Red Mosquito

B wrote:
My dad has a Republican friend who insists this is Trumps actual plan.

No way this is true

96583UP wrote:America,

Can we please nominate Bernie?

kind regards,

96583UP

"When you're white, you don't know what it's like to be living in a ghetto, you don't know what it's like to be poor. You don't know what it's like to be hassled when you walk down the street or you get dragged out of a car." - Bernie Sanders, D-Alternate Universe

b_i_revisited wrote:

96583UP wrote:America,

Can we please nominate Bernie?

kind regards,

96583UP

"When you're white, you don't know what it's like to be living in a ghetto, you don't know what it's like to be poor. You don't know what it's like to be hassled when you walk down the street or you get dragged out of a car." - Bernie Sanders, D-Alternate Universe

I knew people were gonna pounce on him for that. He worded that poorly, but what he's ultimately saying is on point.

LoathedVermin72 wrote:Donald Trump is the natural result of a media that has gradually, consistently degraded political discourse through ridicule and snark. Politics have been reduced to a joke, so now the candidates are becoming jokes. It's not surprising, really. We did this to ourselves.

spike wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:Donald Trump is the natural result of a media that has gradually, consistently degraded political discourse through ridicule and snark. Politics have been reduced to a joke, so now the candidates are becoming jokes. It's not surprising, really. We did this to ourselves.

Exactly.

LoathedVermin72 wrote:

spike wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:Donald Trump is the natural result of a media that has gradually, consistently degraded political discourse through ridicule and snark. Politics have been reduced to a joke, so now the candidates are becoming jokes. It's not surprising, really. We did this to ourselves.

Exactly.

laughing is not a laughing matter.

LoathedVermin72 wrote:

spike wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:Donald Trump is the natural result of a media that has gradually, consistently degraded political discourse through ridicule and snark. Politics have been reduced to a joke, so now the candidates are becoming jokes. It's not surprising, really. We did this to ourselves.

Exactly.

That's such nonsense.

Edit: Specifically, the implication of Jon Stewart's show being a catalyst for the things you've described, including enabling Trump or degrading American political discourse.

4/5 wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:

spike wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:Donald Trump is the natural result of a media that has gradually, consistently degraded political discourse through ridicule and snark. Politics have been reduced to a joke, so now the candidates are becoming jokes. It's not surprising, really. We did this to ourselves.

Exactly.

That's such nonsense.

Edit: Specifically, the implication of Jon Stewart's show being a catalyst for the things you've described, including enabling Trump or degrading American political discourse.

I'm not sure that it is, though "catalyst" might be an overstatement. What shows like his did is essentially broadcast disillusionment to a mass audience. Yes, it used satire in a frustrated attempt to illuminate the absurdity of American politics, but it ultimately became about partisan snark and self-righteousness. It only served to further polarize the political landscape. It did not unify or engender understanding, nor did it preserve or restore any dignity to the discourse. It became "blue team is better than red team" pandering, and reduced politicians and politics to an unserious joke, which creates a culture in which electable candidates can become less and less serious. Because, eventually, with enough repetition, treating these things as a joke becomes an act of normalization.

t2b was right about the media matching public consumption, which is why I wouldn't say this was a "catalyst," but I definitely don't think it did our country any favors.

I think the disillusionment provided by Fox News contributed to this more than anything. The amount of people that buy into what they are selling continues to amaze me and piss me off at the same time. Some of my family included.

Yeah, GOP's cultivation of this whole "government as bad guy," anti-science, nod-and-wink indirect racism culture is what made Trump possible. They fed the absurd, kept it in their closet and used it as they saw fit...and never dreamed that anyone would let it out and embrace it openly. I'm unprepared to say that Daily Show / Colbert didn't contribute to the political climate, but they seem more responsible for helping create a place where democrats aren't apologetic about being democrats again, and where an actual liberal like Sanders can gain major traction within his party.

basically, lol everything has gotten us here.

Americans seem to have lost the ability to consume any piece of news that isn't in-line with their exact way of thinking. Bernie fans are as guilty of this now as any right-wing nut job. "Media bias" has become their go-to phrase, which is pretty ironic.

turned2black wrote:Americans seem to have lost the ability to consume any piece of news that isn't in-line with their exact way of thinking. Bernie fans are as guilty of this now as any right-wing nut job. "Media bias" has become their go-to phrase, which is pretty ironic.

Right. Sensationalist pandering on both sides have contributed to our current situation. They have become forms of ideological isolationism.

LoathedVermin72 wrote:

spike wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:Donald Trump is the natural result of a media that has gradually, consistently degraded political discourse through ridicule and snark. Politics have been reduced to a joke, so now the candidates are becoming jokes. It's not surprising, really. We did this to ourselves.

Exactly.

Yeah I really agree with this.

LoathedVermin72 wrote:

turned2black wrote:Americans seem to have lost the ability to consume any piece of news that isn't in-line with their exact way of thinking. Bernie fans are as guilty of this now as any right-wing nut job. "Media bias" has become their go-to phrase, which is pretty ironic.

Right. Sensationalist pandering on both sides have contributed to our current situation. They have become forms of ideological isolationism.

I asked a friend who is Bernie supporter on Facebook how he thought his plans to make Healthcare and College free while increasing SS payouts along with massive infrastructure spending jived with economic and political realities and got labeled a right wing religious fundamentalist by all his friends.

LoathedVermin72 wrote:

4/5 wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:

spike wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:Donald Trump is the natural result of a media that has gradually, consistently degraded political discourse through ridicule and snark. Politics have been reduced to a joke, so now the candidates are becoming jokes. It's not surprising, really. We did this to ourselves.

Exactly.

That's such nonsense.

Edit: Specifically, the implication of Jon Stewart's show being a catalyst for the things you've described, including enabling Trump or degrading American political discourse.

I'm not sure that it is, though "catalyst" might be an overstatement. What shows like his did is essentially broadcast disillusionment to a mass audience. Yes, it used satire in a frustrated attempt to illuminate the absurdity of American politics, but it ultimately became about partisan snark and self-righteousness. It only served to further polarize the political landscape. It did not unify or engender understanding, nor did it preserve or restore any dignity to the discourse. It became "blue team is better than red team" pandering, and reduced politicians and politics to an unserious joke, which creates a culture in which electable candidates can become less and less serious. Because, eventually, with enough repetition, treating these things as a joke becomes an act of normalization.

t2b was right about the media matching public consumption, which is why I wouldn't say this was a "catalyst," but I definitely don't think it did our country any favors.

This thread is filled with discussion of how Trump's candidacy is a natural result of at least three decades of GOP dog whistle strategies finally being bluntly said out loud, so I'm not going to make that argument here again, though I think it's valid.

This post feels like a very scattershot criticism of The Daily Show. Yes, the show featured disillusionment with a broken political system and culpable media that failed spectacularly to do its job in the post 9/11 era, but what's wrong with that in and of itself? And yes, the show was written from a frustrated liberal perspective, but again, what's wrong with that? You're criticizing the show because it "did not unify or engender understanding, nor did it preserve or restore any dignity to the discourse." Is it really the responsibility of a social commentary show on Comedy Central to do these things when the news media, you know--actual journalists-- could hardly be said to doing these things themselves?

TDS was probably most successful in the area of holding the media (not only FOX News) accountable for their...let's say failure to contribute "any dignity to the discourse". In fact, it probably contributed the long-overdue prominence of fact-checking resources.

The part of your post that I disagree with the most is your assertion that it "reduced politicians and politics to an unserious joke." While it may have reduced politics to a joke it was always a very serious joke with grave repercussions. Stewart's genius was the way he could take on very serious topics, expose the absurdity of the situation or people involved, make you laugh a little bit, but bring you in on the joke where you're both watching the world burn together. I've read people, and I think you would agree, who argue that this essentially amounted to a detached nihilistic viewpoint that was ultimately harmful within the young liberal demographic who loved him so much. I disagree. I don't think it was about watching the world burn and then shrugging because there's nothing anyone can do, but rather the message was: We are in this together. The institutions, be they political, media, or otherwise corporate, are armed to the teeth and extremely powerful and their power is only growing. The stakes are very high but if we are aware of what they are doing and if we remember that ultimately we are all we have, maybe we can do something and move in a positive direction.

My departmental secretary came in this morning to tell me she has completed her journey from John Kasich to Marco Rubio to Donald Trump to Bernie Sanders. It's been fascinating to watch

4/5 just deleted a very thoughtful response for reasons I don't understand. So I'm going to pretend I said this, and not him

The part of your post that I disagree with the most is your assertion that it "reduced politicians and politics to an unserious joke." While it may have reduced politics to a joke it was always a very serious joke with grave repercussions. Stewart's genius was the way he could take on very serious topics, expose the absurdity of the situation or people involved, make you laugh a little bit, but bring you in on the joke where you're both watching the world burn together. I've read people, and I think you would agree, who argue that this essentially amounted to a detached nihilistic viewpoint that was ultimately harmful within the young liberal demographic who loved him so much. I disagree. I don't think it was about watching the world burn and then shrugging because there's nothing anyone can do, but rather the message was: We are in this together. The institutions, be they political, media, or otherwise corporate, are armed to the teeth and extremely powerful and their power is only growing. The stakes are very high but if we are aware of what they are doing and if we remember that ultimately we are all we have, maybe we can do something and move in a positive direction.

he's editing it