Red Mosquito

Sorry, I see Jorge and Trag said basically the same thing...

Dark Matter sounds far less sterile to me than Mind Your Manners

We'll get a fresh batch of 11 songs.
Some will sound good maybe even great on record.
Some will sound better on the live bootlegs.
A good time for most

RockPusher wrote:Dark Matter sounds far less sterile to me than Mind Your Manners

I just hate pretty much everything about MYM.

It’s almost been relegated to CDM territory.


In no universe should those be mentioned with DM, which is a really good rawk song.

McParadigm wrote:

Clem Halibut wrote:

Strat wrote:someone asked Dave A what he thought of the new single and said "it has whiff of soundgarden to it!" to which dave replied "yea, it has a whiff of something "

Sorry. Who is Dave A ?

Dave Andbusters

Okay...so nobody important.

tragabigzanda wrote:With the exception of Aeroplane, all of McP's examples are of lo-fi, tinny recording that exhibit a ton of charm.

Diary of a Madman was recorded at Ridge Farm Studios.

Jorge wrote:But yeah if the songs are good that overrides everything else

Yup!

Kevin Davis wrote:no real disagreements with any of it. But I would add that, to me at least, there is a significant difference between a recording that is simply imperfect at the source (i.e. your GBV example) and a recording that has been beefed up and polished unnaturally in post-production.

I broadly agree with what you, plat, and trag are saying about it. But I also think we tend to romanticize heavy-handed production decisions if we like the resulting work…if the results pleased us, we see the choices as having a degree of artistic authenticity that isn’t always factual.

Nobody gives two shits that the Beatles switched over from recording their own doubling vocal tracks to using an artificial method that reduced the human imperfections in favor of the lads just generally not wanting to bother. Double tracking was about commercial viability, not artistic vision. It wasn’t a creativity-based decision. And the Beatles jumped on the opportunity to do it with the most artificial means available to them. But we’re not going to bitch about fucking Revolver, because sometimes you just have to grow up and not think about this shit.

First listen after several days. This one still bops.

Clem Halibut wrote:

McParadigm wrote:

Clem Halibut wrote:

Strat wrote:someone asked Dave A what he thought of the new single and said "it has whiff of soundgarden to it!" to which dave replied "yea, it has a whiff of something "

Sorry. Who is Dave A ?

Dave Andbusters

Okay...so nobody important.

Dave A. still whining about Pearl Jam is somehow almost worse than Dave Mustaine still talking about Metallica or Dave Ellefson still talking about Megadeth.
Daves generally suck

They should start a band together and play nothing but Metallica, Megadeth, and Pearl Jam covers.

I love how straight forward the chorus is was written, no attempt at lyrical imagery like “it’s a world wide suicide!” Just a frustrated adult yelling at clouds about the world he’s stuck with.

oneway23 wrote:

Clem Halibut wrote:

McParadigm wrote:

Clem Halibut wrote:

Strat wrote:someone asked Dave A what he thought of the new single and said "it has whiff of soundgarden to it!" to which dave replied "yea, it has a whiff of something "

Sorry. Who is Dave A ?

Dave Andbusters

Okay...so nobody important.

Dave A. still whining about Pearl Jam is somehow almost worse than Dave Mustaine still talking about Metallica or Dave Ellefson still talking about Megadeth.
Daves generally suck

They should start a band together and play noting but Metallica, Megadeth, and Pearl Jam covers.

The Jamily that can't get over the drummer from 20 years ago fits right there too.

McParadigm wrote: Nobody gives two shits that the Beatles switched over from recording their own doubling vocal tracks to using an artificial method that reduced the human imperfections in favor of the lads just generally not wanting to bother. Double tracking was about commercial viability, not artistic vision. It wasn’t a creativity-based decision. And the Beatles jumped on the opportunity to do it with the most artificial means available to them. But we’re not going to bitch about fucking Revolver, because sometimes you just have to grow up and not think about this shit.

But is anyone doing that here? You're right that no one shits on Revolver because of a change in production methods, because the results speak for themselves. I don't think anyone here is saying Dark Matter sounds incredible, but they still have to hate it based on principle due to the way it was made.

I think lo-fi, shitty production can work fine provided it's the right box for what we're listening to; Guided by Voices may not benefit from the production sheen, time and resources that go into a Radiohead album, for example (nor would Radiohead put their best forward with just using a Tascam 4-track), but those choices (even if, in some cases, they weren't a choice at all) elevate what we're hearing.

Trag actually loves the song but he can't get out of his own way

Watching The Darkness guy break down the song, I was thinking that an acoustic version of it could actually be pretty awesome.

i just want to unite the board for a moment by sharing that I prefer Mind Your Manners to Dark Matter

stip wrote:i just want to unite the board for a moment by sharing that I prefer Mind Your Manners to Dark Matter

I'd agree; I think Mind Your Manners ended up being the best song to come out of LB, for me.

stip wrote:i just want to unite the board for a moment by sharing that I prefer Mind Your Manners to Dark Matter

Taking one for the team, eh?

Surely AI can fix this mess.

Dark Manners and Mind Your Matters coming soon.

digster wrote:

McParadigm wrote: Nobody gives two shits that the Beatles switched over from recording their own doubling vocal tracks to using an artificial method that reduced the human imperfections in favor of the lads just generally not wanting to bother. Double tracking was about commercial viability, not artistic vision. It wasn’t a creativity-based decision. And the Beatles jumped on the opportunity to do it with the most artificial means available to them. But we’re not going to bitch about fucking Revolver, because sometimes you just have to grow up and not think about this shit.

But is anyone doing that here? You're right that no one shits on Revolver because of a change in production methods, because the results speak for themselves. I don't think anyone here is saying Dark Matter sounds incredible, but they still have to hate it based on principle due to the way it was made.

I can see how, if one severs that paragraph from the one it was elaborating on directly above it, it can be misread in this way.

Fortunately, that context can be reinserted, and the point can remain what it actually was (“when we like something, we romanticize the reasons for it being the way it is”) and not the misunderstanding version that you describe here (which appears to be “as listeners, we consider the details first, and then selectively admit to liking the content if the details meet the right criteria”).

But I also think we tend to romanticize heavy-handed production decisions if we like the resulting work…if the results pleased us, we see the choices as having a degree of artistic authenticity that isn’t always factual.