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Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Thu January 07, 2016 9:23 pm
by Norah
philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:I'm already pissed off about Manny getting snubbed next year.
I think all three of those guys will get in next year. Vladdy's numbers make him a borderline guy, but I think his reputation among guys who don't care about stats will be enough to get him in.
I guess I could see a Manny snub, based primarily on the PED stuff. I think he'll be close though, while Larry Walker, who pretty clearly has a better case, is just hanging around on the ballot with 15%.
I just don't see Manny getting in while Bonds doesn't. Both are confirmed PED cases.
Maybe... I just think a lot of the Bonds/Clemens hate is built around the fact that they were assholes, and the PED thing is a nice and tidy way to keep them out. For some reason, I expect a lot of people to make excuses for Manny
because he wasn't such a dick ("Well Manny was suspended, so he already served his sentence... Bonds and Clemens weren't caught while they were players, so we have to keep them out because this is the only way we can punish them!"
I don't know, I'm probably wrong (or at least I'm overestimating the number of voters who are complete morons) and Manny won't get that much support.
What are you talking about Manny threw an old man down the stairs because he couldn't get tickets.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Thu January 07, 2016 10:04 pm
by philpritchard
cutuphalfdead wrote:philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:I'm already pissed off about Manny getting snubbed next year.
I think all three of those guys will get in next year. Vladdy's numbers make him a borderline guy, but I think his reputation among guys who don't care about stats will be enough to get him in.
I guess I could see a Manny snub, based primarily on the PED stuff. I think he'll be close though, while Larry Walker, who pretty clearly has a better case, is just hanging around on the ballot with 15%.
I just don't see Manny getting in while Bonds doesn't. Both are confirmed PED cases.
Maybe... I just think a lot of the Bonds/Clemens hate is built around the fact that they were assholes, and the PED thing is a nice and tidy way to keep them out. For some reason, I expect a lot of people to make excuses for Manny
because he wasn't such a dick ("Well Manny was suspended, so he already served his sentence... Bonds and Clemens weren't caught while they were players, so we have to keep them out because this is the only way we can punish them!"
I don't know, I'm probably wrong (or at least I'm overestimating the number of voters who are complete morons) and Manny won't get that much support.
What are you talking about Manny threw an old man down the stairs because he couldn't get tickets.
I don't remember that at all. I've always felt like, while a lot of people were frustrated by him or just didn't like him, he always had a bit of a "harmless goofball" air about him (as expressed in the stupid Manny Being Manny stuff in Boston).
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Thu January 07, 2016 10:08 pm
by Norah
philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:I'm already pissed off about Manny getting snubbed next year.
I think all three of those guys will get in next year. Vladdy's numbers make him a borderline guy, but I think his reputation among guys who don't care about stats will be enough to get him in.
I guess I could see a Manny snub, based primarily on the PED stuff. I think he'll be close though, while Larry Walker, who pretty clearly has a better case, is just hanging around on the ballot with 15%.
I just don't see Manny getting in while Bonds doesn't. Both are confirmed PED cases.
Maybe... I just think a lot of the Bonds/Clemens hate is built around the fact that they were assholes, and the PED thing is a nice and tidy way to keep them out. For some reason, I expect a lot of people to make excuses for Manny
because he wasn't such a dick ("Well Manny was suspended, so he already served his sentence... Bonds and Clemens weren't caught while they were players, so we have to keep them out because this is the only way we can punish them!"
I don't know, I'm probably wrong (or at least I'm overestimating the number of voters who are complete morons) and Manny won't get that much support.
What are you talking about Manny threw an old man down the stairs because he couldn't get tickets.
I don't remember that at all. I've always felt like, while a lot of people were frustrated by him or just didn't like him, he always had a bit of a "harmless goofball" air about him (as expressed in the stupid Manny Being Manny stuff in Boston).
It was one of the last straws for him in 2008. He wanted to the traveling secretary and asked for a bunch of tickets the day of and he couldn't come through. So Manny got all "do you know who i am, old man?" and pushed him down the stairs.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Thu January 07, 2016 10:29 pm
by numbers
cutuphalfdead wrote:philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:I'm already pissed off about Manny getting snubbed next year.
I think all three of those guys will get in next year. Vladdy's numbers make him a borderline guy, but I think his reputation among guys who don't care about stats will be enough to get him in.
I guess I could see a Manny snub, based primarily on the PED stuff. I think he'll be close though, while Larry Walker, who pretty clearly has a better case, is just hanging around on the ballot with 15%.
I just don't see Manny getting in while Bonds doesn't. Both are confirmed PED cases.
I'm as big of a Manny guy as there is, but he should get in before Bonds.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Thu January 07, 2016 10:30 pm
by numbers
cutuphalfdead wrote:philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:philpritchard wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:I'm already pissed off about Manny getting snubbed next year.
I think all three of those guys will get in next year. Vladdy's numbers make him a borderline guy, but I think his reputation among guys who don't care about stats will be enough to get him in.
I guess I could see a Manny snub, based primarily on the PED stuff. I think he'll be close though, while Larry Walker, who pretty clearly has a better case, is just hanging around on the ballot with 15%.
I just don't see Manny getting in while Bonds doesn't. Both are confirmed PED cases.
Maybe... I just think a lot of the Bonds/Clemens hate is built around the fact that they were assholes, and the PED thing is a nice and tidy way to keep them out. For some reason, I expect a lot of people to make excuses for Manny
because he wasn't such a dick ("Well Manny was suspended, so he already served his sentence... Bonds and Clemens weren't caught while they were players, so we have to keep them out because this is the only way we can punish them!"
I don't know, I'm probably wrong (or at least I'm overestimating the number of voters who are complete morons) and Manny won't get that much support.
What are you talking about Manny threw an old man down the stairs because he couldn't get tickets.
I don't remember that at all. I've always felt like, while a lot of people were frustrated by him or just didn't like him, he always had a bit of a "harmless goofball" air about him (as expressed in the stupid Manny Being Manny stuff in Boston).
It was one of the last straws for him in 2008. He wanted to the traveling secretary and asked for a bunch of tickets the day of and he couldn't come through. So Manny got all "do you know who i am, old man?" and pushed him down the stairs.
In Manny's defense, I remember reading after that happened that that guy was kind of a douche to the Latin players.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Thu January 07, 2016 10:57 pm
by numbers
Also, especially at the end, you had to take anything the Boston media wrote about Manny with a grain of salt.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Thu January 07, 2016 11:29 pm
by numbers
Wow, I didn't know that Joe DiMaggio needed 3 ballots to make it.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 12:48 am
by Norah
Honestly, my biggest complaint about Manny is his intentional derailment during the 2008 season. If Manny plays hard in 08 for the Red Sox they win the World Series back to back.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 1:27 am
by nyquillyn
The 2016 Modern-Era NFL Finalists:
Morten Andersen, Kicker; Steve Atwater, Safety; Don Coryell, Coach; Terrell Davis, Running Back; Tony Dungy, Coach; Alan Faneca, Guard; Brett Favre, Quarterback; Kevin Greene, Linebacker/Defensive End; Marvin Harrison, Wide Receiver; Joe Jacoby, Tackle; Edgerrin James, Running Back; John Lynch, Free Safety; Terrell Owens, Wide Receiver; Orlando Pace, Tackle; Kurt Warner, Quarterback
Two Senior Finalists:
Ken Stabler, Quarterback; Dick Stanfel, Guard
A Contributor Finalist:
Edward DeBartolo, Jr., Owner
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 1:30 am
by Green Habit
turned2black wrote:The 2016 Modern-Era NFL Finalists:
Morten Andersen, Kicker; Steve Atwater, Safety; Don Coryell, Coach; Terrell Davis, Running Back; Tony Dungy, Coach; Alan Faneca, Guard; Brett Favre, Quarterback; Kevin Greene, Linebacker/Defensive End; Marvin Harrison, Wide Receiver; Joe Jacoby, Tackle; Edgerrin James, Running Back; John Lynch, Free Safety; Terrell Owens, Wide Receiver; Orlando Pace, Tackle; Kurt Warner, Quarterback
Fuck it, I'm seriously homer voting for TD and Atwater after last year was a complete kick in the nuts to Broncos fans. After that? Favre, Warner, and Pace.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 1:41 am
by nyquillyn
As I've said for the last several years, Greene deserves to be in. 3rd all time with 160 sacks.
Also, Favre, Pace and TO are "musts" to me. It'll be interesting to see if Marvin and TO get in together. Or if they wait one year for Harrison.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 1:43 am
by E.H. Ruddock
John Lynch
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 1:49 am
by Green Habit
turned2black wrote:As I've said for the last several years, Greene deserves to be in. 3rd all time with 160 sacks.
Also, Favre, Pace and TO are "musts" to me. It'll be interesting to see if Marvin and TO get in together. Or if they wait one year for Harrison.
TO should wait longer than Harrison, given all the locker rooms he poisoned in his career.
I do agree with you about Greene, though (and feel a bit bad that I'm leaving him off my ballot)
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 2:07 am
by nyquillyn
TO's stats are pretty unfuckwithable. Second in receiving yards, third in TD catches. And a legendary Super Bowl performance on a broken leg. I also kinda doubt most voters will hold his "diva" behavior against him. That's kinda par for the course nowadays for WRs and you might actually say he's a "trendsetter" because of it.
That being said, Harrison had an insane 4-year stretch that was probably the best the NFL has ever seen.
Pretty likely they'll both get in.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 2:24 am
by numbers
cutuphalfdead wrote:Honestly, my biggest complaint about Manny is his intentional derailment during the 2008 season. If Manny plays hard in 08 for the Red Sox they win the World Series back to back.
I felt like they could have just worked through it for the good of the team that year, but understood that it was time.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 2:36 am
by nyquillyn
I'm a Cards fan, but I think Warner has to wait a couple of years. He really only had 6 "good to great" years. He really struggled between those great Rams years and his "comeback" years in AZ. He had 5 shit years. People kinda forget how bad he looked his first couple of years with the Cards.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 3:31 am
by MattA75
Time for my annual "fuck Kurt Warner" in this thread
Favre
Owens
Atwater (I really feel like people truly forget how awesome he was)
Harrison
Pace
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 4:47 pm
by nyquillyn
Has Brian Mitchell not even made a semifinalists list yet? That's crazy to me. Dude was the best special teams player in the NFL for what 10 years. I realize that special teams guys are hard to put in, but he has the stats to back it up. Second in the NFL in total yards behind Rice and 4 season of 2,000 total yards. He deserves to at least be on a semifinalists list.
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 6:09 pm
by @SkitchP
Green Habit wrote:turned2black wrote:As I've said for the last several years, Greene deserves to be in. 3rd all time with 160 sacks.
Also, Favre, Pace and TO are "musts" to me. It'll be interesting to see if Marvin and TO get in together. Or if they wait one year for Harrison.
TO should wait longer than Harrison, given all the locker rooms he poisoned in his career.
I do agree with you about Greene, though (and feel a bit bad that I'm leaving him off my ballot)
Yeah, but didn't Marvin Harrison kill a dude?
Re: Will he be a Hall of Famer?
Posted: Fri January 08, 2016 6:40 pm
by Norah
numbers wrote:cutuphalfdead wrote:Honestly, my biggest complaint about Manny is his intentional derailment during the 2008 season. If Manny plays hard in 08 for the Red Sox they win the World Series back to back.
I felt like they could have just worked through it for the good of the team that year, but understood that it was time.
Not if he wasn't going to play for us. He was intentionally not trying. We got more production out of Jason Bay than Manny was going to give us down the stretch in 08. It's infuriating because the 08 team could have been the best of the era.