Red Mosquito

That's a bit fucked up..she has him and the family to a weird kind of ransom that way...but hey, if it works for them.

The alternative could be the family living on without her, with all the baggage and guilt that may entail.

Also, once you have kids you really do put them first. He may get annoyed by it but he wouldn't want to be that other way.

LetMeSleep wrote:Also, once you have kids you really do put them first.

You should, anyway.

Regrettably, a great number of people don't.

First thought I had when I heard about James Foley was I'm sure his parents would have traded themselves in a heartbeat.

Probably not strictly on topic but I've often thought about the old concept of "honorable" suicide and how its completely rejected in modern times but maybe isn't so bad? I dunno its 4:30 AM and I'm just spitballing here...

Also, all the great minds who have killed themselves, often later in life... Whats that about?

Ego is strong for some.

Birds in Hell wrote:

LetMeSleep wrote:Also, once you have kids you really do put them first.

You should, anyway.

Regrettably, a great number of people don't.

have you found a suitable mate to endure your face for the rest of her life?

I don't know. I don't have kids or anything. I do have a partner that means everything to me. As crass and ignorant as it sounds, I can't imagine loving any child more than I love her. Of course, again, I don't have kids, don't want kids, don't ever plan on having them. But still it sure seems to me that the survivors are much more selfish (in most circumstances) than those that commit suicide.

durdencommatyler wrote:I don't know. I don't have kids or anything. I do have a partner that means everything to me. As crass and ignorant as it sounds, I can't imagine loving any child more than I love her. Of course, again, I don't have kids, don't want kids, don't ever plan on having them. But still it sure seems to me that the survivors are much more selfish (in most circumstances) than those that commit suicide.

I never wanted kids, either, and couldn't imagine loving a child the way other people tried to describe it to me. I didn't even really like children very much, and half of what people said about the experience sounded like hyperbole, anyway.

So my wife was scared as hell when she found out she was pregnant. She knew how I felt. She knew we'd agreed not to have any. But she told me anyway, and it's unreal how much that one sentence rewrote the entire world. It should be impossible. Maybe it is impossible. But it happens anyway. Even before all the other completely life-changing moments, that one second long declarative sentence rewrote my entire DNA.

There's no comparison to any other thing. Sorry. You just can't do it. It's like trying to describe dropping acid and flying kites while screwing and singing songs to someone who has been chained up in windowless solitary confinement their whole life. It's like if you went back in time and tried to explain to people from the Middle Ages how life would be in the 21st century.

Those kinds of statements offend some people. They used to annoy the shit out of me. But it is what it is.

The other side of this is that, for some people who deal with intense depression, their children can be the ticket to their survival. "I have to be there for my kids" is a feeling powerful beyond words. For others, though, or at other times in a person's life...it can encourage their darkest feelings about themselves. "My kids don't deserve to have to be burdened by me as I get older and feebler. I've done everything I can do to help them. I've got nothing else left to give, except for this one last simple act..."

McParadigm wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:I don't know. I don't have kids or anything. I do have a partner that means everything to me. As crass and ignorant as it sounds, I can't imagine loving any child more than I love her. Of course, again, I don't have kids, don't want kids, don't ever plan on having them. But still it sure seems to me that the survivors are much more selfish (in most circumstances) than those that commit suicide.

I never wanted kids, either, and couldn't imagine loving a child the way other people tried to describe it to me. I didn't even really like children very much, and half of what people said about the experience sounded like hyperbole, anyway.

So my wife was scared as hell when she found out she was pregnant. She knew how I felt. She knew we'd agreed not to have any. But she told me anyway, and it's unreal how much that one sentence rewrote the entire world. It should be impossible. Maybe it is impossible. But it happens anyway. Even before all the other completely life-changing moments, that one second long declarative sentence rewrote my entire DNA.

There's no comparison to any other thing. Sorry. You just can't do it. It's like trying to describe dropping acid and flying kites while screwing and singing songs to someone who has been chained up in windowless solitary confinement their whole life. It's like if you went back in time and tried to explain to people from the Middle Ages how life would be in the 21st century.

Those kinds of statements offend some people. They used to annoy the shit out of me. But it is what it is.

The other side of this is that, for some people who deal with intense depression, their children can be the ticket to their survival. "I have to be there for my kids" is a feeling powerful beyond words. For others, though, or at other times in a person's life...it can encourage their darkest feelings about themselves. "My kids don't deserve to have to be burdened by me as I get older and feebler. I've done everything I can do to help them. I've got nothing else left to give, except for this one last simple act..."

is this your version of 'hills like white elephants,' mcp?

Alex wrote: is this your version of 'hills like white elephants,' mcp?

The answer might surprise you

McParadigm wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:I don't know. I don't have kids or anything. I do have a partner that means everything to me. As crass and ignorant as it sounds, I can't imagine loving any child more than I love her. Of course, again, I don't have kids, don't want kids, don't ever plan on having them. But still it sure seems to me that the survivors are much more selfish (in most circumstances) than those that commit suicide.

I never wanted kids, either, and couldn't imagine loving a child the way other people tried to describe it to me. I didn't even really like children very much, and half of what people said about the experience sounded like hyperbole, anyway.

So my wife was scared as hell when she found out she was pregnant. She knew how I felt. She knew we'd agreed not to have any. But she told me anyway, and it's unreal how much that one sentence rewrote the entire world. It should be impossible. Maybe it is impossible. But it happens anyway. Even before all the other completely life-changing moments, that one second long declarative sentence rewrote my entire DNA.

There's no comparison to any other thing. Sorry. You just can't do it. It's like trying to describe dropping acid and flying kites while screwing and singing songs to someone who has been chained up in windowless solitary confinement their whole life. It's like if you went back in time and tried to explain to people from the Middle Ages how life would be in the 21st century.

Those kinds of statements offend some people. They used to annoy the shit out of me. But it is what it is.

100%.

Birds in Hell wrote:

McParadigm wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:I don't know. I don't have kids or anything. I do have a partner that means everything to me. As crass and ignorant as it sounds, I can't imagine loving any child more than I love her. Of course, again, I don't have kids, don't want kids, don't ever plan on having them. But still it sure seems to me that the survivors are much more selfish (in most circumstances) than those that commit suicide.

I never wanted kids, either, and couldn't imagine loving a child the way other people tried to describe it to me. I didn't even really like children very much, and half of what people said about the experience sounded like hyperbole, anyway.

So my wife was scared as hell when she found out she was pregnant. She knew how I felt. She knew we'd agreed not to have any. But she told me anyway, and it's unreal how much that one sentence rewrote the entire world. It should be impossible. Maybe it is impossible. But it happens anyway. Even before all the other completely life-changing moments, that one second long declarative sentence rewrote my entire DNA.

There's no comparison to any other thing. Sorry. You just can't do it. It's like trying to describe dropping acid and flying kites while screwing and singing songs to someone who has been chained up in windowless solitary confinement their whole life. It's like if you went back in time and tried to explain to people from the Middle Ages how life would be in the 21st century.

Those kinds of statements offend some people. They used to annoy the shit out of me. But it is what it is.

100%.

I've seen enough of this in my life to believe it 100%. Even if I've never felt it or understood it. That's why I tried to qualify my statement.

theplatypus wrote:

Alex wrote: is this your version of 'hills like white elephants,' mcp?

The answer might surprise you

Q: Why did Ernest Hemingway cross the road?

A: The houses were tall and poorly painted. She was playing with her long black hair, twisting it up and up until it spilled down her shoulders and then she would start twisting it again. I ate the last of my cheese and walked to the middle and waited for her to join me there. I didn't care if they saw.

That will go down as my favorite joke I will ever tell that no one will like.

i liked it

I FUCKING LOVED it. I read it to three people this afternoon and laughed like an asshole all three times.

durdencommatyler wrote:I read it to three people this afternoon and laughed like an asshole all three times.

It's the only reasonable way to laugh at a joke like that.

I think the insertion of parenthood as an aspect to this discussion is an interesting one, because to me it presents a bit of an analogy.


I don't doubt that having/raising children is something that you can really comprehend without experiencing.

But y'know what? Neither is being in so dark a place that you decide your best option is to just end it all. So the same way the opinions of the childless are generally disregarded by the parents of the world (and I don't see a problem with this), I find the opinions of those who have never dealt with/faced serious, crippling depression to be every bit as worthless. If you can't speak to it first hand, just shut the fuck up, because odds are you're going to look like an idiot.