Red Mosquito

Lament wrote:it's not these records aren't great, they just weren't impactful).

the public's impression that there's not a wealth of great records they left in their wake.

Lament wrote:I think so much of their legacy is because they DID stay together and keep pushing forward, and not because they made culturally significant records (once again, like digster pointed out, it's not these records aren't great, they just weren't impactful).

aurynsdad wrote:

Lament wrote:it's not these records aren't great, they just weren't impactful).

They weren't impactful on some people evidently. But I really don't understand how anyone could ever say a record is great AND it doesn't make an impact. What?

stip wrote:Basically some people are mad/frustrated/disappointed that pearl jam has not made the record they want them to make, and are mistaking this for a failure rather than a choice.

Lament wrote:I think so much of their legacy is because they DID stay together and keep pushing forward, and not because they made culturally significant records (once again, like digster pointed out, it's not these records aren't great, they just weren't impactful).

digster wrote:

stip wrote:Basically some people are mad/frustrated/disappointed that pearl jam has not made the record they want them to make, and are mistaking this for a failure rather than a choice.

This is, of course, a perfectly good reason to not like what they've done.

I've never understood how that differentiation could be made.

"These are great songs! It's a shame they're not in my very specific type of rock style, or else I wouldn't have to dislike them!"

PJ has never gone too far off the beaten path of their style. I don't really see any of their albums being so bizarre to their fanbase (or at least a fanbase like this one, very knowledgeable about their music) that they'd be unwilling to judge it on the merits. Basically, in other words, I don't think anyone dislikes Backspacer because it's not their style. I think they dislike Backspacer cause they feel it's crappy.

Lament wrote:I think so much of their legacy is because they DID stay together and keep pushing forward, and not because they made culturally significant records (once again, like digster pointed out, it's not these records aren't great, they just weren't impactful).

96583UP wrote:the intense emotion that had been lifting the music into overachieving places that it would not have otherwise gone has evaporated, and what's left, when coupled with their always relatively limited professional musical tool kit, sounds like an ass after 164 slices of american cheese

Lament wrote:I feel like there are two very different, legitimate discussion going on right now, and at some point they're going to mash together into one big ugly, barely understandable blob that ends with everyone being mad at either stip, me, or both.

darth_vedder wrote:

aurynsdad wrote:

Lament wrote:it's not these records aren't great, they just weren't impactful).

They weren't impactful on some people evidently. But I really don't understand how anyone could ever say a record is great AND it doesn't make an impact. What?

No Code is great, but did it make much of an impact? Other than turning off a large chunk of the PJ fan base? I remember people asking if PJ was still around in '96 and '97.

aurynsdad wrote:

96583UP wrote:the intense emotion that had been lifting the music into overachieving places that it would not have otherwise gone has evaporated, and what's left, when coupled with their always relatively limited professional musical tool kit, sounds like an ass after 164 slices of american cheese

I call bullshit. I feel intense emotion listening to many of the songs on Self-Titled, Backspacer, and Lightning Bolt. In fact, these albums contain some of the deepest emotional connections that Ed's lyrics have made with me. They resonate. You are acting like this experience I've had is somehow not legit. That's called being a jerk, but here at RM, "it's herd behavior!"

Varis wrote:Why Go ---> I've Got a Feeling ---> Release ---> Even Flow ---> Black

Who knew that Ten was a concept album all along?

stip wrote:Basically some people are mad/frustrated/disappointed that pearl jam has not made the record they want them to make, and are mistaking this for a failure rather than a choice.

This is, of course, a perfectly good reason to not like what they've done.

aurynsdad wrote:

stip wrote:I agree that they aren't making music as good as they were in their prime. As is the case with basically every band ever.

While I basically agree with this, I do it with the caveat that some of my favorite PJ tunes have come on the albums made after Riot Act. When Pearl Jam is incapable of producing a solid "5" song in my book, that will represent a turning point for me. May they never get there.

Mine wrote:

stip wrote:Basically some people are mad/frustrated/disappointed that pearl jam has not made the record they want them to make, and are mistaking this for a failure rather than a choice.

This is, of course, a perfectly good reason to not like what they've done.

It's not about that. Pearl Jam had many options when it comes to "ageing" but they picked the lowest common denominator that resulted in generic records even if they're enjoyable to some extend. Consider that every time they're defined as a band who's main strength is in their live shows is implied that the music isn't exactly remarkable.