Red Mosquito

I know there's a tendency across all sports to deify legends of previous generations and assume that current players simply can't compare, but Ovechkin is easily among the top five pure goal-scorers of all-time... and I would say you could make a case for him as the best.

philpritchard wrote:I know there's a tendency across all sports to deify legends of previous generations and assume that current players simply can't compare, but Ovechkin is easily among the top five pure goal-scorers of all-time... and I would say you could make a case for him as the best.

I think Ovy has too many other facets to his game. He skates very well, he can hit. Now Brett Hull, all he could do was shoot and score. Couldn't skate worth shit but somehow got there. Could hit, couldn't fight. Great interview though.

surfndestroy wrote:

philpritchard wrote:I know there's a tendency across all sports to deify legends of previous generations and assume that current players simply can't compare, but Ovechkin is easily among the top five pure goal-scorers of all-time... and I would say you could make a case for him as the best.

I think Ovy has too many other facets to his game. He skates very well, he can hit. Now Brett Hull, all he could do was shoot and score. Couldn't skate worth shit but somehow got there. Could hit, couldn't fight. Great interview though.

Yeah, maybe "pure goal-scorer" wasn't the right term. Maybe just "goal-scorer". He's matching the output of some of the most prolific scorers of all time in a significantly lower offensive environment.

the best players now are leagues better than the best players them. The old greats probably wouldn't even be good in this league.

Dev wrote:the best players now are leagues better than the best players them. The old greats probably wouldn't even be good in this league.

That's pretty much true in every sport, which is why I think it's good to compare a player's dominance to others from his era... which is also why I think Ovechkin stacks up well against pretty much any of the historically dominant goal-scorers.

philpritchard wrote:

Dev wrote:the best players now are leagues better than the best players them. The old greats probably wouldn't even be good in this league.

That's pretty much true in every sport, which is why I think it's good to compare a player's dominance to others from his era... which is also why I think Ovechkin stacks up well against pretty much any of the historically dominant goal-scorers.

makes sense, I guess.

philpritchard wrote:I know there's a tendency across all sports to deify legends of previous generations and assume that current players simply can't compare, but Ovechkin is easily among the top five pure goal-scorers of all-time... and I would say you could make a case for him as the best.

Agree with you on both points here. Personally, I think Jagr's career is more impressive than Gordie Howe's, but it's a minority opinion among hockey fans for the same reason.

chuck taylor wrote:

philpritchard wrote:I know there's a tendency across all sports to deify legends of previous generations and assume that current players simply can't compare, but Ovechkin is easily among the top five pure goal-scorers of all-time... and I would say you could make a case for him as the best.

Agree with you on both points here. Personally, I think Jagr's career is more impressive than Gordie Howe's, but it's a minority opinion among hockey fans for the same reason.

I think Jagr's career has been undersold. But this is silly.

@SkitchP wrote:

chuck taylor wrote:

philpritchard wrote:I know there's a tendency across all sports to deify legends of previous generations and assume that current players simply can't compare, but Ovechkin is easily among the top five pure goal-scorers of all-time... and I would say you could make a case for him as the best.

Agree with you on both points here. Personally, I think Jagr's career is more impressive than Gordie Howe's, but it's a minority opinion among hockey fans for the same reason.

I think Jagr's career has been undersold. But this is silly.

And that's what most other hockey fans would say, as well. I know I'm in the minority, but I don't mind - I still think Jagr's career in the international era is more impressive.

Fuck You Jobu wrote:

chuck taylor wrote:

E.H. Ruddock wrote:

Dev wrote:Did you guys see that Ovechkin goal?

It was beautiful

He's now at 501 in 801 games. Insane for this era.

Hossa is now 7 away.

If he picks up the pace a little he should get there soon. His shooting percentage is really low so far this season.

That win streak was fun.

chuck taylor wrote:

@SkitchP wrote:

chuck taylor wrote:

philpritchard wrote:I know there's a tendency across all sports to deify legends of previous generations and assume that current players simply can't compare, but Ovechkin is easily among the top five pure goal-scorers of all-time... and I would say you could make a case for him as the best.

Agree with you on both points here. Personally, I think Jagr's career is more impressive than Gordie Howe's, but it's a minority opinion among hockey fans for the same reason.

I think Jagr's career has been undersold. But this is silly.

And that's what most other hockey fans would say, as well. I know I'm in the minority, but I don't mind - I still think Jagr's career in the international era is more impressive.

I think the main thing that separates them is that Howe was just so much more dominant in his time. The could see Jagr being #5 all-time behind Orr, Gretzky, Lemieux and Howe (in whatever order), but I don't think he's quite at their level.

Something I noticed yesterday: Jagr is already the highest-scoring 43-year-old of all time. He's just 9 points away from Howe's 43+ record... set when he was 51! I often think of how disappointing it is that Jagr spent those years in the KHL and missed basically two full seasons to lock-outs, but Howe also had over 500 points in six seasons in the WHA, all after he turned 45.

philpritchard wrote:

chuck taylor wrote:

@SkitchP wrote:

chuck taylor wrote:

philpritchard wrote:I know there's a tendency across all sports to deify legends of previous generations and assume that current players simply can't compare, but Ovechkin is easily among the top five pure goal-scorers of all-time... and I would say you could make a case for him as the best.

Agree with you on both points here. Personally, I think Jagr's career is more impressive than Gordie Howe's, but it's a minority opinion among hockey fans for the same reason.

I think Jagr's career has been undersold. But this is silly.

And that's what most other hockey fans would say, as well. I know I'm in the minority, but I don't mind - I still think Jagr's career in the international era is more impressive.

I think the main thing that separates them is that Howe was just so much more dominant in his time. The could see Jagr being #5 all-time behind Orr, Gretzky, Lemieux and Howe (in whatever order), but I don't think he's quite at their level.

Something I noticed yesterday: Jagr is already the highest-scoring 43-year-old of all time. He's just 9 points away from Howe's 43+ record... set when he was 51! I often think of how disappointing it is that Jagr spent those years in the KHL and missed basically two full seasons to lock-outs, but Howe also had over 500 points in six seasons in the WHA, all after he turned 45.

Yea, Howe did stand out more relative to his peers. Howe and Jagr both won 4 consecutive Art Ross trophies at their peak, which I find to be a funny little coincidence. Jagr also had some really dominant seasons, including winning an Art Ross after playing in only 63 of 82 games. He has 5 Art Ross trophies in total, yet only picked up the Hart once.

In the end, it's just really difficult to compare players in such disparate eras - I will always think it to be much harder to stand out from the pack in the modern NHL than it was back in the day. Regardless, I'm looking forward to Jagr passing Hull on the all-time goals list!!

I think the other thing that makes Howe so impressive is the lack of medical knowledge of the era, and protective gear. For him to have that longevity playing through concussions and lord knows what else is pretty amazing.

Are what the Blackhawks are doing now more impressive than what the Oilers and Islanders did in the 80's?

southp wrote:

philpritchard wrote:

southp wrote:

Dev wrote:terrible officiating in this montreal stars game. love how the stars came back and scored again after the good goal was called off.

The no goal was right just shouldn't have been a penalty too. Arghh... I can't think about the Habs right now. Worst December of any team in the NHL. It feels so Leaf-y.

We'll see about that. The real question is whether they can keep sucking until mid-February, fall out of the playoffs and then mount a spectacular late-season run to finish one point out of the last playoff spot. THAT is Leaf-y.

Step one complete.

pnjguy wrote:Are what the Blackhawks are doing now more impressive than what the Oilers and Islanders did in the 80's?

Yes because of the salary cap...I mean, can you imagine the Oilers trying to keep Gretzky/Messier/Anderson/Kurri/Coffey/Fuhr together in this era?

Craig Anderson is such a horrible goalie. Can't forget last year when Hammond saved the season only to be pulled for the play-offs and witness Anderson throw the season away.

Luongo shuts out the Blackhawks to move into 10th place on the career shutouts list. The Panthers defense looks really good this year.

malkin looked like he had a few good shifts today