Red Mosquito

elliseamos wrote:

doone wrote:Perhaps the kids need to stand outside gun shops protesting, yelling "baby killer" at every one who walks in the door. Maybe then your politicians will start listening to them.

If only there were a secretly recorded video of a gun shop owner explaining what he does with the unsold guns...

Lol. There are no unsold guns.

Bi_3 wrote:

elliseamos wrote:

LetMeSleep wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

elliseamos wrote:I have nothing to back this up directly, but:

Isn't the problem that gun makers get very lucrative contracts from our government (and others, looking at you middle east), which the gun manufacturers repay by filling the campaign coffers for those politicians that keep said cycle flowing? Eisenhower warned of the MIC, and that was almost 70 years ago now.

The gun companies arent that rich (market cap for S&W is like $1.2B, real MIC like Raytheon is around $65B). IMHO, it's the fear votes from white America's inability/refusal to come to grips with what it's done to black Americans.

Yep. And the cycle of arm yourselves in case of a police force state which then leads to me armed forces.

Ironic that the Black Panther activity in the late 60s came to redefine the 2nd amendment.

From s.s.'s nyt link:

"While the N.R.A. cuts relatively few checks to individual lawmakers — a fact that has been noted by The Tampa Bay Times, among others — it does devote tens of millions of dollars to ads backing its preferred candidates or criticizing its opponents, often with vividly alarmist messages about crime and self-defense."

Loosely what I'm getting at... and this is not to say they're the only group interested in maintaining a certain culture at home as well as through alliances abroad.

You're not wrong, you're just focusing on the middle man. What makes the NRA powerful? Fear of black retribution. (I have nothing to back that up except hours upon hours of conversations with people who own multiple guns.)

hey don't forget the Native Americans! From Wounded Knee in the 70's, that's the 1970's, up to just last year with the Water Protectors. The min Native Americans rally for anything (including changing of sports teams nicknames) white folk still get scared/angry/defensive.

Which is ironic, since one of the few times a well armed militia was formed for "defense" was the Sand Creek Massacre. Probably should have been re-written then.

Wow is this true?

MadTIGERmaN wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

elliseamos wrote:

LetMeSleep wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

elliseamos wrote:I have nothing to back this up directly, but:

Isn't the problem that gun makers get very lucrative contracts from our government (and others, looking at you middle east), which the gun manufacturers repay by filling the campaign coffers for those politicians that keep said cycle flowing? Eisenhower warned of the MIC, and that was almost 70 years ago now.

The gun companies arent that rich (market cap for S&W is like $1.2B, real MIC like Raytheon is around $65B). IMHO, it's the fear votes from white America's inability/refusal to come to grips with what it's done to black Americans.

Yep. And the cycle of arm yourselves in case of a police force state which then leads to me armed forces.

Ironic that the Black Panther activity in the late 60s came to redefine the 2nd amendment.

From s.s.'s nyt link:

"While the N.R.A. cuts relatively few checks to individual lawmakers — a fact that has been noted by The Tampa Bay Times, among others — it does devote tens of millions of dollars to ads backing its preferred candidates or criticizing its opponents, often with vividly alarmist messages about crime and self-defense."

Loosely what I'm getting at... and this is not to say they're the only group interested in maintaining a certain culture at home as well as through alliances abroad.

You're not wrong, you're just focusing on the middle man. What makes the NRA powerful? Fear of black retribution. (I have nothing to back that up except hours upon hours of conversations with people who own multiple guns.)

hey don't forget the Native Americans! From Wounded Knee in the 70's, that's the 1970's, up to just last year with the Water Protectors. The min Native Americans rally for anything (including changing of sports teams nicknames) white folk still get scared/angry/defensive.

Which is ironic, since one of the few times a well armed militia was formed for "defense" was the Sand Creek Massacre. Probably should have been re-written then.

"Fear of blacks" has been used more as an argument for gun control than gun rights, btw. See: The Black Panthers.

BurtReynolds wrote:Wow is this true?

sad

BurtReynolds wrote:

MadTIGERmaN wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

elliseamos wrote:

LetMeSleep wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

elliseamos wrote:I have nothing to back this up directly, but:

Isn't the problem that gun makers get very lucrative contracts from our government (and others, looking at you middle east), which the gun manufacturers repay by filling the campaign coffers for those politicians that keep said cycle flowing? Eisenhower warned of the MIC, and that was almost 70 years ago now.

The gun companies arent that rich (market cap for S&W is like $1.2B, real MIC like Raytheon is around $65B). IMHO, it's the fear votes from white America's inability/refusal to come to grips with what it's done to black Americans.

Yep. And the cycle of arm yourselves in case of a police force state which then leads to me armed forces.

Ironic that the Black Panther activity in the late 60s came to redefine the 2nd amendment.

From s.s.'s nyt link:

"While the N.R.A. cuts relatively few checks to individual lawmakers — a fact that has been noted by The Tampa Bay Times, among others — it does devote tens of millions of dollars to ads backing its preferred candidates or criticizing its opponents, often with vividly alarmist messages about crime and self-defense."

Loosely what I'm getting at... and this is not to say they're the only group interested in maintaining a certain culture at home as well as through alliances abroad.

You're not wrong, you're just focusing on the middle man. What makes the NRA powerful? Fear of black retribution. (I have nothing to back that up except hours upon hours of conversations with people who own multiple guns.)

hey don't forget the Native Americans! From Wounded Knee in the 70's, that's the 1970's, up to just last year with the Water Protectors. The min Native Americans rally for anything (including changing of sports teams nicknames) white folk still get scared/angry/defensive.

Which is ironic, since one of the few times a well armed militia was formed for "defense" was the Sand Creek Massacre. Probably should have been re-written then.

"Fear of blacks" has been used more as an argument for gun control than gun rights, btw. See: The Black Panthers.

Oh, not trying to get in an argument over which group has been used more or less for gun control, just saying, whites have been against Natives Americans have guns as well. And hell, thats what sparked the first Wounded Knee massacre. They tried to take a deaf mans gun, gun went off, all hell broke loose.

A.I.M.s been around almost as long as the Black Panthers, and can be just as controversial. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Indian_Movement

https://twitter.com/jonst0kes/status/96 ... 40513?s=20

How many tens of millions of guns are in private hands because they worried that they'd be banned some day?
Maybe take that off the table and see what we can compromise on. Otherwise, look forward to endless panic buying.

Delta Air Lines announces they are canceling a meeting contract they have with the NRA. In the grand scheme of things it's really not that big of a deal.
Georgia's Lt. Governor, and a lead candidate to become the GOP nominee later this year, announces he will no longer support a tax break on aviation fuel that was in the works. Of course Delta is HQed in Atlanta and is the main carrier out of the world's busiest airport and is the largest employer in the state. He says something about conservatives are tired about being bullied by corporations. Another candidate says he was never in support of the tax break to begin with. In an effort to out conservative each other another says he not only is against the tax break but would support a tax free holiday on guns and ammunition.

Biff Pocoroba wrote:Delta Air Lines announces they are canceling a meeting contract they have with the NRA. In the grand scheme of things it's really not that big of a deal.
Georgia's Lt. Governor, and a lead candidate to become the GOP nominee later this year, announces he will no longer support a tax break on aviation fuel that was in the works. Of course Delta is HQed in Atlanta and is the main carrier out of the world's busiest airport and is the largest employer in the state. He says something about conservatives are tired about being bullied by corporations. Another candidate says he was never in support of the tax break to begin with. In an effort to out conservative each other another says he not only is against the tax break but would support a tax free holiday on guns and ammunition.

This is a pretty dangerous precedent. Corporations virtual signaling and counter-viewpoint politicians punishing them for it... what a world.

Biff Pocoroba wrote:Delta Air Lines announces they are canceling a meeting contract they have with the NRA. In the grand scheme of things it's really not that big of a deal.
Georgia's Lt. Governor, and a lead candidate to become the GOP nominee later this year, announces he will no longer support a tax break on aviation fuel that was in the works. Of course Delta is HQed in Atlanta and is the main carrier out of the world's busiest airport and is the largest employer in the state. He says something about conservatives are tired about being bullied by corporations. Another candidate says he was never in support of the tax break to begin with. In an effort to out conservative each other another says he not only is against the tax break but would support a tax free holiday on guns and ammunition.

I read a lot of that too. Basically, Conservatives should not be punished for their beliefs, they should be rewarded. Do what we want and well give you tax breaks, but don't you dare stand against anything else we believe in or you wont get your tax breaks. Sure, Dems do the same thing, but this Georgia one really sounds like a giant hissy fit to score points with your core bass voters.

Also, Florida refused again to discuss any regulations on automatic weapons, but, the State Senate did approve a plan to arm teachers!
1 - has anyone ever even bothered to ask, teachers, if they are down with this? because the 8 I know not only are not down with this, 5 of them said they may think about no longer teaching if it comes to that point in Wisconsin.
2 - NYPD hits its targets 18% of the time... so lets let Teachers who will not be trained nearly as good have guns in a fire fight. This, is not a solution gun supporters, its not even a bandaid for fucks sake. Its just your way of selling more guns.

It's part of living in a very red state. Actually, the state itself is not necessarily very red but it's elected representatives generally are.
I have always associated the Republican party with big business as much as I have social conservatism. However as big business shifts to the left socially, particularly in the tech field, I can see it creating another rift in the GOP base. Look at the North Carolina bathroom bill and Indiana's religious freedom bill. Our governor vetoed similar bills solely because of the backlash. Georgia has a booming film industry and Atlanta is a strong candidate in the Amazon HQ2 race. There is a bill in the state legislature now to allow adoption agencies to refuse service to gay couples. I can't see that one actually becoming law either due to pressure from a big business fallout.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:score points with your core bass voters.

All my "Blue Lives Matter" facebook friends are now posting jokes about cowardly policemen.

You should post back with one of these:

bune wrote:You should post back with one of these:

Ya know if the Black Lives Matter group, were to start flying a black and white flag with a single red stripe for the blood shed on Americas Streets, the right-wingers would say that's disrespecting the flag. You cant change the colors to the flag! 'Merica is RED WHITE AND BLUE! Unless you wanna honor the Police than you can do black white and blue. Unless the police don't run into save kids from gun fire, then you should probably do black white and yeller?

meatwad wrote:

MadTIGERmaN wrote:score points with your core bass voters.

This was my favorite thing all day.

look, they have a point

MadTIGERmaN wrote:

Biff Pocoroba wrote:Delta Air Lines announces they are canceling a meeting contract they have with the NRA. In the grand scheme of things it's really not that big of a deal.
Georgia's Lt. Governor, and a lead candidate to become the GOP nominee later this year, announces he will no longer support a tax break on aviation fuel that was in the works. Of course Delta is HQed in Atlanta and is the main carrier out of the world's busiest airport and is the largest employer in the state. He says something about conservatives are tired about being bullied by corporations. Another candidate says he was never in support of the tax break to begin with. In an effort to out conservative each other another says he not only is against the tax break but would support a tax free holiday on guns and ammunition.

I read a lot of that too. Basically, Conservatives should not be punished for their beliefs, they should be rewarded. Do what we want and well give you tax breaks, but don't you dare stand against anything else we believe in or you wont get your tax breaks. Sure, Dems do the same thing, but this Georgia one really sounds like a giant hissy fit to score points with your core bass voters.

Also, Florida refused again to discuss any regulations on automatic weapons, but, the State Senate did approve a plan to arm teachers!
1 - has anyone ever even bothered to ask, teachers, if they are down with this? because the 8 I know not only are not down with this, 5 of them said they may think about no longer teaching if it comes to that point in Wisconsin.
2 - NYPD hits its targets 18% of the time... so lets let Teachers who will not be trained nearly as good have guns in a fire fight. This, is not a solution gun supporters, its not even a bandaid for fucks sake. Its just your way of selling more guns.

I'm a teacher, and I would also consider leaving the profession if this became the accepted plan. My school also happens to have two teachers who were in the military. They also hate this idea, particularly because they can't imagine how you would go about training average citizens for an active shooter situation. Time logged at a gun range doesn't exactly prepare you for those types of situations.

96583UP wrote:look, they have a point

Good post

Stardog Champion wrote:

MadTIGERmaN wrote:

Biff Pocoroba wrote:Delta Air Lines announces they are canceling a meeting contract they have with the NRA. In the grand scheme of things it's really not that big of a deal.
Georgia's Lt. Governor, and a lead candidate to become the GOP nominee later this year, announces he will no longer support a tax break on aviation fuel that was in the works. Of course Delta is HQed in Atlanta and is the main carrier out of the world's busiest airport and is the largest employer in the state. He says something about conservatives are tired about being bullied by corporations. Another candidate says he was never in support of the tax break to begin with. In an effort to out conservative each other another says he not only is against the tax break but would support a tax free holiday on guns and ammunition.

I read a lot of that too. Basically, Conservatives should not be punished for their beliefs, they should be rewarded. Do what we want and well give you tax breaks, but don't you dare stand against anything else we believe in or you wont get your tax breaks. Sure, Dems do the same thing, but this Georgia one really sounds like a giant hissy fit to score points with your core bass voters.

Also, Florida refused again to discuss any regulations on automatic weapons, but, the State Senate did approve a plan to arm teachers!
1 - has anyone ever even bothered to ask, teachers, if they are down with this? because the 8 I know not only are not down with this, 5 of them said they may think about no longer teaching if it comes to that point in Wisconsin.
2 - NYPD hits its targets 18% of the time... so lets let Teachers who will not be trained nearly as good have guns in a fire fight. This, is not a solution gun supporters, its not even a bandaid for fucks sake. Its just your way of selling more guns.

I'm a teacher, and I would also consider leaving the profession if this became the accepted plan. My school also happens to have two teachers who were in the military. They also hate this idea, particularly because they can't imagine how you would go about training average citizens for an active shooter situation. Time logged at a gun range doesn't exactly prepare you for those types of situations.

I understand this objection, and the idea that the run of the mill 1st grade teacher should be issued a pistol is insane. I don't think that is what the proposal really is.

There are at least 10 million people* in the US with concealed carry licenses that carry (presumably) every day. They are as a group less likely than police officers to be convicted of a crime. The only proposal for arming teachers that makes sense is to allow this small subset of teachers that also are licensed to carry on school grounds, which they are not currently allowed to in most places. Why is a concealed handgun in a classroom more dangerous than one in a store or an office, as they are every day in large swaths of the US?

*Vermont, Arizona, and others require no licensing for concealed carry. Vermont in particular is not awash in blood, despite this free license to pack heat.