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Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 7:58 pm
by Val
Ms Harmless wrote:stip wrote:one of the reasons the drums may not be standing out to me as problematic is the you are style electric/robotic sheen on the guitars. it does all feel of a piece. its not like the rest of the song is aiming for a naturalism that the druns get in the way off
I almost certainly would not have pegged them as a possible issue if not for the conversations here
same
I'm actually wondering if they'll sound more natural on other songs, making this one sound more purposefully "You Are" (or DOTC in terms of artificial drums) in comparison; it's interesting that acoustic drums only start to dominate in DOTC part way through, a good portion of the beginning is drum machine / samples, and yet the vast majority here don't see that as a negative; is that in part because there are different drum-mixing approaches across the album? so we can allow ourselves a little electronic as a treat?
It’s because DOTC is a different genre of song
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:00 pm
by Ms Harmless
Val wrote:Ms Harmless wrote:stip wrote:one of the reasons the drums may not be standing out to me as problematic is the you are style electric/robotic sheen on the guitars. it does all feel of a piece. its not like the rest of the song is aiming for a naturalism that the druns get in the way off
I almost certainly would not have pegged them as a possible issue if not for the conversations here
same
I'm actually wondering if they'll sound more natural on other songs, making this one sound more purposefully "You Are" (or DOTC in terms of artificial drums) in comparison; it's interesting that acoustic drums only start to dominate in DOTC part way through, a good portion of the beginning is drum machine / samples, and yet the vast majority here don't see that as a negative; is that in part because there are different drum-mixing approaches across the album? so we can allow ourselves a little electronic as a treat?
It’s because DOTC is a different genre of song
hmm, I'd argue it's a different approach to the same genre; it's certainly not trying to be so rawktastic, a bit more pared down
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:01 pm
by Ms Harmless
in any case, it's not like there's no precedent for this type of song having artificial drums
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:06 pm
by Val
It’s almost a foray into Daft Punk territory.
Almost.
It’s like when Tame Impala unexpectedly rolled out Let It Happen, only PJ didn’t go all the way in like Tame, but sort of flirted with the idea.
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:12 pm
by Ms Harmless
I see it as a fairly standard PJ song with some electronic elements that are aesthetically different for PJ (like most of their cross-genre experiments, I think it has the flavour of Talking Heads or Daft Punk, without, as you say, taking it all the way over into that territory)
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:15 pm
by Val
Nothing standard about it, it’s a standout.
How I see it anyway
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:22 pm
by Ms Harmless
part of what bothers me about Backspacer is that it just doesn't (mostly) sound like the way they described it (an experiment in fun new wave / post-punk); I think Paramore released a better Backspacer last year and in After Laughter
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:23 pm
by digster
I don't really get the impression Dark Matter is trying to sell itself, for lack of a better term, in its presentation as being electronic or artificial in the way DOTC or You Are is. It feels like a pretty straightforward rock song.
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:24 pm
by RockPusher
digster wrote:I don't really get the impression Dark Matter is trying to sell itself, for lack of a better term, in its presentation as being electronic or artificial in the way DOTC or You Are is. It feels like a pretty straightforward rock song.
Sure but the You Are drum machine guitar effect is evident right away to anyone who has loved You Are (for me it's a standout on Riot Act).
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:26 pm
by Val
RockPusher wrote:digster wrote:I don't really get the impression Dark Matter is trying to sell itself, for lack of a better term, in its presentation as being electronic or artificial in the way DOTC or You Are is. It feels like a pretty straightforward rock song.
Sure but the You Are drum machine guitar effect is evident right away to anyone who has loved You Are (for me it's a standout on Riot Act).
You Are is what you’d call experimental.
DM isn’t that, it’s a straight banger
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:26 pm
by tragabigzanda
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:27 pm
by digster
RockPusher wrote:digster wrote:I don't really get the impression Dark Matter is trying to sell itself, for lack of a better term, in its presentation as being electronic or artificial in the way DOTC or You Are is. It feels like a pretty straightforward rock song.
Sure but the You Are drum machine guitar effect is evident right away to anyone who has loved You Are (for me it's a standout on Riot Act).
Yeah, it's there, but it feels pretty secondary to the (imo, kind of drab) barre chord riff. I wonder if this song would have been a bigger hit for me if they emphasized that aspect of the song harder than what they ended up doing.
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:30 pm
by Ms Harmless
there's a lot of polished straightforward rock songs out there, and there's also a lot of very live-sounding rock songs but for the drums (a lot of The Cure, or Radiohead, or 1979 by The Smashing Pumpkins, or We're in This Together Now by NIN, or the Big Yellow Taxi cover by Counting Crows)
I'm not really comparing this song to any of those as a whole; I'm just saying that this "slightly false drum sound" is neither a shocking and novel 2024 phenomenon nor a deal-breaking tragedy for yours truly
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:30 pm
by tragabigzanda
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:33 pm
by Ms Harmless
digster wrote:RockPusher wrote:digster wrote:I don't really get the impression Dark Matter is trying to sell itself, for lack of a better term, in its presentation as being electronic or artificial in the way DOTC or You Are is. It feels like a pretty straightforward rock song.
Sure but the You Are drum machine guitar effect is evident right away to anyone who has loved You Are (for me it's a standout on Riot Act).
Yeah, it's there, but it feels pretty secondary to the (imo, kind of drab) barre chord riff. I wonder if this song would have been a bigger hit for me if they emphasized that aspect of the song harder than what they ended up doing.
the first time I heard it I was annoyed that Matt never opens the hi-hat for a noisy chorus; I kind of get it now, it's a valid aesthetic choice, but I don't see it as super wildly experimental; it's a mid-tempo road trip rock song with a little bit of quirk, which doesn't "take off" like most road trip rock songs might
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:44 pm
by Strat
tragabigzanda wrote:I don’t even think it’s the You Are drum machine effect, pretty sure it’s just a hard tremolo
I can't wait for the Ridleybradabkir (whatever) version of dark matter (album) comes out
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:47 pm
by coptheriotact
tragabigzanda wrote:Strat wrote:tragabigzanda wrote:elliseamos wrote:Val wrote:Just listened to it in my car again and the enjoyment level hasn’t dropped.
Such a good rock song and the performance is top notch
This has been my experience.
Trag you're currently at 2 or 1?
I'm at a 2.
Only based on production and nothing about the song itself which i think you actually like?
You're a WEIRD GUY ACE
I just can’t get past it
Pearl Jam makes Pearl Jam songs , for me, the main variable is the sound, that IS the music after all. the difference with DM is the side chained sucking drums that cut through the whole track, which is not the same as the drums being the loudest because the dynamics were kept intact, it’s also the reason you can only hear Jeff’s bass buzz in the top end.
The song itself is fine and I’ll be happy to hear it live
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 8:58 pm
by E.H. Ruddock
tragabigzanda wrote:I don’t even think it’s the You Are drum machine effect, pretty sure it’s just a hard tremolo
Tremolé
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 9:03 pm
by stip
Ms Harmless wrote:stip wrote:one of the reasons the drums may not be standing out to me as problematic is the you are style electric/robotic sheen on the guitars. it does all feel of a piece. its not like the rest of the song is aiming for a naturalism that the druns get in the way off
I almost certainly would not have pegged them as a possible issue if not for the conversations here
same
I'm actually wondering if they'll sound more natural on other songs, making this one sound more purposefully "You Are" (or DOTC in terms of artificial drums) in comparison; it's interesting that acoustic drums only start to dominate in DOTC part way through, a good portion of the beginning is drum machine / samples, and yet the vast majority here don't see that as a negative; is that in part because there are different drum-mixing approaches across the album? so we can allow ourselves a little electronic as a treat?
RMers can't have nice things. You know that.
Re: Dark Matter (song)
Posted: Sat February 24, 2024 9:06 pm
by Ms Harmless
stip wrote:Ms Harmless wrote:stip wrote:one of the reasons the drums may not be standing out to me as problematic is the you are style electric/robotic sheen on the guitars. it does all feel of a piece. its not like the rest of the song is aiming for a naturalism that the druns get in the way off
I almost certainly would not have pegged them as a possible issue if not for the conversations here
same
I'm actually wondering if they'll sound more natural on other songs, making this one sound more purposefully "You Are" (or DOTC in terms of artificial drums) in comparison; it's interesting that acoustic drums only start to dominate in DOTC part way through, a good portion of the beginning is drum machine / samples, and yet the vast majority here don't see that as a negative; is that in part because there are different drum-mixing approaches across the album? so we can allow ourselves a little electronic as a treat?
RMers can't have nice things. You know that.
we have you Stip!