Red Mosquito

Birds in Hell wrote:

ridleybradout wrote:

Strat wrote:I listened to this the other day. What a frustrating record. What it boils down to for me is that they can't fucking perform it live. ITs a trainwreck. Ed sounds brutal, songs like infallible completely fall flat, and songs like getaway and yellow moon really show just how bland the music is.

It wasn't all bad - give this a listen:

http://forums.theskyiscrape.com/viewtop ... =17&t=4044

Listening to this compilation unfortunately just underscored for me how weak a collection of songs this is.

What a pisser.

(No knock on your efforts, Brad, of course.)

Why would you knock on Brad's efforts like that

No offense taken. As they say, a polished turd is still a turd right?

I think the opening Pendulum > MYM run is a pretty strong run of songs, it's just a shame that they haven't yet come close to nailing my two enduring faves from the record (MFS and SW).

Strat wrote:I listened to this the other day. What a frustrating record. What it boils down to for me is that they can't fucking perform it live. ITs a trainwreck. Ed sounds brutal, songs like infallible completely fall flat, and songs like getaway and yellow moon really show just how bland the music is.

It's weird though because I mostly enjoy them on the record but knowing they can't perform them live makes it obvious of all the studio trickery to make average songs sound good. I can't imagine one of those songs was done with a full band take. Too many instrumental and vocal punch ins to have any organic nature to the record. It is annoying.

So, yea.

You're entitled to your opinion of course but I don't agree on judging an album by how it's performed live. First off, I don't think that Infallible sounds flat or Yellow Moon is bland live. Well, Getaway yes because it's downtuned. It's just not the same song unless it's performed in the same key as in studio (and the promotional video). However, if I start basing my opinion of albums on how they are performed live then Ten started sucking after 94. Black, Jeremy, etc. have never been the same since the 94 tour. Not even close. That doesn't mean the songs themselves, especially the way they were recorded, are suddenly not great. It means the band stopped giving great performances of those songs. Those are separate things. Pearl Jam rarely ever improves or even matches studio renditions live nowadays. They can approach the quality of the studio take on a good night, but that's about it. From 92-94, this wasn't the case. And I don't mind the live decline as long as they don't half ass it in studio. I want every song to be the best possible version of it in studio so when I get my hands on the album, it sounds as good as it can. Full band takes and organic sound is something I couldn't care less about. If a song sounds better with some vocal overdubs or other studio effects, then I'm all for it.

Release_Me wrote:

Strat wrote:I listened to this the other day. What a frustrating record. What it boils down to for me is that they can't fucking perform it live. ITs a trainwreck. Ed sounds brutal, songs like infallible completely fall flat, and songs like getaway and yellow moon really show just how bland the music is.

It's weird though because I mostly enjoy them on the record but knowing they can't perform them live makes it obvious of all the studio trickery to make average songs sound good. I can't imagine one of those songs was done with a full band take. Too many instrumental and vocal punch ins to have any organic nature to the record. It is annoying.

So, yea.

You're entitled to your opinion of course but I don't agree on judging an album by how it's performed live. First off, I don't think that Infallible sounds flat or Yellow Moon is bland live. Well, Getaway yes because it's downtuned. It's just not the same song unless it's performed in the same key as in studio (and the promotional video). However, if I start basing my opinion of albums on how they are performed live then Ten started sucking after 94. Black, Jeremy, etc. have never been the same since the 94 tour. Not even close. That doesn't mean the songs themselves, especially the way they were recorded, are suddenly not great. It means the band stopped giving great performances of those songs. Those are separate things. Pearl Jam rarely ever improves or even matches studio renditions live nowadays. They can approach the quality of the studio take on a good night, but that's about it. From 92-94, this wasn't the case. And I don't mind the live decline as long as they don't half ass it in studio. I want every song to be the best possible version of it in studio so when I get my hands on the album, it sounds as good as it can. Full band takes and organic sound is something I couldn't care less about. If a song sounds better with some vocal overdubs or other studio effects, then I'm all for it.

They used to be absolutely stellar as a live-in-the-studio unit. For me, it adds something for a band like this. Then, I don't mind the vocal overdubs or the odd punch-in punch-out in the studio but when you're PJ, at least try to cut your songs when you're all in the same room, especially when Ed pretends he chooses songs or arrangements by the way he thinks it'll be handled live.

I can see how that's important to people. I just don't understand how you can actually like an album upon listening to it and then suddenly realise the songs weren't really worth liking because their live renditions aren't very good. If you flat out didn't like the songs when you listened to the album, that's another matter. But to say you've changed your feelings for the album based on how it translates live? I guess maybe the live show is a bigger part of people's PJ experience than it is mine.

Note: I've never seen them live nor will I, because of my geographical location.

I don't really know or claim to know how LB was recorded. But to a layman, it doesn't appear to be something that couldn't have been recorded with a full band take and then some studio editing later on to add to it or refine it. Obviously, if there's some clear information out there which points to this not being the case, I'm simply unaware of it. Maybe that's how it is in this day and age when music isn't the only thing they have to deal with. Maybe convenience factors in during the studio recordings, I don't know. It just doesn't detract from my listening experience, personally.

Birds in Hell wrote:

ridleybradout wrote:

Strat wrote:I listened to this the other day. What a frustrating record. What it boils down to for me is that they can't fucking perform it live. ITs a trainwreck. Ed sounds brutal, songs like infallible completely fall flat, and songs like getaway and yellow moon really show just how bland the music is.

It wasn't all bad - give this a listen:

http://forums.theskyiscrape.com/viewtop ... =17&t=4044

Listening to this compilation unfortunately just underscored for me how weak a collection of songs this is.

What a pisser.

(No knock on your efforts, Brad, of course.)

For my part, I absolutely love this version and think that (apart from the difficulty on MFS and SW) it's light years better than the actual record. It also really dramatically helps me understand the production problems with LB and how they hold the album back.

My enduring feeling on this album is that the fact it came so close to being a good one makes it even more frustrating, and thus even worse.

The bits I like, I like, but I just have little to no desire to hear it anymore.

That's a nice compilation

Well, the few songs I've had time to listen to so far. They translate well

I really like the version of LTRP on that live comp. A bit more angular, while still keeping the swing of the studio version. Less effected vocals from Eddie, obviously.

So now you guys don't like it anymore? Jesus. Why were you giving me shit before? It takes you guys weeks to figure out what I knew after a few listens. How is that possible?

Well, there's a word for it: 'subjectivity.'

That live comp was really good, and as much as I like the studio version of infallible I wish they went in a darker direction based on that live version

And sleeping by myself should have been a single

wow..poster artist god, Dan McCarthy has a print form 2011 called yellow moon on the rise...it's a beauty too
http://expressobeans.com/public/detail.php/136995#

Possibly unwisely, I'm following up my Moonlander listen with my first full spin of this in a long time.

It's still strange that Brendan's keys seem like loudest thing in the mix on almost every song they appear, particularly Lightning Bolt and Infallible. Was that not an issue when they were mixing? It doesn't really do the songs any favours.

I still like Mind Your Manners and My Father's Son quite a bit, those two together are definitely the highpoint of the record. It's a pretty thankless slog thereafter.

One of the biggest stumbling blocks I have with the album, and from memory it's much the same on Backspacer, is the amount of post-recording gloss that's been applied to the guitar tracks. Mike's guitars in Sleeping by Myself and Yellow Moon, for instance, seem to be swimming with additional reverb and modulation added after the fact - and it's much the same everywhere else.

Oh god, Future Days just started and it's worse here than ever; tinkle-tinkle pixie dust on everything.

I just got a new car stereo and was listening to this on the way home. Obviously everything sounded better because it was on a better stereo, but it's hard not to listen to this album and hear the way the production is not serving the songs. I still think this is one of their best crop of raw songs.

I'm almost with spenno here regarding everything after lightning bolt