with their own hands, by their own means.

God’s justice and His grace could not allow this treachery to continue.
So the Lord scattered them from there over all the earth, and they stopped building the city. That is why it was called Babel—because there the Lord confused the language of the whole world.
The takeaway is not that we should always obey and be fruitful and multiply as Christian dogmatists might say, but more subversive in that authority will use the dissolution of common understanding to eliminate threats to it's power.

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 2:00 pm
by tree_

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 5:01 pm
by JuanHamm
Matt Walsh lol

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 5:30 pm
by Ms Harmless
can we just create a blacklist of the transphobes on the forum and pin it as an introductory thread for new members to read?

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 5:33 pm
by tree_
Ms Harmless wrote:can we just create a blacklist of the transphobes on the forum and pin it as an introductory thread for new members to read?
What are the criteria for being placed on this list?

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 5:40 pm
by B
Posting Matt Walsh clips?

Re: Transgender Rights

Posted: Tue June 13, 2023 5:41 pm
by tree_
no

I mean, I guess it might have to do with what the person said they feel about the clip, or even what the clip entails, and how it relates to the conversation in the thread.. but that may take too much discerning and stuff