Red Mosquito

Bammer wrote:Final episode ... showed an email that the O'Kelley guy had sent ... man that guy nailed it, and I'm paraphrasing here:

"The Avery family tree has a single branch."

He talks about incest and whatnot. Find me one member of that family who doesn't fit the description. Even the people who married into the family! (Who were likely cousins anyway)

That much I know for sure. What I don't know is whether Steve or Brendan is guilty. I'm leaning toward not guilty.

Also raise your hand if you're surprised that Ken Kratz is a substance abusing sex addict. That guy probably has so many fucked up skeletons in his closet, easily the creepiest person in the whole thing.

Here is the list of the worst people in this whole thing. Brendan's original defense lawyer takes the cake....

hlniv wrote:Rank the worst people in this whole mess-

My rankings -

Len Kachinsky
Ken Krantz
Mark Wiegart
Michael O'Kelly
.
.
James Fassbender
Andrew Colburn
James Lenk
Kenneth Patterson
Tom Kocourek
Dennis Vogel
.
.
Steven Avery
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Brendan Dassey

hlniv wrote:

Bammer wrote:Final episode ... showed an email that the O'Kelley guy had sent ... man that guy nailed it, and I'm paraphrasing here:

"The Avery family tree has a single branch."

He talks about incest and whatnot. Find me one member of that family who doesn't fit the description. Even the people who married into the family! (Who were likely cousins anyway)

That much I know for sure. What I don't know is whether Steve or Brendan is guilty. I'm leaning toward not guilty.

Also raise your hand if you're surprised that Ken Kratz is a substance abusing sex addict. That guy probably has so many fucked up skeletons in his closet, easily the creepiest person in the whole thing.

Here is the list of the worst people in this whole thing. Brendan's original defense lawyer takes the cake....

hlniv wrote:Rank the worst people in this whole mess-

My rankings -

Len Kachinsky
Ken Krantz
Mark Wiegart
Michael O'Kelly
.
.
James Fassbender
Andrew Colburn
James Lenk
Kenneth Patterson
Tom Kocourek
Dennis Vogel
.
.
Steven Avery
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Brendan Dassey

Yeah that's a pretty good list. What kind of fucking half cocked law school did Kachinsky graduate from anyway?

I'd rank James Lenk a little higher (worse) though.

Why do people hate Theresa Halbach's brother, Mike, so much?

What did I miss?

Bammer wrote:Why do people hate Theresa Halbach's brother, Mike, so much?

What did I miss?

Didn't he delete some messages on her voicemail because he had her password?

I thought that was her ex-boyfriend who deleted the messages, no?

Bammer wrote:I thought that was her ex-boyfriend who deleted the messages, no?

Oh wait, yeah

There are theories about him as far as hiding or planting evidence, but I feel you really have to dig deep. I haven't developed my own theories about what may or may not have happened ... I would consider myself a casual viewer of this show (documentary). Bearing in mind I had two newborns distracting me the entire time.

I just didn't see anything readily apparent that Mike Halbach did to make people hate him so much.

Bammer wrote:There are theories about him as far as hiding or planting evidence, but I feel you really have to dig deep. I haven't developed my own theories about what may or may not have happened ... I would consider myself a casual viewer of this show (documentary). Bearing in mind I had two newborns distracting me the entire time.

I just didn't see anything readily apparent that Mike Halbach did to make people hate him so much.

I wouldn't say I hated him, but it was frustrating how he was always so insistent on having Dassey/Avery found guilty regardless of what the evidence showed. I understand that it's probably common for family members to feel that way in his situation, and he was probably heavily influenced by his dealings with the police and the prosecution, but it was really frustrating to watch. Things like:

"If you just watch the confessions, there's out case."
"Have you seen the video?"
"No."

I'm sure he genuinely believed that Dassey/Avery were guilty, so the frustration should probably be aimed at the people who convinced him that they were, but it was still hard to hear him say that kind of stuff. And, while I don't suspect they had anything to do with the actual murder, the whole cell phone thing and searching the property without following proper procedures sure make him and the ex-boyfriend look awfully sketchy.

philpritchard wrote:

Bammer wrote:There are theories about him as far as hiding or planting evidence, but I feel you really have to dig deep. I haven't developed my own theories about what may or may not have happened ... I would consider myself a casual viewer of this show (documentary). Bearing in mind I had two newborns distracting me the entire time.

I just didn't see anything readily apparent that Mike Halbach did to make people hate him so much.

I wouldn't say I hated him, but it was frustrating how he was always so insistent on having Dassey/Avery found guilty regardless of what the evidence showed. I understand that it's probably common for family members to feel that way in his situation, and he was probably heavily influenced by his dealings with the police and the prosecution, but it was really frustrating to watch. Things like:

"If you just watch the confessions, there's out case."
"Have you seen the video?"
"No."

I'm sure he genuinely believed that Dassey/Avery were guilty, so the frustration should probably be aimed at the people who convinced him that they were, but it was still hard to hear him say that kind of stuff. And, while I don't suspect they had anything to do with the actual murder, the whole cell phone thing and searching the property without following proper procedures sure make him and the ex-boyfriend look awfully sketchy.

I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

My wife's reaction to the first episode, "Man, that ugly tree had a lot of branches."

numbers wrote:

philpritchard wrote:

Bammer wrote:There are theories about him as far as hiding or planting evidence, but I feel you really have to dig deep. I haven't developed my own theories about what may or may not have happened ... I would consider myself a casual viewer of this show (documentary). Bearing in mind I had two newborns distracting me the entire time.

I just didn't see anything readily apparent that Mike Halbach did to make people hate him so much.

I wouldn't say I hated him, but it was frustrating how he was always so insistent on having Dassey/Avery found guilty regardless of what the evidence showed. I understand that it's probably common for family members to feel that way in his situation, and he was probably heavily influenced by his dealings with the police and the prosecution, but it was really frustrating to watch. Things like:

"If you just watch the confessions, there's out case."
"Have you seen the video?"
"No."

I'm sure he genuinely believed that Dassey/Avery were guilty, so the frustration should probably be aimed at the people who convinced him that they were, but it was still hard to hear him say that kind of stuff. And, while I don't suspect they had anything to do with the actual murder, the whole cell phone thing and searching the property without following proper procedures sure make him and the ex-boyfriend look awfully sketchy.

I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

Same.

But I would like to believe the brother wasn't involved.

numbers wrote:I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

I kind of felt that way at first, but ultimately I think he was just kind of being used by the police. The phone thing is pretty creepy though, and completely inexplicable.

philpritchard wrote:

numbers wrote:I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

I kind of felt that way at first, but ultimately I think he was just kind of being used by the police. The phone thing is pretty creepy though, and completely inexplicable.

Exactly. Which is why I'm not ready to let him off the hook just yet. I'm not convinced he DID do it, either. But until there's a real explanation for the phone call business, he has to remain in the conversation, I think.

durdencommatyler wrote:

philpritchard wrote:

numbers wrote:I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

I kind of felt that way at first, but ultimately I think he was just kind of being used by the police. The phone thing is pretty creepy though, and completely inexplicable.

Exactly. Which is why I'm not ready to let him off the hook just yet. I'm not convinced he DID do it, either. But until there's a real explanation for the phone call business, he has to remain in the conversation, I think.

Yeah, SOMEONE did it. It was either him or the cops, right? Wasnt there something strange about the way he reacted to finding out she was missing?(sorry, I watched this thing over a month ago I'm starting to forget details.)

numbers wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

philpritchard wrote:

numbers wrote:I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

I kind of felt that way at first, but ultimately I think he was just kind of being used by the police. The phone thing is pretty creepy though, and completely inexplicable.

Exactly. Which is why I'm not ready to let him off the hook just yet. I'm not convinced he DID do it, either. But until there's a real explanation for the phone call business, he has to remain in the conversation, I think.

Yeah, SOMEONE did it. It was either him or the cops, right? Wasnt there something strange about the way he reacted to finding out she was missing?(sorry, I watched this thing over a month ago I'm starting to forget details.)

I definitely don't think the cops killed Teresa.

But there were a lot of weird things about the boyfriend's "involvement." Some of which were not discussed or barely touched on in the doc.

durdencommatyler wrote:

philpritchard wrote:

numbers wrote:I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

I kind of felt that way at first, but ultimately I think he was just kind of being used by the police. The phone thing is pretty creepy though, and completely inexplicable.

Exactly. Which is why I'm not ready to let him off the hook just yet. I'm not convinced he DID do it, either. But until there's a real explanation for the phone call business, he has to remain in the conversation, I think.

I think that's part of what made the whole thing so frustrating: the witnesses for the prosecution were caught lying on the stand so many times, and the jury still decided their case was solid enough to convict.

durdencommatyler wrote:

numbers wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

philpritchard wrote:

numbers wrote:I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

I kind of felt that way at first, but ultimately I think he was just kind of being used by the police. The phone thing is pretty creepy though, and completely inexplicable.

Exactly. Which is why I'm not ready to let him off the hook just yet. I'm not convinced he DID do it, either. But until there's a real explanation for the phone call business, he has to remain in the conversation, I think.

Yeah, SOMEONE did it. It was either him or the cops, right? Wasnt there something strange about the way he reacted to finding out she was missing?(sorry, I watched this thing over a month ago I'm starting to forget details.)

I definitely don't think the cops killed Teresa.

But there were a lot of weird things about the boyfriend's "involvement." Some of which were not discussed or barely touched on in the doc.

I worded that poorly, I was talking about the deletion of the voice mails not the actual murder. I dont think the cops did it, I just think they never looked into anyone other than Avery and manipulated and fabricated evidence to point in his direction.

philpritchard wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

philpritchard wrote:

numbers wrote:I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

I kind of felt that way at first, but ultimately I think he was just kind of being used by the police. The phone thing is pretty creepy though, and completely inexplicable.

Exactly. Which is why I'm not ready to let him off the hook just yet. I'm not convinced he DID do it, either. But until there's a real explanation for the phone call business, he has to remain in the conversation, I think.

I think that's part of what made the whole thing so frustrating: the witnesses for the prosecution were caught lying on the stand so many times, and the jury still decided their case was solid enough to convict.

Something was fishy about the jury deliberations.

numbers wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

numbers wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

philpritchard wrote:

numbers wrote:I'm not ready to say that boyfriend wasn't involved.

I kind of felt that way at first, but ultimately I think he was just kind of being used by the police. The phone thing is pretty creepy though, and completely inexplicable.

Exactly. Which is why I'm not ready to let him off the hook just yet. I'm not convinced he DID do it, either. But until there's a real explanation for the phone call business, he has to remain in the conversation, I think.

Yeah, SOMEONE did it. It was either him or the cops, right? Wasnt there something strange about the way he reacted to finding out she was missing?(sorry, I watched this thing over a month ago I'm starting to forget details.)

I definitely don't think the cops killed Teresa.

But there were a lot of weird things about the boyfriend's "involvement." Some of which were not discussed or barely touched on in the doc.

I worded that poorly, I was talking about the deletion of the voice mails not the actual murder. I dont think the cops did it, I just think they never looked into anyone other than Avery and manipulated and fabricated evidence to point in his direction.

Oh, gotcha. Yes. I agree. The ex-boyfriend and/or roommate and/or brother deleted the voicemail, absolutely. Maybe the cops did, but my money's on the ex.

Well never know, but it depends on what was on the voice mail. I could see the cops deleting if the voicemail proved that she was alive when she left the salvage yard.