Red Mosquito

tree_ wrote:I used to think so, when I was a child. Now, they seem kinda amateurish.

Seem amateurish compared to what?

eddie has some clunky lines but is generally a very strong rock lyricist

Reading out context rock lyrics like they were written poetry is a bad faith exercise, imo. Some of his better songs are being taken out of context ITT, suggesting they are bad. In My Tree is bad? SMH

Ed is substantially above average in the rock world for my tastes. I think he has an extremely high ceiling, but I also think his bottom ten percent is extremely embarrassing.

mkay0 wrote:Reading out context rock lyrics like they were written poetry is a bad faith exercise, imo.

Hard agree.

stip wrote:eddie has some clunky lines but is generally a very strong rock lyricist

I can't believe we are even having to talk about this. Team, he is a GREAT lyricist. Even Stip acknowledges that and he doesn't even like No Code for crying out loud!

We don't have to question everything!

Ed’s true gift is melody. No one can come up with a melody like he does.

wease wrote:Ed’s true gift is melody. No one can come up with a melody like he does.

I don’t think that’s true at all.

I think it’s just the character and timbre of his voice that makes him an interesting vocalist, nothing else really.

Birds in Hell wrote:

mkay0 wrote:Reading out context rock lyrics like they were written poetry is a bad faith exercise, imo.

Hard agree.

me three

Melody wise, Ed often sticks pretty close to the riff of the song

He's got great lyrics and a unique voice
He's one of the best front men ever

River Cross is about as good as lyrics can be.

no code thru riot act he was brilliant, probably my favorite lyricist.

before that he was too angsty and a bit of a try-hard.

since then he's struggled with basic things like cogency, diction and avoiding phrases like, "we all be thinking with our different brains." for every moment of genuine inspiration like DOTC, there are a dozen loose turds like SBWM.

lyrical critiques of recent records (the broad generalizations) surprise me. while i think vitalogy and binaural are the high water marks of his writing his lyrics remain consistent highlights on most records. his two weakest lyrical performances are probably backspacer (which still has great moments) and No Code. Those lyrics have NOT aged well, and almost every theme has been explored with more subtlety and sophistication on later records. there are exceptions - hail hail is a notable exception.

Thinking about it the lyrics of yield are quite a bit of a mixed bag too. the mid to late 90s were not a great period for his writing, some great moments notwithstanding.

there is a tendency (not surprising for song lyrics) for people to conflate or read their thoughts on how a song/performance makes them feel with the lyrics, and that happens a LOT on later albums

stip wrote:lyrical critiques of recent records (the broad generalizations) surprise me. while i think vitalogy and binaural are the high water marks of his writing his lyrics remain consistent highlights on most records. his two weakest lyrical performances are probably backspacer (which still has great moments) and No Code. Those lyrics have NOT aged well, and almost every theme has been explored with more subtlety and sophistication on later records. there are exceptions - hail hail is a notable exception.

Thinking about it the lyrics of yield are quite a bit of a mixed bag too. the mid to late 90s were not a great period for his writing, some great moments notwithstanding.

there is a tendency (not surprising for song lyrics) for people to conflate or read their thoughts on how a song/performance makes them feel with the lyrics, and that happens a LOT on later albums

I'd imagine most PJ fans would say Yield and No Code are quite strong. Which songs do you believe are not great or have aged poorly on those records?

it's true that i have a hard time separating the lyrics on the post-avocado albums from the shame i feel for listening to such bad albums

mkay0 wrote:

stip wrote:lyrical critiques of recent records (the broad generalizations) surprise me. while i think vitalogy and binaural are the high water marks of his writing his lyrics remain consistent highlights on most records. his two weakest lyrical performances are probably backspacer (which still has great moments) and No Code. Those lyrics have NOT aged well, and almost every theme has been explored with more subtlety and sophistication on later records. there are exceptions - hail hail is a notable exception.

Thinking about it the lyrics of yield are quite a bit of a mixed bag too. the mid to late 90s were not a great period for his writing, some great moments notwithstanding.

there is a tendency (not surprising for song lyrics) for people to conflate or read their thoughts on how a song/performance makes them feel with the lyrics, and that happens a LOT on later albums

I'd imagine most PJ fans would say Yield and No Code are quite strong. Which songs do you believe are not great or have aged poorly on those records?

Upon reflection I spoke too soon regarding Yield, though Yield, like many eddie lyrics, still has a few clunkier moments in the writing.

Given To Fly and DTE are well written songs that have a number of memorable moments and images. there are 1-2 lines in DTE that don't land super well.

Brain of J's lyrics do a nice job capturing the feel of the song.

Faithful has a very strong first verse, and the echoes part is nice. The 'we're faithfull/we all believe it' chorus isn't anything great, and the final verse has a bit too much 'angry college atheist' in it

MFC has great verses (especially the second), but not a great chorus.

In Hiding is an immature set of lyrics, with a pretty good pre chorus.

Push Me Pull Me is another one that doesn't hold up against scrutiny. A little too 'high in my college dorm'.

Wishlist is a fantastic set of lyrics from top to bottom.

I think that's everything, right? - I forgot how much of Yield he didn't write. So there are some nice moments on the album, but its pretty middle of the pack as far as his writing goes. On par with something like Vs. But Ten, Vitalogy, Riot Act, Binaural, and Lightning Bolt (generally the albums that have the best lyrics) are ahead of it. It has stronger writing than S/T, Backspacer, and No Code.

Re: No Code - Hail Hail is an extremely well written song (though even there some moments dont land super well. but they are offset by some stunning lyrical phrases).. Sometimes, Red Mosquito, and Around the Bend are solid. Habit has nice verses but that terrible chorus. Off He Goes is some of the worst, most ridiculously self-indulgent writing in the catalog. Present Tense and I'm Open are overwrought, over the top explorations of themes he does a much better job exploring when he hits middle age. In My Tree has its moments - it covers pretty similar ground to In Hiding, but does so much better. Really dislike the mumbled nonsense in the bridge though. And Who You Are is kinda fun for what it is as long as you promise not to take it seriously. If you do it mostly falls apart.

Eddie is really trying to convey wisdom earned from experience on that album, but for the most part he hasn't found the vocabulary for it yet - almost all those themes are explored far more effectively on later albums.

This is just a comment on lyrics, btw.