Red Mosquito

PHATJ wrote:

stip wrote:

Kevin Davis wrote:"In Hiding" is a good example of below average lyrics getting a pass because they don't demand any attention -- it's easy enough to turn off the meaning of Eddie's words and just sort of roll along with the music of them, which complements the guitar chords very nicely. But I don't think they're good lyrics -- not pretentious necessarily, just kind of vapid and badly written. "I shut and locked the front door, no way in or out" -- just because you lock your door doesn't mean there's "no way out" of your house, Ed. It's essentially a five minute "story" about him doing nothing -- not especially gripping stuff. I love the song, but I understand the criticisms of the lyrics.

Vote for "Brain of J."

My issue with these lyrics (and much of the lyrical writing post vitalogy) is that I don't think Eddie sees these as minor lyrics. I think there is wisdom he is proud of and wants to share. They demand attention, and don't offer anything particularly poetic or insightful for your time. It's not like go or got some, songs with weak lyrics that are just there because Eddie needs to be singing something, and do can be ignored. Eddie writes better when he asks questions, not when he has answers

I totally agree with that statement. "Insightful" Eddie is kind of boring.

stip wrote:

Kevin Davis wrote:"In Hiding" is a good example of below average lyrics getting a pass because they don't demand any attention -- it's easy enough to turn off the meaning of Eddie's words and just sort of roll along with the music of them, which complements the guitar chords very nicely. But I don't think they're good lyrics -- not pretentious necessarily, just kind of vapid and badly written. "I shut and locked the front door, no way in or out" -- just because you lock your door doesn't mean there's "no way out" of your house, Ed. It's essentially a five minute "story" about him doing nothing -- not especially gripping stuff. I love the song, but I understand the criticisms of the lyrics.

Vote for "Brain of J."

My issue with these lyrics (and much of the lyrical writing post vitalogy) is that I don't think Eddie sees these as minor lyrics. I think there is wisdom he is proud of and wants to share. They demand attention, and don't offer anything particularly poetic or insightful for your time. It's not like go or got some, songs with weak lyrics that are just there because Eddie needs to be singing something, and do can be ignored. Eddie writes better when he asks questions, not when he has answers

stip wrote:and it's clearly a message song, which draws attention to the lyrics. Same issue with Off He goes, though in hiding lyrics are worse

tragabigzanda wrote:

digster wrote:I'm going with Brain of J this year; it's a perfect meld of Yield's poppier sensibilities and the band's Go/Last Exit aggressive side. However, I do find all this ragging on In Hiding pretty distressing; it's a hell of a song.

I think In Hiding is musically fantastic, but it's all ruined by some pretty embarassing lyrics.

ABNorman wrote:Is it just me that's never let my knowledge of Ed the person affect my interpretation of Pearl Jam's songs? With In Hiding and Off He Goes, I've never seen them as a Vedder-POV, but small tales of characters I recognise very well.

durdencommatyler wrote:

ABNorman wrote:Is it just me that's never let my knowledge of Ed the person affect my interpretation of Pearl Jam's songs? With In Hiding and Off He Goes, I've never seen them as a Vedder-POV, but small tales of characters I recognise very well.

No, you're not the only one. In fact, I was surprised when I started seeing that people felt differently. It always though it was pretty obvious that these were character songs and not autobiographical.

tragabigzanda wrote:

ABNorman wrote:Is it just me that's never let my knowledge of Ed the person affect my interpretation of Pearl Jam's songs? With In Hiding and Off He Goes, I've never seen them as a Vedder-POV, but small tales of characters I recognise very well.

The narrator ends In Hiding still in hiding, despite being "enlightened", so it feels to me like the ramblings of an addict escaping the world, feeling enlightened, and failing to act in any meaningful way. The soaring high note of "hiding" takes on an aftertaste of paranoia and inaction in what I think is a great juxtaposition.

Also, I love "I swallowed my face just to keep from biting"

Can't speak for others, but I've never been able to divorce Ed's personality from the music. I had a major boner for Ed when I first discovered him as a kid, and I've been wrestling with that ever since.

stip wrote:

Kevin Davis wrote:"In Hiding" is a good example of below average lyrics getting a pass because they don't demand any attention -- it's easy enough to turn off the meaning of Eddie's words and just sort of roll along with the music of them, which complements the guitar chords very nicely. But I don't think they're good lyrics -- not pretentious necessarily, just kind of vapid and badly written. "I shut and locked the front door, no way in or out" -- just because you lock your door doesn't mean there's "no way out" of your house, Ed. It's essentially a five minute "story" about him doing nothing -- not especially gripping stuff. I love the song, but I understand the criticisms of the lyrics.

Vote for "Brain of J."

My issue with these lyrics (and much of the lyrical writing post vitalogy) is that I don't think Eddie sees these as minor lyrics. I think there is wisdom he is proud of and wants to share. They demand attention, and don't offer anything particularly poetic or insightful for your time. It's not like go or got some, songs with weak lyrics that are just there because Eddie needs to be singing something, and do can be ignored. Eddie writes better when he asks questions, not when he has answers

durdencommatyler wrote:

stip wrote:

Kevin Davis wrote:"In Hiding" is a good example of below average lyrics getting a pass because they don't demand any attention -- it's easy enough to turn off the meaning of Eddie's words and just sort of roll along with the music of them, which complements the guitar chords very nicely. But I don't think they're good lyrics -- not pretentious necessarily, just kind of vapid and badly written. "I shut and locked the front door, no way in or out" -- just because you lock your door doesn't mean there's "no way out" of your house, Ed. It's essentially a five minute "story" about him doing nothing -- not especially gripping stuff. I love the song, but I understand the criticisms of the lyrics.

Vote for "Brain of J."

My issue with these lyrics (and much of the lyrical writing post vitalogy) is that I don't think Eddie sees these as minor lyrics. I think there is wisdom he is proud of and wants to share. They demand attention, and don't offer anything particularly poetic or insightful for your time. It's not like go or got some, songs with weak lyrics that are just there because Eddie needs to be singing something, and do can be ignored. Eddie writes better when he asks questions, not when he has answers

I agree with your final sentence. But the rest of it...? I don't understand. Feels a little bit like the Stip version of "I don't like it so it's part of the PRAMG." You don't like the song so it's feigned wisdom that Ed's proud of? There's no way you can know that. So why assume it? What about the lyrics make you think Ed is especially proud of them and they aren't minor as opposed to the songs you mentioned, that you happen to like, that you can say don't fit this mold? Seems weird, man.

tragabigzanda wrote:

PHATJ wrote:

stip wrote:

Kevin Davis wrote:"In Hiding" is a good example of below average lyrics getting a pass because they don't demand any attention -- it's easy enough to turn off the meaning of Eddie's words and just sort of roll along with the music of them, which complements the guitar chords very nicely. But I don't think they're good lyrics -- not pretentious necessarily, just kind of vapid and badly written. "I shut and locked the front door, no way in or out" -- just because you lock your door doesn't mean there's "no way out" of your house, Ed. It's essentially a five minute "story" about him doing nothing -- not especially gripping stuff. I love the song, but I understand the criticisms of the lyrics.

Vote for "Brain of J."

My issue with these lyrics (and much of the lyrical writing post vitalogy) is that I don't think Eddie sees these as minor lyrics. I think there is wisdom he is proud of and wants to share. They demand attention, and don't offer anything particularly poetic or insightful for your time. It's not like go or got some, songs with weak lyrics that are just there because Eddie needs to be singing something, and do can be ignored. Eddie writes better when he asks questions, not when he has answers

I totally agree with that statement. "Insightful" Eddie is kind of boring.

I'm also a fan of Ed in storytelling mode (Elderly Woman, Daughter, Unemployable, etc). But most of Ed's insights used to feel profound when I was 15, but now not so much.

Strat wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

ABNorman wrote:Is it just me that's never let my knowledge of Ed the person affect my interpretation of Pearl Jam's songs? With In Hiding and Off He Goes, I've never seen them as a Vedder-POV, but small tales of characters I recognise very well.

No, you're not the only one. In fact, I was surprised when I started seeing that people felt differently. It always though it was pretty obvious that these were character songs and not autobiographical.

I'm a bit of both sides. I dont think the writer can completely detach himself from his character. At least i dont think Vedder can/has.

durdencommatyler wrote:

stip wrote:

Kevin Davis wrote:"In Hiding" is a good example of below average lyrics getting a pass because they don't demand any attention -- it's easy enough to turn off the meaning of Eddie's words and just sort of roll along with the music of them, which complements the guitar chords very nicely. But I don't think they're good lyrics -- not pretentious necessarily, just kind of vapid and badly written. "I shut and locked the front door, no way in or out" -- just because you lock your door doesn't mean there's "no way out" of your house, Ed. It's essentially a five minute "story" about him doing nothing -- not especially gripping stuff. I love the song, but I understand the criticisms of the lyrics.

Vote for "Brain of J."

My issue with these lyrics (and much of the lyrical writing post vitalogy) is that I don't think Eddie sees these as minor lyrics. I think there is wisdom he is proud of and wants to share. They demand attention, and don't offer anything particularly poetic or insightful for your time. It's not like go or got some, songs with weak lyrics that are just there because Eddie needs to be singing something, and do can be ignored. Eddie writes better when he asks questions, not when he has answers

I agree with your final sentence. But the rest of it...? I don't understand. Feels a little bit like the Stip version of "I don't like it so it's part of the PRAMG." You don't like the song so it's feigned wisdom that Ed's proud of? There's no way you can know that. So why assume it? What about the lyrics make you think Ed is especially proud of them and they aren't minor as opposed to the songs you mentioned, that you happen to like, that you can say don't fit this mold? Seems weird, man.

Got Some

Got Some picks up right where Gonna See My Friend leaves off. When Eddie sings that he’s ‘got some’, he’s referring to the charged sense of purpose and electrifying sense of personal satisfaction discovered at the start of the record. Got Some tries to make public what was, for all its energy and intensity, the private moment documented in GSMF. It’s pretty successful overall, but it’s not perfect.

Musically they nail it. The song rockets out the gate with a sense of frenzied commitment that matches GSMF, and is fitting for the pleading urgency of the song (they cut it off suddenly, but this makes sense given what the song is trying to do). The brassy sound of the guitars give the start of the song an aura of self-importance, and the way the music rises and falls between its puzzled verses (reflecting the confused and lost state of the person the song is being sung to) and the urgent declarations to lean on the singer, to find within him the strength to carry on, is pretty masterfully done (with quick, well done transitions between the two that reflect the emotional journey in the song). Other than the initial start there is an understated quality to Got Some that is designed to both create a kind of interpersonal intimacy that is unusual for a song like this, and of course to build up to and highlight the explosive climax (starting with the foreboding bridge and moving into the extra energy during the final verses and climax, and the terrific outro. My only issue with the music is that given how the song holds itself back for so long its final thoughts deserve to be longer—another 20 seconds of music after Eddie’s final Let’s Go would have been perfect.

Had Eddie been a bit stronger here vocally the ending might not have felt like such a tease, but after the fire and fury of GSMF he sounds flat here, almost weak. I think he’s going for weathered survivor, but it’s a little too weak to work here (it’s more effective in Force of Nature). Maybe he has trouble mixing that approach with the fact that he’s essentially begging here, but regardless I was hoping for something that hit harder. In a lot of Ways Got Some is a sister song to Save You, and it has some of the same vocal problems. In Save You Eddie sounds weary—like he’s had this conversation a million times before and can barely be troubled to have it again (one of the things that makes that song interesting is the tension between the understated vocals and the more aggressive music). He doesn’t sound weary in Got Some, but he does sound thin—exhausted even. It’s possible, even probable that this was a deliberate choice (I’d assume it was given the energy in the 3 songs that surround it)—as if his commitment is measured in how much of himself he’s given (the return of the martyr Eddie of Given To Fly). Given the pleading tone of the song this choice is understandable. The singer in Save You spends much of the song singing to himself, steeling himself for what is likely to be yet another fruitless confrontation. The singer in Got Some is clearly addressing the song to someone else—they’re there in the room with him, and he’s gripping them by the arm begging them to be strong, and to find that strength from within him if need be. The subtle backing vocal harmonies nicely color in the sense that there’s someone there, someone listening, and that they’re in this together.

But while this approach makes sense artistically it’s also somewhat underwhelming. Save you has the same problem. Though the vocal choices are what the song may need they’re just not as much fun to listen to. Had he really gone for broke vocally during the final moments of Got Some (as he does at the end of Save You ) it would have been worth it—the restraint pays off with the release of the bottled up intensity—but that doesn’t really happen here. At least not as much as I’d prefer. When Eddie screams ‘Please let me help you help yourself!’ through gritted teeth you celebrate him finally breaking through his own reluctance. The ‘carry on, lets go!’ at the end of Got Some just doesn’t hit as hard, especially coming on the heels of GSMF.

If Got Some was more interesting lyrically this might not be a problem, but the lyrics to Got Some are probably the weakest Eddie’s ever written (and a noticeable step down on an album that is otherwise pretty solid in that department). Part of the lyrical simplicity is to keep drawing attention to the offer and promise ‘got some if you need it’ but the stuff that surrounds it is just not that interesting. I could probably try and dig some deeper analysis out of the ‘precipitation verses, but it’s hardly worth it. Fortunately this isn’t a song that pauses long enough for the lyrics to ever really matter. Some songs need to be well written and this is not one of them, but it’s still a little disappointing, especially since Eddie’s performance could use the boost that a well crafted line provides.

Having said that, Got Some is still an effective song—my criticism is that while Got Some is a good song, it could have and should have been a great song. The music is strong the message is clear, and this forms an important part of the initial trilogy of songs that define the mood and tone of the record—finding peace and satisfaction within yourself and turning it outwards—using it as fuel for a fire rather than a blanket against the cold.