Red Mosquito

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I don't believe in the afterlife but I'm also not feeling suicidal. And a few songs on this record seem to challenge the idea of something like an afterlife. So I remain skeptical about that interpretation. I feel pretty confident about the suicide. Could the rest be about an afterlife? Sure, why not? that's not a crazy interpretation or anything.

Yeh. I don't buy the suicide thing.

stip wrote:Regarding the universe not caring--there's a sadness in the music and presentation, a sense of the enormity of it all (which dwarfs the significance of the end of one life). The lyrics seem to speak to the insignificance of the author (we can feel the earth vibrate/changing shape as we all do under its gaze/where we stop no one knows)

The music has nothing to do with the lyrics, which is the story. They weren't even written by the same author. I agree about the insignificance in the lyrics.

stip wrote:The sky growing dark with fallen stars speaks to another life ending, but there's not a moment of rebirth. The yellow moon is already out. And the rest of the imagery in that verse speaks to the finality of death, and the inadequacy of the steps we take to mark it.

I don't agree at all that the "sky growing dark with fallen stars" speaks to another life ending at all. Stars is a plural word. And I also disagree about the rebirth, but this is more of subjective opinion about the 'falling' stars symbolizing flashbacks.

stip wrote:The previous verse is one of the most powerful descriptions of suicide I can recall seeing in a song.

An echo that rings
A bullet unchained
One life, one grave
Joins the parade

I mean he describes the sound of a gunshot and says, literally, that a bullet has just been fired. It's beautifully written, but pretty damn clear.

He describes a sound in the first sentence, the fact that a shot is fired in the second, death in the third and in the fourth joining something "celebratory" (like the afterlife). There's nothing to get suicide from that, but certainly something to get a gun and death. There's also something to be said about the celebratory aspect that you're leaving out. The term parade is typically a positive word.

stip wrote:However, the yellow moon rising seems, at the same time, to be acknowledging this person's existence. We'll give you this one beautiful moment to recognize, even honor, this moment. The way the music swells at all the right places. The way the song demands a response from the universe--even if it's just one death in the grand totality of everything it still requires that someone bear witness (especially the way the vocals swell during the bridge). And so the moon answers. It's the story I hear being told here.

The Yellow Moon rising is from Neil's song, which once again, is a song about a positive place that he longs to return to. To quote you "it's pretty damn clear" (at least to me) it's a song about life, death and a rebirth into a place this person longed to go.

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

IlluminEddie wrote:
The music has nothing to do with the lyrics, which is the story. They weren't even written by the same author.

You're right. Song lyrics never have anything to do with the music that accompanies them.

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:
The music has nothing to do with the lyrics, which is the story. They weren't even written by the same author.

You're right. Song lyrics never have anything to do with the music that accompanies them.

What I'm saying is - the person who wrote the music had one thing in mind when writing it. The person who wrote the lyrics had another. Sure, they could be similar, but probably not. You said the music said X,Y and Z. I am saying the music has nothing to do with what the lyrical message is saying... primarily because... Ed didn't write the music.

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

A lot of things fit when you want them to.

Thejambi wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

A lot of things fit when you want them to.

Agreed. That's why I've mentioned transference several times in this thread.

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:
The music has nothing to do with the lyrics, which is the story. They weren't even written by the same author.

You're right. Song lyrics never have anything to do with the music that accompanies them.

What I'm saying is - the person who wrote the music had one thing in mind when writing it. The person who wrote the lyrics had another. Sure, they could be similar, but probably not. You said the music said X,Y and Z. I am saying the music has nothing to do with what the lyrical message is saying... primarily because... Ed didn't write the music.

Comments like this remind me why I decided to stop having these discussions with you.

plus strat yelled at me to stop.

stip wrote:plus strat yelled at me to stop.

I think we all were

IlluminEddie wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

A lot of things fit when you want them to.

Agreed. That's why I've mentioned transference several times in this thread.

But always about other people.

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:
The music has nothing to do with the lyrics, which is the story. They weren't even written by the same author.

You're right. Song lyrics never have anything to do with the music that accompanies them.

What I'm saying is - the person who wrote the music had one thing in mind when writing it. The person who wrote the lyrics had another. Sure, they could be similar, but probably not. You said the music said X,Y and Z. I am saying the music has nothing to do with what the lyrical message is saying... primarily because... Ed didn't write the music.

Comments like this remind me why I decided to stop having these discussions with you.

Was it "the music" that told you the song was about suicide, stip?

Anyway, responding to a comment about not commenting seems kinda umm, what's the right word...

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

A lot of things fit when you want them to.

Agreed. That's why I've mentioned transference several times in this thread.

But always about other people.

I never claimed to know how the death supposedly occurred. You did.

IlluminEddie wrote:

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

A lot of things fit when you want them to.

Agreed. That's why I've mentioned transference several times in this thread.

But always about other people.

I never claimed to know how the death supposedly occurred. You did.

Uh, I said there were suggestions of suicide, because there are. Suggestions do not mean proof from either of us.

Whose second account is IlluminEddie? Did we ever find out?

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

A lot of things fit when you want them to.

Agreed. That's why I've mentioned transference several times in this thread.

But always about other people.

I never claimed to know how the death supposedly occurred. You did.

Uh, I said there were suggestions of suicide, because there are. Suggestions do not mean proof from either of us.

You are clearly implying this is about Jeremy and the Yellow moon is a clear reference to the lemon yellow sun. Own up to it already.

Thejambi wrote:

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

A lot of things fit when you want them to.

Agreed. That's why I've mentioned transference several times in this thread.

But always about other people.

I never claimed to know how the death supposedly occurred. You did.

Uh, I said there were suggestions of suicide, because there are. Suggestions do not mean proof from either of us.

You are clearly implying this is about Jeremy and the Yellow moon is a clear reference to the lemon yellow sun. Own up to it already.

It's just OBVIOUS. The guitar chords make it plain... just listen to them.

harmless wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

A lot of things fit when you want them to.

Agreed. That's why I've mentioned transference several times in this thread.

But always about other people.

I never claimed to know how the death supposedly occurred. You did.

Uh, I said there were suggestions of suicide, because there are. Suggestions do not mean proof from either of us.

You are clearly implying this is about Jeremy and the Yellow moon is a clear reference to the lemon yellow sun. Own up to it already.

It's just OBVIOUS. The guitar chords make it plain... just listen to them.

Don't drag the music into this. It has nothing to do with the meaning of the song. Oh You're just impossible Harmless you scamp!

Thejambi wrote:

harmless wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

harmless wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

Thejambi wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stip wrote:I think you're giving Neil Young's song way too much authorial voice in this song.

I didn't give Neil Young's song an authorial voice, so to speak. I had no idea the song even existed. Mike McCready said it in an interview while talking about THIS song. Then I looked at both after hearing this and remembering that. The fact that it's the EXACT line used in this song and that song, and one written the Ed's hero, makes it "defined" in my opinion.

nothing from that, literally nothing, indicates that this means the re-appropriation of that lyric requires a slavish devotion to the author's original intent. It's certainly possible, but in absolutely no way is it required.

I'd say it's more than possible, given what I mentioned, it's practical.... and it fits.

A lot of things fit when you want them to.

Agreed. That's why I've mentioned transference several times in this thread.

But always about other people.

I never claimed to know how the death supposedly occurred. You did.

Uh, I said there were suggestions of suicide, because there are. Suggestions do not mean proof from either of us.

You are clearly implying this is about Jeremy and the Yellow moon is a clear reference to the lemon yellow sun. Own up to it already.

It's just OBVIOUS. The guitar chords make it plain... just listen to them.

Don't drag the music into this. It has nothing to do with the meaning of the song. Oh You're just impossible Harmless you scamp!

Yellow Moon is the weakest song on this album.

*disappears into the distance