Red Mosquito

verb_to_trust wrote:They should write some new songs people will like, it would fix a lot of problems...

haha get it, "fix"

Stone or Mike should get Dave A to play on their demos. That should get some charge back up Ed. also they have to not care too much. Just get in a room and jam and go with their instincts. Worse that can happen is they release a bad album which they then ignore for the rest of the band's lifetime.

LetMeSleep wrote:Stone or Mike should get Dave A to play on their demos. That should get some charge back up Ed. also they have to not care too much. Just get in a room and jam and go with their instincts. Worse that can happen is they release a bad album which they then ignore for the rest of the band's lifetime.

Like they do with Binaural !!!!

stip wrote:

theplatypus wrote:

stip wrote:Otherwise they seem to try and play the songs that create the best possible concert experience. That's not pandering.

Yes. Yes, it is.

No, no it isn't. It would be pandering if they were sick of those songs and didn't feel like playing them anymore, or, if by playing them, they were not doing what they wanted to do.

Ed has said that they would be playing different types of setlists if they weren't doing the whole arena thing. I'm sure they are sick of playing Even Flow but I doubt they get bored of playing to 10-20,000 people. That has to be fun and they are right to enjoy it. I just think people here probably envisaged them doing something else.

But when I look at it (admittedly in small selective sample size in 85 seconds) - the big acts that have gone the arena / poor album way are bands - U2/Chilis/Rolling Stones while the solo acts have usually been a bit classier in their outros - Neil Young and Bob. Bruce Springsteen seems to manage something in between.

cutuphalfdead wrote:

dprival78 wrote:

stip wrote:

theplatypus wrote:

stip wrote:

theplatypus wrote:

stip wrote:Otherwise they seem to try and play the songs that create the best possible concert experience. That's not pandering.

Yes. Yes, it is.

No, not it isn't. It would be pandering if they were sick of those songs and didn't feel like playing them anymore, or, if by playing them, they were not doing what they wanted to do. If Pearl Jam likes playing the songs that they play, and that the songs they don't play they tend to not play because they either don't enjoy them as much or find that the songs detract from the concert experience they want to create that's not pandering.

Don't make me dig out that quote from the PJ20 outtakes where Ed says he wishes they could be more like Neil Young and play whatever they want without worrying what the fans will think.

that would certainly shut me partially up

he definitely says that. that was one of the most disappointing things to come out of that documentary.

It's true.

It's a bit depressing, but I think it's a good sign. There's some creative struggle/need left in there.

They lost their mystique after Binaural and 2000 tour.

I pine for the days when we knew little about the band other than their music and their live shows.

Many of us, including me, wanted more. I guess more 'access' or something.

The 2000 bootlegs and YouTube/information sharing age changed all that. I love the bootlegs, but it changed the aura they had IMO.

I miss the mystique. I miss the feeling of when SVT came out and it blew my mind because there was so little footage at the time.

Everyone changes but I don't feel like they'll ever surprise me again. I hope I'm wrong.

injuddstree wrote:They lost their mystique after Binaural and 2000 tour.

I pine for the days when we knew little about the band other than their music and their live shows.

Many of us, including me, wanted more. I guess more 'access' or something.

The 2000 bootlegs and YouTube/information sharing age changed all that. I love the bootlegs, but it changed the aura they had IMO.

I miss the mystique. I miss the feeling of when SVT came out and it blew my mind because there was so little footage at the time.

Everyone changes but I don't feel like they'll ever surprise me again. I hope I'm wrong.

Good (first) post - I agree with all of this. I remember squinting at 320x240 resolution VGA clips of the band playing for 30 seconds. I also blame myself for over-eating on Pearl Jam.

injuddstree wrote:They lost their mystique after Binaural and 2000 tour.

I pine for the days when we knew little about the band other than their music and their live shows.

Many of us, including me, wanted more. I guess more 'access' or something.

The 2000 bootlegs and YouTube/information sharing age changed all that. I love the bootlegs, but it changed the aura they had IMO.

I miss the mystique. I miss the feeling of when SVT came out and it blew my mind because there was so little footage at the time.

Everyone changes but I don't feel like they'll ever surprise me again. I hope I'm wrong.

welcome to the board.

Is this a pearl jam problem or an internet problem?

I think it's mostly a Pearl Jam "problem". It's definitely become harder to maintain that mystique, fully agreed. But if you ask me, they've consciously stepped away from it. I mean, look at a band like Tool. I'm not the biggest fan, but they still have that mystique.

injuddstree wrote:They lost their mystique after Binaural and 2000 tour.

I pine for the days when we knew little about the band other than their music and their live shows.

Many of us, including me, wanted more. I guess more 'access' or something.

The 2000 bootlegs and YouTube/information sharing age changed all that. I love the bootlegs, but it changed the aura they had IMO.

I miss the mystique. I miss the feeling of when SVT came out and it blew my mind because there was so little footage at the time.

Everyone changes but I don't feel like they'll ever surprise me again. I hope I'm wrong.

But that's your own fault. But I'm sure you get that, right?

Angus wrote:I think it's mostly a Pearl Jam "problem". It's definitely become harder to maintain that mystique, fully agreed. But if you ask me, they've consciously stepped away from it. I mean, look at a band like Tool. I'm not the biggest fan, but they still have that mystique.

i wonder if tool is the exception.

injuddstree wrote:They lost their mystique after Binaural and 2000 tour.

I pine for the days when we knew little about the band other than their music and their live shows.

Many of us, including me, wanted more. I guess more 'access' or something.

The 2000 bootlegs and YouTube/information sharing age changed all that. I love the bootlegs, but it changed the aura they had IMO.

I miss the mystique. I miss the feeling of when SVT came out and it blew my mind because there was so little footage at the time.

Everyone changes but I don't feel like they'll ever surprise me again. I hope I'm wrong.

wait until eddie vedder finally releases his ecstasy album

i get not wanting to have your face all over the place, but is "mystique" something a band should try to achieve? like "we shouldnt do the who tribute show on tv, it will ruin our mystique". thats lame.

Tuolumne wrote:

injuddstree wrote:They lost their mystique after Binaural and 2000 tour.

I pine for the days when we knew little about the band other than their music and their live shows.

Many of us, including me, wanted more. I guess more 'access' or something.

The 2000 bootlegs and YouTube/information sharing age changed all that. I love the bootlegs, but it changed the aura they had IMO.

I miss the mystique. I miss the feeling of when SVT came out and it blew my mind because there was so little footage at the time.

Everyone changes but I don't feel like they'll ever surprise me again. I hope I'm wrong.

But that's your own fault. But I'm sure you get that, right?

Yeah for sure, it's just how I feel.

There was something awesome about not knowing so much about them, even thought I felt like I knew all of their songs and best soundboard bootlegs very intimately. Of course people are going to know more about the band as they get older, the longer a band is around the more you know about them.

I don't know if I'm articulating well enough to get my point across. I guess I just miss the "unknown" about Pearl Jam. It feels like there are no surprises left, like I said earlier.

The only other band I felt the same way about was REM. And we know what happened there.

I don't want them to disband but I don't know what more else the band Pearl Jam can do. That's just my opinion, and I hope the next album blows me away and proves me wrong.

warehouse wrote:

injuddstree wrote:They lost their mystique after Binaural and 2000 tour.

I pine for the days when we knew little about the band other than their music and their live shows.

Many of us, including me, wanted more. I guess more 'access' or something.

The 2000 bootlegs and YouTube/information sharing age changed all that. I love the bootlegs, but it changed the aura they had IMO.

I miss the mystique. I miss the feeling of when SVT came out and it blew my mind because there was so little footage at the time.

Everyone changes but I don't feel like they'll ever surprise me again. I hope I'm wrong.

wait until eddie vedder finally releases his ecstasy album

i get not wanting to have your face all over the place, but is "mystique" something a band should try to achieve? like "we shouldnt do the who tribute show on tv, it will ruin our mystique". thats lame.

I get your point - they shouldn't try to have mystique or aura. If it was forced it would be terrible. It used to just come naturally.

It's probably just me!

I really don't get this 'mystique' thing. I just don't see how it changes anything when it comes to enjoying the music (or not enjoying it).

Heathen wrote:I really don't get this 'mystique' thing. I just don't see how it changes anything when it comes to enjoying the music (or not enjoying it).

It doesn’t really come in when you love the music. Although it made me extra proud of the band. But when I started to like their new output a whole lot less than before, you look for other things that attracted you to the band. And for me the disappearing mystique factor certainly plays a role in that. And I agree a bit with stip that Tool might be an exception. And I also agree that maybe it’s not that important. But for me, and many of us, they raised the bar that high during the 94 -> 00/03/05 (depending where you see “the end”), that anything that fails to live up to that standard will be seen as a failure.

Angus wrote:

Heathen wrote:I really don't get this 'mystique' thing. I just don't see how it changes anything when it comes to enjoying the music (or not enjoying it).

It doesn’t really come in when you love the music. Although it made me extra proud of the band. But when I started to like their new output a whole lot less than before, you look for other things that attracted you to the band. And for me the disappearing mystique factor certainly plays a role in that. And I agree a bit with stip that Tool might be an exception. And I also agree that maybe it’s not that important. But for me, and many of us, they raised the bar that high during the 94 -> 00/03/05 (depending where you see “the end”), that anything that fails to live up to that standard will be seen as a failure.

I am not so convinced we've all seen the end yet. A lot depends on this new album, mostly because it has been so long since the last and there's nothing out there to suggest they'll be in a hurry for a follow up. But in the end, and it just may be my perspective, but this is a band that had 8 great studio albums (everything from Ten through s/t) and one good album (Backspacer). That it was good not great is a bit of a disappointment given their history, but I am not willing to pack it in with them just for that, and the fact that they are starting to make Rage Against the Machine look like an album making machine.

Heathen wrote:I really don't get this 'mystique' thing. I just don't see how it changes anything when it comes to enjoying the music (or not enjoying it).

I get the mystique thing. If Led Zeppelin kept putting out records they would have lost they mystique. Me and many other fans were partly drawn to Pearl Jam because of the mystique. I remember seeing my first Pearl Jam show in 1996 and feeling that "space cadete glow" to just be in the same room as Eddie Vedder.

Pearl Jam exists well beyond the mystique because of the quality of their live performance and their ideals, but I think that fans who enjoy Pearl Jam mainly on a "head" level instead of full on experience have a harder time with the change.

Playing the stadium shows in Australia is the bands biggest mistake in my opinion. Those people who've given Pearl Jam some of their best shows get some football stadium shows?! That isn't the band I grew up loving and it still shocks me that they care so much about playing to as many people as they can in the shortest amount of shows.

In 2000 Stone said that it isn't until the 10th show of a tour that they really get heated up and now by the 10th show the tour is wrapping up.

Hatfield wrote:In 2000 Stone said that it isn't until the 10th show of a tour that they really get heated up and now by the 10th show the tour is wrapping up.

To me, this sounds like Stone Gossard talking about touring a new album, and getting kinks out of the new songs and with that getting into rhythm as a band. They haven't toured a new album in a while, so I am not sure that this would still apply in Stone's mind.

I do agree, however, that they should consider longer tours, especially since it seems like a big waste of both their resources and natural resources to get all that gear and the touring machine roaring for a few shows here and there every year.

liebzz wrote:

Hatfield wrote:In 2000 Stone said that it isn't until the 10th show of a tour that they really get heated up and now by the 10th show the tour is wrapping up.

To me, this sounds like Stone Gossard talking about touring a new album, and getting kinks out of the new songs and with that getting into rhythm as a band. They haven't toured a new album in a while, so I am not sure that this would still apply in Stone's mind.

I do agree, however, that they should consider longer tours, especially since it seems like a big waste of both their resources and natural resources to get all that gear and the touring machine roaring for a few shows here and there every year.

Not if those shows include big festivals and massive arenas to maximize the buck. It probably doesnt do them good to go to out of the way shows like they used to do with ticket prices at $50